Raise your hand here if you don't like the boss update

I’ve created this thread so anyone who doesn’t like the new update which makes the bosses insane, even on normal mode, can raise their hand and let the developers know. This is a serious issue that makes the game unplayable for the casual person and ruins a lot of characters that aren’t designed to deal with murderous quest bosses. Reminds me a lot of early Diablo 2 nerfs, until they made it so you could re-config your stats…

Cheers.

Too difficult, I had to resort to pc potions on every quest bosses. Definitely not a cool move, from the developer

Same. I have to drop all my perception/strength gear and wear defense in order to survive the normal quest bosses. Horrible change.

I agree. They needed to be harder but not this hard

same, before they were far too easy, but now even the normal ones are just impossible even for a casual player.

I disagree, the bosses should be challenging, before they were just a breeze, now they require actual effort, and yes, I’m a free player with a BSI of 1.44, I just defeated Bellarius and the animated armor, going for Hargamesh, Animated armor almost killed me, but I managed to beat it

totally disagree.

People just complaim RIGHT AWAY, rather than trey to FIGURE OUT how to move on from here. I really hope to devs stand strong on this and don’t give in to the whiners that seems to think “we want everything and we want it now, for free!!”.

Casual players aren’t exactly meant to walk through the game like hardcore players. By being Casual players, they have decided not to complete all chapters anytime soon.
Heck, if you could just walkover all the chapters as a casual players, what would be the point of investing large ammounts of time in the game?

The biggest failure i see on these forums is that almost nobody can look beyond their own fat nose.

while i have no desire to insult anyone, i have nothing against this patch… sure, i’d like if they found another use for defense, but this one works. plus, the easily accessed equipment improved, shouldn’t the bosses improve too?

@Nitromand

Do you have any idea how many times I’ve heard that excuse over two decades of gaming? I don’t, never kept count…and if I had, I would’ve lost count by now.

I’ve seen it happen too many times. Every game that makes major changes to the gameplay and tries to combat mudflation by balancing the game around the top 10% hardcore crowd fails in the long run. Normal players do not care for road blocks and impossible challenges, they just shrug and move on to find an another game. Especially flash gamers, who are mostly casuals. It’s not as if there’s no alternatives, plenty of those even here on Kongregate.

Unfortunately the hardcore crowd is always the most vocal one, so many devs end up listening to them and making the same mistakes over and over. Kinda sad, actually.

Completely disagree. The quest side of the house requires little to no effort, and does not encourage players to invest in the other core stats of health and defence. In the end, this is a good move for the longevity of the game.

On the flip side, they need to make the legendary drops on par with the difficultly level on the boss.

@Zaltys

Then let them move on and whine somewhere else. If people whine over this update and don’t want to adept to the changes, or even just give it all a fair chance before complaining, then why the hell care about them?

I still have to see 1 single valid point in people’s complaints. All i see is “waaaaaaaaaaaaaaah i can’ beat this boss, Developer do something!!!!” …… If it were indeed next to impossible (which none of the bosses are on normal when it comes down to it), then sure something should be done. But as for now, nobody have tried HARD to actually adjust to this update.

Give it a week or so, then i’m sure people will understand how this game is meant to be like. A game with more stats than just Energy/Stamina/Attack.

As for the record, i’m not a hardcore gamer. I died A lot to some bosses because of this update (just like everyone else…..) and i’m being stuck with a lot of experience to next level, so don’t give me that crap when you don’t know me.

I LIKE THE CHANGE.

Place stat points into defense and everything is ok~!

Originally posted by Nitromand:

@Zaltys

Then let them move on and whine somewhere else. If people whine over this update and don’t want to adept to the changes, or even just give it all a fair chance before complaining, then why the hell care about them?

That’s simple: because such attitude kills games. Players drift away, hardcore crowd sticks around for a while until they start feeling lonely. Then even they move on. Game is forgotten and eventually drops offline, in a few years nobody can even remember its name.

You might doubt that, but I’ve seen it happen so many times that I think I can recognize the signs.

Normal mode should’ve been kept as it was and NM should’ve been a challenge even for most experienced players. But as the things currently stand, those normal bosses are such a road block that it only drives newbies away…it certainly doesn’t drive them into supporting the game. Less support, that is, less cash means less development. Everyone loses.

Zaltys.. why exactly is it that you think you are smarter than everyone else here. Even smarter than the developers?
They pretty much know what they are doing.
And no, this doesn’t drift everyone away .., it only drifts those away that wouldn’t have stayed in for the long haul anyway. Besides, how many do you think will stay in game now that it have gone from farming to challenging? – Before this update there were only farming and NOTHING else.
This game will die eventually. Just like EVERY other game. However, with his update the developers show that THEY care about the game, and that they care about the many requests made prior to this update happening. So, i’m pretty sure they just expanded it’s lifetime by a lot, even if it costs a few whiners here and now.
Did you notice that there is at least as many comming on to the forums apllausing the update as there is complainers?
If you are really so smart when it comes to games history, you should know that it is a rare sight upon ANY update.
Thumps up to the developers. Kick in the nuts to the whiners. LOVE IT!

I agree that the boss are now super harder than before and i am fine with it because they calculated the power of that boss and i think they did that because what is the use of potions if the boss are darn too easy

The game is still farming and nothing else. Except now instead of farming and putting the extra stats into attack you have to put the extra stats into defense. Nothing has changed for the “hardcore” gamers. However, for the non-hardcore gamer (pretty much the vast majority of the game’s population and potential money) it creates a problem very early on in the game. You are not able to farm raids because your stamina is very low, but you now need those raids to be able to get good enough gear (and extra stat points) to continue through the quests and use your energy to level.

There is nothing “challenging” about the new bosses. They just have an increased attack power. When you enter into a boss battle, you control almost nothing of the battle. You can do almost nothing to change your attack value or if the boss misses you through skill. It is all based on how you allocate your stat points. If your defense stat is high enough compared to your health, you win. If not, you lose.

Not saying that the game shouldn’t stay similar… but maybe dial back the bosses a bit. Without knowing the exact values to get through certain bosses, I can’t comment on how hard the lower level bosses really are though. If the developers don’t want you to reach the end of the last quest zone untill you are level 2000, they are looking pretty on target with how hard the bosses hit. If they want you to be able to reach the end of the quest zones by level 500, the quest bosses on normal are way over powered.

My two cents. In the end, this is truly the developers game. Unfortunately, just like any business, if you are hawking a product that is disliked, it will not sell.

Originally posted by Nitromand:

Zaltys.. why exactly is it that you think you are smarter than everyone else here. Even smarter than the developers?

I’m not, and I never claimed to be.
But I do have twenty years of experience in the industry and can (hopefully) recognize common pitfalls. Because I’ve fallen into many myself in the past.

Look around you. I’m not the only one who realizes that this change was slightly excessive.
But you’re certainly right about one thing: it’s all up to the devs. Which is exactly why players should voice their opinions: without feedback, the devs cannot make informed decisions. Trying to shut up anyone who disagrees, calling them whiners…isn’t exactly helping.

I dunno why I even bother, I’ve seen this play out one too many times.
Meh. I think I’ll just get back to playing the game…but I doubt that I’ll spend any more cash on it, at least not for a long while.

pathetic zaltys .., threatening with real life money.

Dahrizon have stated multiple times that this was not meant to either improve or remove their cash income. But you keep going on about money, idustry and so on, acting like you know better than the developers. They are most likely way ahead of your thoughts, so writing them down is only for trying to make yourself stand out “smart”.

And yes, people are seriously just whining when all their arguement can be boiled down to “reverse this update because i can’t beat BOSS X”.

Degelus .., it is more challenging as it’s about balancing stat values now. Nobody can live with just 1 high stat, few can survive by just adding into 2 stats, but far most of the players can survive if they balance all 3 stats.
Once again, remember the Dahrizon have stated that ALOT of people were further in the game than meant to for their level. Honestly, people should jump back a zone or two, then i’m pretty sure they are about equal with the bosses. ;)

Myself i am level 501, i can just about kill any zone 9 bosses by using free potions gained from questing (perception drops) and my best gear. Right when this update came out i got RAPED by them because i had only allocated stats into attack. After throwing 2-3 days (i saved up.. :) ) worth of SP into Def and HP, i could beat the first of the dragons. By upping myself with potions i got the last bits needed for Vala.
So i ask where the hell you get level 2.000 from? – it’s obviously not needed for Vala on normal.

It’s all about balancing. The better you are at it, the faster you can progress in questing. Honestly i fail to see why that is a bad thing.
Off course, farming extensively can always make up for lack of skill in balancing stats. So if you die at a specific boss, go farming for a while and you will eventually make it. Too impatient to do that? find another game.

And finally, Degelus, those few percent of the gamers that can define themself as “hardcore gamers”, is probably spending just about the same ammounts of money (to be able to keep auto levelling) as the rest of the player base is.
This update also makes people want to buy those nice PC armors and weapons. Why? Because the lazy people with too many money will always use the expensive shortcut..
I fail to see how this update will affect their revenue massively on the long term or even on the short term.

They need better loot along with the increased difficulty, like energy and stamina potions and whatnot.

I am a cusualy player fighting animated armor, There are lots of things casual players can use. Calissa and Insania boosts hp alot for quest bosses. The "Quest Bosses: have the word Bosses in them

It’s all part of a long development cycle.

They want to release new higher level zones, and to make them worth doing, they need to be harder and give more rewards then where the current playerbase is at. (to give them something to work towards/do).

Now if they were to just spring that on us, the gap would be HUGE.

Instead they get the players to work on def and hp now as a gradual progression through the zones (instead of all good till scrolls then a HUGE gap that takes a month to overcome)

So that players will be ready for the new gear sets, and the higher level zones incoming.

Everyone has been allocating their damn points into Attack all this time. Making lop-sided characters who have been chasing dmg above everything.

This change helps balance things by giving reasons to raise defense and health.

Thats a good thing.

Will it take you a bit more effort to fix the flaws of going so far without any def? Sure. Growing pains.

But thats a hell of a lot better then everyone having 20k attack and 0 def and wondering why everything is so easy.

P.S The wall used to be felt when ppl finally got to Simulacrum of Dahrizon at the end of scrolls of dahrizon. They would have to raise their def greatly to deal with it. Newer players wont hit the wall because they will have grown their def through the zones in a more natural progression.

So you want a game where bosses can’t hurt you? I like games that don’t assume I’m a spoiled kid. I like a challenge. I love the new bosses. A gamer who says grinding kills games, blah.

tarkabear that is bull

I like the Idea of the new update. But I find them to be far to hard. Near impossible to beat.

See here’s my thought, normal is the casual player zone. I’m not trying to get the awesome legendaries, except when I am, and I step things up to harder difficulties for that. This is in part because higher difficulties have higher drop rates. When I was hitting hard and legendary bosses to get to nightmare of say cemetery to get my demon stone I thought, this boss is awfully easy on legendary. But normal shouldn’t be ridiculously hard either. I’m trying to wrap up my normal bludheim run now, or else I’d go look for an early zone to try to NM run and check out the new boss balance, but I agree, higher difficulty should be much higher, normal though is normal for a reason and should be more accessible to everyone.