Kongregate getting worse? page 2

Originally posted by adv0catus:

They badged it BECAUSE people play it and BECAUSE they like it. There’s 3 requirements for a game to be badged:

1. People actually play it;
2. Higher then ~3.6 rating;
3. API.

2 of those things are 100% within control of the players. If everyone rated it 1/5 and didn’t play it, then the game wouldn’t be badged.

not true. I have seen games get badged before its been out long enough for many people to play it. SOme get badges based on the developer (nerdook for example), and other higher rated games with API dont get badges in place of other ones that are pushed foward, like pay MMO’s.

Originally posted by Sharkhunter:

Originally posted by DarkRainyKnight:

This reminds me of Flipline Studios who left RoS (one of the better MMOs) to go churn out countless Papa’s games.

Heh i rate every new papa game a 1 when they come out. stop making the same stupid game.

I do hope you play it first, just to make sure it is the same game and that they’ve not surprised you.

Originally posted by Bilious:

Originally posted by Sharkhunter:

Originally posted by DarkRainyKnight:

This reminds me of Flipline Studios who left RoS (one of the better MMOs) to go churn out countless Papa’s games.

Heh i rate every new papa game a 1 when they come out. stop making the same stupid game.

I do hope you play it first, just to make sure it is the same game and that they’ve not surprised you.

no, i dont play them first, not the last 3 that have come out. The same reason i wont go see the new spiderman movie. I dont reward unoriginality.

However, your point is taken on some level.

It’s a sad day when a Developer does one good game that he gave up on but still was great for some people ( Remnants of Skystone ) and then starts another game ( Papa’s ??? ). Sure, the first one was great, but it’s not fun anymore when you make 40.708 others with a slightly changed storyline ( “Oh yay I won the lottery now I get money oh no I got a job instead!” ), different name and little difference in the ingame features.
EDIT: I’ve got a fine example of a game that is rated high, has Kongregate API and doesen’t get badges: Obey the Game. However, retarded Pay-To-Win MMO’s get badges the moment they say " Hey, y’know… We can make you much more money than normal games? "

Originally posted by sauronthegreat:

It’s a sad day when a Developer does one good game that he gave up on but still was great for some people ( Remnants of Skystone ) and then starts another game ( Papa’s ??? ). Sure, the first one was great, but it’s not fun anymore when you make 40.708 others with a slightly changed storyline ( “Oh yay I won the lottery now I get money oh no I got a job instead!” ), different name and little difference in the ingame features.
EDIT: I’ve got a fine example of a game that is rated high, has Kongregate API and doesen’t get badges: Obey the Game. However, retarded Pay-To-Win MMO’s get badges the moment they say " Hey, y’know… We can make you much more money than normal games? "

RoS actually just need a few good updates with storyline, and more of a way to make the multiplayer part multiplayer.. like doing those coop is the only multiplayer i know of… seriously?
most mmo now have raids… so why not do that?

It’s definitely not getting better, but I wouldn’t say it’s getting worse either.

It feels very samey. They put in a couple useless features, but otherwise didn’t really do anything dramatic to change this place. It feels the same as it ever has.

I’m not quite sure about this. I think that the social features are eventually going to detract from the overall gaming experience. Just the fact that they have taken away the “recent games” on the frontpage and replaced them with what my friends are doing isn’t exactly progress to me. I don’t particularly care what badges other people are getting, but I do want to access the games I’ve played recently, because they are ones that I might not have finished.

I’ve been here for quite a long time, and I think I liked the site more when it had more of a specific focus, good flash games, mostly single player ones, not MMOs. I think the turning point is when they put Runescape on here.

Originally posted by sauronthegreat:

It’s a sad day when a Developer does one good game that he gave up on but still was great for some people ( Remnants of Skystone ) and then starts another game ( Papa’s ??? ). Sure, the first one was great, but it’s not fun anymore when you make 40.708 others with a slightly changed storyline ( “Oh yay I won the lottery now I get money oh no I got a job instead!” ), different name and little difference in the ingame features.
EDIT: I’ve got a fine example of a game that is rated high, has Kongregate API and doesen’t get badges: Obey the Game. However, retarded Pay-To-Win MMO’s get badges the moment they say " Hey, y’know… We can make you much more money than normal games? "

On Papa’s, I think if you go back and play first game, and then the newest game, you’ll see that a lot of things have changed and been improved. If people still like a game series, I see nothing wrong with a developer continuing to improve the games and make new ones. Heck, Call of Duty and every sports game does it every year, why not Flash game makers too?

Originally posted by BobTheCoolGuy:

Originally posted by sauronthegreat:

It’s a sad day when a Developer does one good game that he gave up on but still was great for some people ( Remnants of Skystone ) and then starts another game ( Papa’s ??? ). Sure, the first one was great, but it’s not fun anymore when you make 40.708 others with a slightly changed storyline ( “Oh yay I won the lottery now I get money oh no I got a job instead!” ), different name and little difference in the ingame features.
EDIT: I’ve got a fine example of a game that is rated high, has Kongregate API and doesen’t get badges: Obey the Game. However, retarded Pay-To-Win MMO’s get badges the moment they say " Hey, y’know… We can make you much more money than normal games? "

On Papa’s, I think if you go back and play first game, and then the newest game, you’ll see that a lot of things have changed and been improved. If people still like a game series, I see nothing wrong with a developer continuing to improve the games and make new ones. Heck, Call of Duty and every sports game does it every year, why not Flash game makers too?

Because Flash games are not as good as other games where you have to buy them. For example Call Of Duty. It is bad, but people still buy it due to it’s “just-kill-stuff” form. It’s fun for some people, and it’s good that there is that. But for flash games, such as Papa’s, there are slight improvements but they are not worth it. It’s like you grab Portal, and instead of going on with the storyline you just make the same game, slightly different puzzles and better graphics. Would’ve it been good? No, because it’d be the same thing. Conclusion is, over the time only people that LOVE that style of game will play it, people who were originally interested will not.

This post has been removed by an administrator or moderator

This post has been removed by an administrator or moderator

Originally posted by BobTheCoolGuy:

Originally posted by sauronthegreat:

It’s a sad day when a Developer does one good game that he gave up on but still was great for some people ( Remnants of Skystone ) and then starts another game ( Papa’s ??? ). Sure, the first one was great, but it’s not fun anymore when you make 40.708 others with a slightly changed storyline ( “Oh yay I won the lottery now I get money oh no I got a job instead!” ), different name and little difference in the ingame features.
EDIT: I’ve got a fine example of a game that is rated high, has Kongregate API and doesen’t get badges: Obey the Game. However, retarded Pay-To-Win MMO’s get badges the moment they say " Hey, y’know… We can make you much more money than normal games? "

On Papa’s, I think if you go back and play first game, and then the newest game, you’ll see that a lot of things have changed and been improved. If people still like a game series, I see nothing wrong with a developer continuing to improve the games and make new ones. Heck, Call of Duty and every sports game does it every year, why not Flash game makers too?

No, the games are almost identical clones of each other. The changes made to each game are so minute that I consider every game after the first one to be expansion packs. Having a different food item in each does not make it a unique game.

Nothing wrong with him remaking the game if people will play it cause obviously he likes the money he makes, but lets not pretend that each game is its own thing. They are all the same game. Many developers do this and they are all fine in doing so, but lets just call them what they are..expansion packs.

I played the first Papa game not too long ago after playing their most recent ones, since people on the forums are always whining they are the same game and all, due to doing that I realize the games are for sure not “identical,” and if you seriously think that, than please actually take the time to play the games and compare before you make yourself sound even more silly. You can clearly see the dev putting more effort into that series with every new one that comes out, it’s not just the food that gets changed. You honestly have no idea what you’re talking about or you truly do not understand the concept of what being identical means.

Originally posted by Sharkhunter:

not true. I have seen games get badged before its been out long enough for many people to play it. SOme get badges based on the developer (nerdook for example), and other higher rated games with API dont get badges in place of other ones that are pushed foward, like pay MMO’s.

This has made me a bit cynical about badges in recent times. During the earlier years of Kong it was obvious that they adhered to this criteria – even if you absolutely hated a particular game/genre (ugh, tower defence games!) you could see that they were popular enough to warrant a badge.

While I guess I can understand why some sequels are almost automatically given badges – it is easy to see that a lot of games are going to reach the minimum rating purely because there’s already a fanbase there – it does feel like by doing so Kong is creating a self-fulfilling prophecy (ie. give a game a badge, expecting people to rate it high enough, and people will do just that compared to if they had been given the chance to make the decision). It’s the MMOs which contain strong pay elements (whether they’re pay to play or make the game so difficult for the player that they have to either pay up or grind like crazy) which also get badges, seemingly randomly, that make me a bit suspicious of Kong’s motives. As others have said, however, this is unfortunately becoming a widespread trend in the games industry.

+1 Hip, Endless.

Kong is getting worse. I don’t think any of your reasons are why though(@OP). I think the largest turn off has been the forced social updates. I used to trust the kong admins 100% but with all the forced social updates and their lack of adding anything to levels I’ve been disappointed.

I mention levels since for 5 years they’ve been saying that they’ll take suggestions to implement level incentives. Lots blame hackers for ruining that for everyone but that is extremely flawed. It takes a whole 10 minutes of thinking to come up with a system that doesn’t reward anything significant for leveling(aesthetics….) The other problem is that alienating the whole website userbase because 0.1% of people are script kiddies is silly.

I don’t know if I’m alone in this but the forums have also dramatically decreased in activity. I’m not sure of the cause but it feels like the glory days of kong have passed.

Originally posted by seacotton:

I played the first Papa game not too long ago after playing their most recent ones, since people on the forums are always whining they are the same game and all, due to doing that I realize the games are for sure not “identical,” and if you seriously think that, than please actually take the time to play the games and compare before you make yourself sound even more silly. You can clearly see the dev putting more effort into that series with every new one that comes out, it’s not just the food that gets changed. You honestly have no idea what you’re talking about or you truly do not understand the concept of what being identical means.

Explain how the papa games have progressed and the dev is putting more effort into the series to make the games better.

Concrete examples would help.

Originally posted by wattro:

Explain how the papa games have progressed and the dev is putting more effort into the series to make the games better.

Concrete examples would help.

The RNG for selecting costumer for a day is better, meaning getting the last few gold costumers isn’t an impossible wait.
The food minigames require much less precision to get a high score on and aren’t as painful on the wrist. (This is the big one; making pizzas is stupidly hard in pizzeria, while in Wingeria/Taqueria are much easier to make food in.)
Minigames have been added to let you accumulate stat bonuses faster.
There’s more indication of who the next few customers are, and it’s easier to pre-prepare food items in the later games so you don’t have to guess which customers are coming today.

I’ve found that I’ve been playing Runescape more since all of the updates.

first off the forst point is right because they look at your coplaints first so if you’re aren’t knog plus they won’t adress it. The second point is wrong because those games are free to play and they need some way to keep the servers running. Finnaly I don’t think banning kids is right because you can’t imply they are all immature. Some are even better than the adults.

My problem is how they are turning this into facbook with “Follows” and all of thease likes to comments.

Originally posted by oOTrentOo:

I’ve found that I’ve been playing Runescape more since all of the updates.

RS seems more greed driving because they have a stable membership but now they are selling ingame advantages so I kind of quit.

I remembered again that despite we got these new social interaction promoting updates, few things have been taken from us and what is taken from us (recently played in front page, all forums lobby, idependence) which are not cobblestones for players themselves

They are just there, and they can be ignored. The updates like profile and community feed. For me, they’re close to obsolete

However, each feature has its effect and effects have consequences, like aforementioned losses. I’d also dare to argue that these new updates are also making community even further immature. There is no way I could prove that, but that’s how I feel

Marginally, the ratio of immature/mature users may remain unchanged even after updates, but due immature peoples/trolls tendency to be prominent, we may get an illusion that ratio of badly behaving users is increasing

Whether that’s true or not, it is annoying because effects are visible for us, the users. While certain aspects in community are changing, I repeat myself that I doubt that there isn’t going to be signifant changes in the main concept of kongregate; The games

If nothing of the above is true, you can always say that whatever got implemeted in the latest update, it remain there, useful or not taking valuable space

Space is well spent if people like the feature, and will find uses for the feature that was slapped at blank space

I can tell you from my own experiences that both feeds are almost useless to me, hell, I disabled most items from my profile feed and I’d certainly disable whole community feed if given a chance

Immortal, what I meant to say is Runescape is more appealing than Kongregate, and everyone knows that Runescape sucks ass.

Originally posted by Thok:

Originally posted by wattro:

Explain how the papa games have progressed and the dev is putting more effort into the series to make the games better.

Concrete examples would help.

The RNG for selecting costumer for a day is better, meaning getting the last few gold costumers isn’t an impossible wait.
The food minigames require much less precision to get a high score on and aren’t as painful on the wrist. (This is the big one; making pizzas is stupidly hard in pizzeria, while in Wingeria/Taqueria are much easier to make food in.)
Minigames have been added to let you accumulate stat bonuses faster.
There’s more indication of who the next few customers are, and it’s easier to pre-prepare food items in the later games so you don’t have to guess which customers are coming today.

i would hesitate to call any of those substantial. they all pretty much equate to the game being the same… mini-games might be the exception (and most of them suck, imho), but they aren’t really offering anything new. while maybe making things a bit easier, the core of the game is still very much the same and unchanged, and very much repetitive – not only within the franchise of games, but within a single game.

Few things I want to mention (even though I agree with topic).
The following arguments are invalid towards Kongregate becoming worse(even though they make it harder to love):

• Flash games with premium content should not be made light off – those developers aren’t making a fortune and they provide you a way to spend your pass-time joyfully (hopefully, if its a decent/good game). Micro-payment plans are excellent for this and it puts a respecting relation between gamer and developer.
• “Haters gonna hate” – if the game isn’t in your category, or it somehow doesn’t fit your preference – don’t comment that it sucks. Just don’t play it. That’s what categories, tags and ratings are for. Same goes to developers’ responsibility – don’t upload games that aren’t finished or are in testing phase (use beta or sod off).
• “Flamers”, “noobs” and other “challenged” people – mute them if they bother you. This isn’t real life – not everyone has to be your friend. The internet is full of them, get used to it, Kongregate is no different (which is a shame).
  The last point doesn’t mean the community is healthy – the validity of the argument resides in the system providing room for them to operate in all their harmful ways, not them being present as such.

Gamestop bought Kong, Kong going down the drain, coincidence? I think not.

can we get more badges please. They seem to have dried up recently. There are some really good games without badges which is to the detriment of the site.