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Should Kongregate continue giving badges to New Games even if they are all rubbish?

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Because when I joined, I thought badges also meant commendations to quality and originality.

I really feel that badges should only be given to games that claim a place on weekly and monthly boards, or even better a thread should be set up where users VOTE for which game should have badges, taking into account of course whether a game uses the Kong API.

Having badges on your game should be a privilege, not an expectation. Having lots of badges no longer seems “cool” because it shows you’re actually just “grinding” through games that have not had the Kongregate userbase seal of approval.

 
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If a developer has implemented Kong API and the game has over 3.7 stars (but I think it’s preferably 4) it can be badged. So any game with a badge has been voted highly and is liked by a large chunk of the community. There is already a Badge Suggestion Thread which is the closest you’ll come to a vote.

So technically the games have to have the userbase seal of approval to get a badge. Although, that doesn’t stop some god-awful games getting badged, nor does it stop some badges from being complete endurance/grinds.


Edit @Below: True, true – buuut

or even better a thread should be set up where users VOTE for which games should have badges

I guess that’s what I was referring to when linking the Badge suggestion thread.

 
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Originally posted by Stots:

There is already a Badge Suggestion Thread which is the closest you’ll come to a vote.

Actually, the closest thing you’ll come to a vote is just rating games on the site. User rating is by far the #1 criterion we use when deciding which games get badges.

I agree that the average quality of games has been declining lately, but so has the quantity of badges. The general goal of the system is to have a few sets each week with the best games, or more if there’s a particularly good period.

 
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But shouldn’t it be so that when newer games are bad, older games get badged? I really feel like there are still dozens of old games to be badged, including several Submachine games, all kinds of platformers, Unity games… Why don’t you go back and badge older games? People want more badges and when they get confusing or otherwise not-well-made games like The Bravest Hunter or GoTA, they don’t approve. I bet that if older, better games were badged, people would prefer them much more.

 
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Originally posted by Bluji:

But shouldn’t it be so that when newer games are bad, older games get badged? I really feel like there are still dozens of old games to be badged, including several Submachine games, all kinds of platformers, Unity games… Why don’t you go back and badge older games? People want more badges and when they get confusing or otherwise not-well-made games like The Bravest Hunter or GoTA, they don’t approve. I bet that if older, better games were badged, people would prefer them much more.

The Apoc Nao event was like the best thing ever. It doesn’t even have to be that amount. A game a week or so would be just fine.

 
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Originally posted by DarkRainyKnight:
Originally posted by Bluji:

The Apoc Nao event was like the best thing ever. It doesn’t even have to be that amount. A game a week or so would be just fine.

I know! And that was only a scrape of the surface which hides dozens of hidden gems beneath.

 
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I’d completely forgotten about that event! Bring it back! Or hell, even having one old badged game a week would be awesome.

 
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I wonder if Kongegate prefers to badge new games to drive new user registrations – people find the game when it goes viral and they’re linked here from some other site, then they get the “you would have got a badge!” notification, so they sign up to keep the badge. Going on that theory, it wouldn’t make as much sense for Kong to spend much time to add badges to games that aren’t getting traffic in from outside (eg games that have been out for a while already and weren’t badged first time around), except as part of a promotion that attracts extra attention such as the Apocolypse.

Anyway, whether that’s accurate or not, maybe we (and by “we” I mean “not me”) could compile a list of games that fit all the known criteria for badges, but were overlooked originally. No idle games and no potential copyright infringement, even as parody, appear to be extra criteria as well as what was listed already. It would be different to the badge suggestions thread in that the aim would literally just to be to have a list of suitable games that were missed in the past… the suggestions thread isn’t very good for looking back for specific types of games. I dont think there’s a list like this anywhere already and it would save time if a helpful staff member wanted to cook some tasty bagels up for some overlooked games.

 
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I do remember seeing a spreadsheet in the past that listed every game without badges that had API and a rating at or above 3.75 stars, but I can’t remember where it was, or if it’s been updated even remotely recently. It would be nice to have another one of those “hidden treasure” type weeks again, because I’m sure there are enough older games to warrant it.

 
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Originally posted by 123aaa789:

I do remember seeing a spreadsheet in the past that listed every game without badges that had API and a rating at or above 3.75 stars, but I can’t remember where it was, or if it’s been updated even remotely recently. It would be nice to have another one of those “hidden treasure” type weeks again, because I’m sure there are enough older games to warrant it.

I’ve been looking for that for a while but I can’t seem to find it. All I could find was a crappy equivalent, made by me but never finished.

 
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Here’s the link to the spreadsheet. Really, really outdated, however.

 
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But shouldn’t it be so that when newer games are bad, older games get badged?

This was my philosophy for a while, but there are two big problems with it:

- Older games generally have higher ratings than newer games because the people digging through older games are more lenient than the people loading up all the new games on the site every day. So the rating system gets skewed, and older games with high ratings that receive badges are much more likely to see their ratings plummet than newer games with more recently established ratings.

- Developers are less interested in fixing API issues in older games.

But at this rate, maybe I won’t have a choice anymore!

 
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There's a couple of big problems with your big problems:
– Does anyone actually care about the rating on a game that was released several years ago? The developers? I'm pretty sure developers would not mind at all if the rating dropped by a whole point, if it meant they got badges. The players? Yes, we do get a little butthurt when our favourite game gets badges, and then the rating sinks like the titanic, but again, we're more than happy with the badges. So who? You?

– There are many, many games that have working api. I made a list a bit less than a year ago when I was searching for games for my tournament. Never posted it till now. Highest rated at the top, lowest (3.6) at the bottom. Note that many of the games in the list were good enough to have sequels that also have working api. I didn't include the sequels however, to keep it short(ish):

super karoshi
gateway
obey the game
picma
exit path
minim
pulse
brute wars 2
untouchable
running fred
dead drunk 1.3 (probably not suitable because Lady GaGa)
the codex of alchemical engineering
hipolyta
boomshine DONE
vertigo: gravity llama DONE
Antimatiere DONE
digital upgrade
a silent conversation
g-switch
brain waves
avoidster
space arcade the game
fig 8
simple motions
reckless speed
neon maze
choo choo puzzles
last egg alive
love new version (infidelity mode needs badges)
the adventures of dear explorer
raider
space is key
faze
99 bricks the legend of gary
babies dream of dead worlds
tealy & orangey
mr bree
as I lay dying
langman
p.i.g.
missilebreak outvaders
blockage 2
gregmaniacs
rlax
jahooma's logic box
spike a love story
icycle DONE
attack of the buggles (probably not a good idea because of the dev)
endice
the great sperm race
MagnetiZR
escape the red giant DONE
piperiders
d.n.8
noggins
amberial axis
growbox
hell tetris
spikes tend to kill you 2
bug slayer
minerbot
bungluwa
blasting agent
 
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Thanks for the list, LouWeed. Going back and badging old games is definitely on the table. I didn’t mean to imply that the problems I mentioned were deal-breakers; rather, it just makes things a little more difficult than prioritizing newer games.

 
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Originally posted by Stots:

If a developer has implemented Kong API and the game has over 3.7 stars (but I think it’s preferably 4) it can be badged.

Since when’d Bubble Sky ever have 3.7 rating? So far it’s only 2.6, I thought…

 
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Regarding newer games, I’d agree that 2013 has been a weak year for flash games generally—but I do feel that otherwise suitable games have been kind of ignored the last couple months. Admittedly, a lot of the 3.75-3.9ish games haven’t had API, while a lot of games with API have clustered around 3.6 or 3.7. However, given what amounts to a structural need for badges, I’d recommend reconsidering the latter group. The ratings in some cases may be slightly lower than what’s desired, but it still affords the opportunity to badge recent games, and in many cases the rating isn’t really a reflection of the game’s craftsmanship or playability. To be blunt, genre and difficulty tend to be pretty effective predictors of badges-related ratings drops, and a lot of recent almost-games with API would actually be somewhat insulated from that effect.

I’d also hope that the developers of the former group could be persuaded to add API, but I guess there’s no way to guarantee that. To tie this in with the topic of older games, I’d think older games without API and those with broken or flawed API at least warrant a look if the rating’s there. In some cases, at least, I would think (hope?) the developer would be open to adding it, particularly with the incentive of badges.

 
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I’m getting pretty excited and optimistic here. Please, don’t let me down. Lastly, I’ll have your babies, Lou.

 
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Originally posted by greg:

But shouldn’t it be so that when newer games are bad, older games get badged?

This was my philosophy for a while, but there are two big problems with it:

- Older games generally have higher ratings than newer games because the people digging through older games are more lenient than the people loading up all the new games on the site every day. So the rating system gets skewed, and older games with high ratings that receive badges are much more likely to see their ratings plummet than newer games with more recently established ratings.

- Developers are less interested in fixing API issues in older games.

But at this rate, maybe I won’t have a choice anymore!

You should probably stop testing these theories on shitty MMOs. :)

 
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Why do all of these stupid MMOs use the same words in their titles?

Dawn ~ Dawn of Darkness, Dawn of the Dragons, Battle Dawn
Kings ~ Kings and Legends, King’s Bounty: Legions
Dragons ~ Dawn of the Dragons, Clash of the Dragons, Dragon’s Call
Legacy ~ Legacy of a Thousand Suns, Legacy of Heroes
Saga ~ Epic War Saga, Crystal Saga
Heroes ~ Legacy of Heroes, Heroes of Gaia

Edit: Why is the end of my post getting cut off?

This part is%2

 
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So now we wait for Dawn of the Kings, Heroes Saga and Dragon’s Saga

 
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Originally posted by DarkRainyKnight:

Why do all of these stupid MMOs use the same words in their titles?

Dawn = Dawn of Darkness, Dawn of the Dragons, Battle Dawn
Kings = Kings and Legends, King’s Bounty: Legions
Dragons = Dawn of the Dragons, Clash of the Dragons, Dragon’s Call
Legacy = Legacy of a Thousand Suns, Legacy of Heroes
Saga = Epic War Saga, Crystal Saga
Heroes = Legacy of Heroes, Heroes of Gaia
Papa’s = -Papa’s Hot Doggeria, Papa’s Wingeria, Papa’s Pancakeria, Papa’s Freezeria, Papa’s Taco Mia!, Papa’s Burge

Don’t forget the rhyming “ee” sounds

-Caesary
-Senatary
-Evony

Oh and

Dragon’s Call, Call of Gods, Call of Duty

E: Well it seems I caught you before you edited your post, not once, but twice XD

 
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Because the ending of whatever I type there keeps getting cut ._.

Edits, ftw: You can even see it in your quote.

 
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Originally posted by greg:
Originally posted by Stots:

There is already a Badge Suggestion Thread which is the closest you’ll come to a vote.

Actually, the closest thing you’ll come to a vote is just rating games on the site. User rating is by far the #1 criterion we use when deciding which games get badges.

I agree that the average quality of games has been declining lately, but so has the quantity of badges. The general goal of the system is to have a few sets each week with the best games, or more if there’s a particularly good period.

I have been around for years, and this is the first time I actually complain.

Have you even “play” Dawn of Darkness, Greg? It’s a horrible flash animation, I can’t even call it a game. It could be acceptable as an idle game… if it wasn’t made to make money and nothing more.
How could it get a 3.70 score in the first place? Did you read the top comments?

I trust you, Greg, I take the time to earn badges because I really like Kongregate and consider it a game by itself. Earning badges from these “MMORPG’s” designed to take your money must be the harder levels.

 
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fun fact: Since the badges came out it’s gone from 3.84 → 3.73

 
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Originally posted by DarkRainyKnight:

Why do all of these stupid MMOs use the same words in their titles?

Dawn ~ Dawn of Darkness, Dawn of the Dragons, Battle Dawn
Kings ~ Kings and Legends, King’s Bounty: Legions
Dragons ~ Dawn of the Dragons, Clash of the Dragons, Dragon’s Call
Legacy ~ Legacy of a Thousand Suns, Legacy of Heroes
Saga ~ Epic War Saga, Crystal Saga
Heroes ~ Legacy of Heroes, Heroes of Gaia

Edit: Why is the end of my post getting cut off?

This part is%2

So who’s making Legacy of the Saga of the Dawn of the Dragon King Hero?