Forums Kongregate

Calm Down.

22 posts

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I have to admit, I was gone from Kongregate for a couple months and I came back to a “community” that saw humour in spam and flamewars. Since when was this ever the meaning of community?

Maybe you guys weren’t around back earlier in the year or even before that, but the community thrived off of people acting like people. It was really fascinating to see people take off the mask of the internet, and enjoy each other for who they really were. It was quite the remarkable experience, having people dislodged from their normal defensive posture to a more kind, relaxed state. Programmers and gamers alike could hang out, enjoy the company of one another in a safe and friendly environment.

But it feels like the storms of popularity have dragged in a bunch of naysayers to the community here. While I embrace the quality and livelihood of the site, I was appalled by some of the behavior of people I once knew to be kind, courteous individuals.

The internet is a tangle of wars, one-upping, and having the upper edge. It would seem right with protocol that Kongregate would have to follow suit, but can we avoid it?

I concur with the idea that we cannot stop spammers, link dumpers, trolling, or any other malicious activities. It’s just impossible given the open nature of the site and it’s popularity. But it can be avoided by the users who visit here frequently. I just want everyone to have the same amazing Kongregate experience I had when I used to visit here frequently.

I brought together some points that I saw that could be put to use. Whether or not these are the hard and fast rules of Kongregate, I feel that anyone who wants to be part of the real community here should follow them. I hate to be cliche, but what you put in is what you get out of it.

People don’t care if you can kick someone’s ass. There’s really no need to get in fights with people. The internet has always been all talk and no action, so don’t feel the need to jump into a fight. If someone is trolling for fights, they really have no life. Seriously, why would you even respond to them? They spend their day trying to get people worked up, instead of actually using the site for what it was created for.

Leave comments that address the Flash or the author in a constructive way. I have seen so many “this game sucks” comments, with little reason as to why it sucks. And give solutions! Critique demands suggestions for correction, and only telling people problems leaves a lot to be desired. Me being a programmer myself, I know that someone saying, “I hate the wind” means very little to me. Do you hate it because it’s not real enough, or do you hate it because it’s too difficult for you to beat? It’s a real pain wading through terrible comments to pick out the prime ones!

Don’t hate Greg. You giving him bullshit is just part of the thousands of people who blame all the community problems on him. If you have an issue, bring it up in the forums, or talk about in the chatroom. You may be the only one with the problem, or it may not even be a problem at all! It is also not your job to tell people whether or not Greg is a good person. You probably don’t even know Greg if you are spreading stupid things about him. He has one of the hardest jobs on this site, dealing with half of the morons who need some power struggle to deal with in order to feel satisfied with themselves.

You are not a robot. You do not need to flood the chat with every decision you make in life. We don’t need to know about you being 3/4 done with your slice of pizza or that you wiped your face with a napkin. Make some conversation that people want to interact with. “Does anyone watch baseball?” “Hey, did you see that latest game out?” It makes sense to people to want to be part of the community when its not all about you.

Arguments require people to listen and comprehend a conversation. It’s not always about defending your point to the bitter end, even when you know that your point could have some flaws given the other’s arguement. Yes, Xbox360 has the red ring, Nintendo has crappy graphics, and PS3 is too expensive. If you are willing to listen and take in other people’s opinions, you’ll just be that much closer to enjoying Kongregate instead of feeling like Nintendo will cut off your thumbs if you can’t persuade someone that they are better. And when you are argue, are you arguing against the person or the topic? People seem to escalate conversation from “PS3 is l33t” to “your stupid” in about three seconds flat. Honestly, have a little backbone.

I am not bitter, just merely frightened at how much Kongregate’s community has forgotten it’s humility and record of kindness. The intent of a community is to exist together in a beneficial way, not to find ways to slam each other into rocks. I hope people will embrace the idea of treating people as kindly as they hope to be treated. The people who really make a difference here are those who decide to be great contributors instead of the dead weight tugging Kongregate back from it’s full potential. I want to see Kongregate do it’s best, and it’s up to the regulars here to make it that way.

-John

 
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aah, yknow I agree, I wish the internet didn’t have people hiding upon masks, but people in actual conversations, and I do have to admit seeing tags that flood with curse words and such is annoying.

People seem to have a false sense of security when online, that no matter what they say it won’t ever matter if they ever offend anyone, because its only the internet and you don’t actually have to deal with them.

Things people need to understand is the internet memes get boring and old.. there was never any reason to curse, you can say any sentence without a curse word and it would pretty much sound fine, arguing over the internet gets nobody anywhere, and people should just enjoy being a part of a cohesive community that seems extremely close. Our Kong family can have squabbles but hey we can still be a family..

 
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I have been here for a while and I have done my fair share of things I should not have done, I have changed (I think, Right?) and I love kongregate. I think we should make this site invite only, Just a theory I am afraid there are many flaws however. 1 idiot gets in and multiplies by 10 so on so forth… I thank you john for bringing this to the attention of the great people of kong. It is 4 am and I am going to hibernate… at some point.

 
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Thanks John for putting that so eloquently. Here’s hoping the Kongregators take it to heart.

 
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I think you’re right, nicely put. I would say more but I’m tired at the moment :)

 
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Get a coffee, arcane.

jmtb02, your “Dicko is a silly Australian” post… lolz…

Anyway, I do agree with John Coolie (For not fixing the problem at your forums :P) and hilariously, I see a lot of spam. Sure, I contributed a bit… Like Greg Month but didn’t know it became a phenomenon and a picture about Greg being king, but that’s all. Maybe all those Dicko stuff made me… spammy. Blame John Coolie :P

 
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‘* bows down in deep admiration of jmtb02 * Seriously, all I can say is that you’re absolutely right.

JudeMaverick, while that whole greg month thing might be useless and spam, it is in my eyes not bad spam. It’s not spam for the sake of spamming, it is simply a few people being a little crazy and having a little fun worshipping greg, as well he should be. :-p So in my eyes, that thread is not spam, nor is it attached (sorry, my 1337 English skills seem to be on a vacation) to what jmtb02 said about spam. But that is of course solely my own personal opinion.

 
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I for one do not understand why the Off-topic section became the spamming section. The off-topic section should be about stuff that’s not Kongregate, games, music, art or programming, like sports, television, philosophy (on the internet?) but not spam.

While I’m at it, the games forum seems to be barely about game discussion. It’s more about walkthroughs than anything (why the heck is the COCAK thread there anyway?), and there will always be somebody who will ask “omg how do i get teh badge/card” immediately when a new challenge/achievement comes out. This is particularly annoying because I personally think that they have all up to now been rather easy, so it makes me think that the general skill level of most gamers is going down to drain (along with the games, which is probably the reason) even though I am still relatively young.
Yes, I know I rant about this a lot. Doesn’t make it wrong.

 
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I completely agree with you there, John.Even I have to admit I was a bit of an arsehole sometimes (aka the time where I petitioned), the main reason I did that is…er…crud, I forgot. Let’s just say that the sense of urgency came, right?

(why the heck is the COCAK thread there anyway?)

Cocak’s into Kongregate Gaming, you know, so it’ll be better over there than than here, which is used to discuss about other Kongregaty stuff.

 
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jmtb: This was one of the best forum posts I have read in a long while here and I could not agree more.

Leave comments that address the Flash or the author in a constructive way. I have seen so many “this game sucks” comments, with little reason as to why it sucks.

For me, this is one of the greatest problems of Kongregate right now. In the beginning of Kongregate getting feedback from the players was incredibly valuable (even if harsh sometimes) for developers. Now every second comment is something like “Your game sucks/rocks” without any whatsoever hint why.

So here’s a suggestion/feature request for Kongregate: Put a very short disclaimer/how-to-comment guide above the comment form that states something like: “Try to be constructive in your feedback. If you don’t like the game, say why. If you do like the game, also do.” Then at least people would know what kind of feedback is appreciated within the community.

 
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I am happy to admit that I am PERFECT!!!!!

Really Though, I’ll admit I went along with the whole MrCredsAlex thing when It came along, and I’ve made my share of spam.

Thanks for the Awesome post, and for visiting Kongregate after so long.

 
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The off-topic has a loop-hole, my dear friend. You can post about ANYTHING!

 
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John, bless you. The last few drama filled days here have left me too tired and frustrated to type any deep thoughts so I’ll just agree with yours. I think Kongregate has the potential to be one of the greatest communities on the internet and watching people mess with it just for laughs drives me crazy. I have met so many amazing people here and played so many amazing games and am so proud to be a part of it… I would like to keep it that way.

PS. also, I like the wind… it’s hard as all get out, but a very cool addition :P

 
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But the MrcredsAlex thing was a bit different. I mean, it was not necessarily a spam war but merely a way of self-expression, if you can skew your vision to that. Some people might have thought the work sucked, but really, I thought it was some of the most hilarious work I have seen, and I wasn’t the only one. The defining characteristic of spam is that no one wants it around, and no one wanted to see it.

What draws people to the kongregate community is word-of-mouth, and what keeps them here is their ability to integrate with the community. If you want the terrible people to stay, act terrible! If you want the nice, kind people to stay, the community will tend to go in that direction. Kongregate is young enough that the persona of the site can rapidly fluctuate if we choose to alter it.

 
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Thank you or putting so much time into your post John! You’ve summed up all the things I’ve been thinking of, because this site has really changed since the time I signed up in January.
And for the off-topic section of the forums, I used to post there frequently, getting into the fun of the forum games and such. Now it’s just a way for people, who have sudden urges, to just put whatever the heck they feel into a topic. Looking at the off-topic section right now I see a few “unneeded” topics; “WTF is this?” “Who is dxrules63” “pure retards”. The internet is full of idiots, hopefully we can change them.

 
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So John, thank you for this post, and thank you all for caring so much about the feel of the Kongregate community. The best part of working on Kong has been getting to hang out on the site so much, and I want that to last.

I think there’s a lot we can do on our end to help put things back on the right track — from a system to prevent the tags from being spammed, better tools for mods, maybe a way to let developers thank users for helpful feedback, and something along the lines of what Pixelate suggested. We’d appreciate any ideas/suggestions that you guys have.

 
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I don’t know if there’s a need for better mod tools (obviously :-p), but the rest of your suggestions, including pixelates, would in my opinion be very beneficial and useful on Kongregate. Especially keeping the tags from being spammed, as they have been for months.

 
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I agree with jmtb’s post. I think Kongregate’s community has changed since I joined 2 1/2 months ago. I think all of the flaming and trolling needs to stop. I think things that are off-topic are okay to talk about, as long as there is a point to it. My idea of spam is just typing random letters for no reason with no point whatsoever. Things like greg month at least have a point to it, and GREG OWNS!!! Anyway, Kongregate is still a fun site, and we should make sure our community still has fun people too.

 
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Wow man. Just… wow. Yeah, I remember all that. I was a part of it, ‘till my account was hacked. Man… Kongregate has become more of a Newgroundsish website. I think we most of us that joined in the Alpha could agree. Developers and gamers alike could be more active and all. Now it’s just… “I hopies u looz”, “mrcreds ftw”, “toastiesnmuffins”.

I also have to point out a few user’s who aren’t doing their part: Nqkoi1, MrcredsAlex, Crushproof (partly, what with all the bullying), and many more. We should all try to follow examples set by Sylicas, JudeMaverick (sort of), Malachi, FRAGM3NT, jmtb02, etc.

I hope I can be added to that list.

 
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@Emily, I don’t think those tools are even necessary if the community becomes strong enough to take its own lead in behavior. Although they seem logical to start us in that direction. Communities depend on the ability to self-moderate instead of always fear an administrative power. I see this in Newgrounds all the time, where people become scared to even reply to a post due to the quality of the user.

 
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Somebody sticky this, please. Maybe give it a better title ((No offense, John. xD Just, “Calm Down,” doesn’t seem to summarize everything as well as I wish it did.)) and make it one of the most important threads here on Kongregate. I’m not going to go into how to fix any of it since there’s more than enough of that floating around on other threads…but you know, John’s absolutely right. I personally consider Kongregate as one of the purest…erm…congregational website out there. ((Augh. Sorry…couldn’t think of a better word. I think you guys know what I mean, though.)) Fine, it’s a website, and fine, it suffers from many of the issues that other websites similar suffer—but everything here seems to always be to a much lesser extent. But I haven’t even seen what John meant when he was talking about the people acting like people thing…and yet I still have a great respect for this community.

After reading everything, I forgot who said this, but someone said that Kong is still young, and thus is still malleable…and whoever noted that is absolutely right. I think that administrators have a tendency to forget that a website’s members act as something as a bloodline, and that depending on how said bloodline is raised, the entire group could either take a darker or lighter shift. Now, while Kong is perhaps at one of its peaks of membership incline ((I think. It’s kinda speculation…)), I feel that everyone needs to do their best to pitch in and help assure Kongregate a positive outlook for many years to come.

But really…let’s look at making this a major topic. :D A major stickied topic. Let’s do everything we can so that Kongregate doesn’t slip like so many other similar websites out there. Ganbare, minna-san~! <3

::edit:: Grr. I can’t get the formatting right…mutters Okay, that’s a heart. It just has a pointy hat. xD

 
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Sylicas, JudeMaverick (sort of), Malachi, FRAGM3NT, jmtb02, etc.

Sylicas, pfft… He gave me a random site called Progress Quest. And why am I sort of? :(

And John, mind helping me fixing the problem at jmtb02 forums? I wanna spam at “Dicko is a silly Australian” post feedback on your game.

There’s seemingly one tool the mods need and that is the comments section. Occasionally, some random spam will appear (Like Mrcreds’ game which is awesome) which is SPAMSPAM, hateful, or some random ad link.