> *Originally posted by **[zz1000zz](/forums/143/topics/275564?page=4#posts-6366819):*** > > On the topic of simulations, I have a question. Does anyone really care about battles simulated versus equally leveled opponents? PvP in this game is practically nonexistent, so it seems silly to me to base one’s build on it. Wouldn’t it be more practical to base our builds on the enemies we’ll actually face? > > So here’s an offer, open to anyone. If you give me an idea of something to simulate, I’ll try. You can give me specific situations, including items, or you can just give me a quest, or even just a general concept. Provide me a question you’d like answered, and I’ll do my best to answer it for you. > > But quite frankly, as far as the matchups I’ve been able to ensure are fairly handled by my code go, a 0:1:0 build is terrible. Putting some points into defense will almost always increase one’s win rate. Wow, I can’t believe it took until the last post of page 4 for people to realize that question. To add insult to injury, the village idiot is the one who asked it. Oh well, a stopped clock is right twice a day and all that. To answer the question: no, there is no point in building for PvP because the AI will be controlling one of the players, and the AI is an idiot. Question: what enemy is there to face that would actually require an optimal build? Only one I can think of is CoT 3, and there’s currently no possible situation in which facing him would be an optimal choice. TL;DR of whole topic: the optimal build for the game is far too hard to figure out considering there is no use for it, and the world is filled with people who need to read the book “How to win an argument” which I swear is an actual book which I read once.

Everyone has their own thing to do that they feel works best for them. If a book were named “How to win an argument over the internet”, there would only be one page with a single word. And it would say “Impossible.” Everyone is hell-bent on their own opinion on the internet, I find arguing to be pretty pointless here. This isn’t debate club, or the Presidential Debates, it’s Kongregate.

> *Originally posted by **[VforVendetta](/forums/143/topics/275564?page=5#posts-6367609):*** > > Everyone has their own thing to do that they feel works best for them. > If a book were named “How to win an argument over the internet”, there would only be one page with a single word. And it would say “Impossible.” > > Everyone is hell-bent on their own opinion on the internet, I find arguing to be pretty pointless here. This isn’t debate club, or the Presidential Debates, it’s Kongregate. Actually, it’d probably be empty, like the book “What men know about women” which is actually sold in stores, and which people presumably actually buy.

> *Originally posted by **[VforVendetta](/forums/143/topics/275564?page=5#posts-6367609):*** > > Everyone has their own thing to do that they feel works best for them. > If a book were named “How to win an argument over the internet”, there would only be one page with a single word. And it would say “Impossible.” > > Everyone is hell-bent on their own opinion on the internet, I find arguing to be pretty pointless here. This isn’t debate club, or the Presidential Debates, it’s Kongregate. I mostly just like making combat simulators. I find them interesting to make, and I love trying to work out which strategies work best in them. I especially like trying to apply mathematics to the creation of strategies. For example, I once worked out a system of equations for a tower defense game that allowed me to approximate the best strategies possible. I’m sure I could have figured it out by actually testing different strategies (and it would have been faster), but I thought it was pretty cool.

Well zz, as I said I’m offended but I’m not making a big deal about it. You should take a leaf from my book.

> *Originally posted by **[calibur2](/forums/143/topics/275564?page=5#posts-6370045):*** > > Well zz, as I said I’m offended but I’m not making a big deal about it. You should take a leaf from my book. I’m not making a big deal of it either. I’m just baffled by you taking offense. I have no idea why it was offensive to you, and that bugs me. I don’t mind offending people. I just hate doing it unintentionally. As Oscar Wilde said: > A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone’s feelings unintentionally.

> TL;DR of whole topic: the optimal build for the game is far too hard to figure out considering there is no use for it, and the world is filled with people who need to read the book “How to win an argument” which I swear is an actual book which I read once. was the book any good ? checked amazon and there seems to be several books with that title. any chance you remember the author ? sounds interesting :D

New text available: _How much attack does Seraphiel need to beat a Quest/CoT using Ice Blast II?_, please read here: [http://www.kongregate.com/forums/143-epic-war-saga/topics/275564-guide-math-strategies#posts-5932129](http://www.kongregate.com/forums/143-epic-war-saga/topics/275564-guide-math-strategies#posts-5932129)

I’ve finished the text about the Seraphiel’s attack; **part 2** included, I calculated the attack estimation using some equipments _(angel slayer, galaxy sword, water galaxy sword, ultimate galaxy sword, epic blades III)._ For example, to beat the quest 12-5 using 2 Ice Blasts II (see the part 1), Seraphiel needs to have at least attack = 90734. But, if you see the part 2 (considering the farm gear), you’ll noticed that you only can farm 12-5 if you have at least 2 Water Swords and level \> 9000 (attack = 92202). So, hardly 12-5 can be farmable using Seraphiel. And if the charts/text are incomprehensible, please let me know.

Nice work on the Sera charts. They look great.

BUMP :) Useful stuff for all the Sera fanatics.

Sera’s charts reviewed and recalculated based on version 1.55. All CoTs got buffed and some later quests. [http://www.kongregate.com/forums/143-epic-war-saga/topics/275564-guide-math-strategies?page=1#posts-5932129](http://www.kongregate.com/forums/143-epic-war-saga/topics/275564-guide-math-strategies?page=1#posts-5932129)

Could you make similar charts for Kholai and Lilith ? Thank you

gey gust4v3! new farm is released name is farm6000

because max xp is 9999 this farm is useless

> *Originally posted by **[GoodPeople](/forums/143/topics/275564?page=5#posts-6453831):*** > > because max xp is 9999 this farm is useless This statement is of course wrong, cause unless you reset your stats this high end farm helps a lot for ppl which allocated ~20k attack to farm with seraphiel And run out of 400+ Ap options in arena

> *Originally posted by **[DeathmanElf](/forums/143/topics/275564?page=5#posts-6453428):*** > > Could you make similar charts for Kholai and Lilith ? > Thank you Kholai’s thunder shield or thunder storm?

> *Originally posted by **[gust4v3](/forums/143/topics/275564?page=5#posts-6454368):*** > > *Originally posted by **[DeathmanElf](/forums/143/topics/275564?page=5#posts-6453428):*** > > > > Could you make similar charts for Kholai and Lilith ? > > Thank you > > Kholai’s thunder shield or thunder storm? I myself used thunder shield more then storm. But as it is the elf’s requests…..

I guess thunder shield as it gives more hits and is reliable to hit with Thunder storm is too random to be usefull in any long time farm

having equipped infinity blade + 5x Epic armor 3 at farm6000 2.0X(461ap) i get 19998 xp at 3.0x(788) also 19998 xp is it possible to get more then 19998 xp from one fight?

Max amount of XP per arena battle is 9999 [1Ap = 25xp?] This can be increased after battle by using +XP Gear

thx for the info….

> *Originally posted by **[gust4v3](/forums/143/topics/275564?page=1#posts-5932129):*** > > For example, if I have _96525 attack_ (like the image above), I could beat the quest **12-5** using two Ice Blasts II because _90734_ is the minimum attack required. Should update, like “12-3 using one Ice Blaster II”.

> *Originally posted by **[monkin7](/forums/143/topics/275564?page=5#posts-6472831):*** > > *Originally posted by **[gust4v3](/forums/143/topics/275564?page=1#posts-5932129):*** > > > > For example, if I have _96525 attack_ (like the image above), I could beat the quest **12-5** using two Ice Blasts II because _90734_ is the minimum attack required. > > Should update, like “12-3 using one Ice Blaster II”. Thanks for notice that! And I updated the Sera’s chart and added CoT 7, CoT 8 and the farms.

Hi. I have 28867 attack with Sera. I still can’t kill 11-6 with 2xIB2, it just happens some times maybe 1 in 10 attempt’s. What am i doing wrong?