Team Balancing... (locked)

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The picture says it all. On a map like Shuttlebay, this is doable with a team of 3 decent players. However, on a map like MoonBase where there is a constantly changing objective in which every member of your team is doing something to help capture the point, this just doesn’t work. The entire game our team was just getting stomped, even when we stuck together. I’m not aware how teams are actually selected, but I do know that a team of 3 has no chance against a team of 8. I enjoy this game and community very much, but I feel I’m being penalized each and every time I step into a game, because every team I’m on is always against a team double the size or more. I’m aware that the game is still in BETA, and respect the fact that its still such a solid game. My only request; Fix the team balancing. MoonBase is a map for high ranked, skilled players, logic would dictate that teams would be at least somewhat even…

With the utmost respect and sincerity,

- Dotrawr

 
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^^^yeah. i agree completely. on shuttlebay, there would be a few SMg’s or Lft’s on the blue team, and do fine against a team of 8 Pvt, and Cpl’s. but on the Lunar base, the people are already descent enough to hold their own, and it makes it nearly impossible to beat a team like the yellow team above

EDIT: the most the teams should be apart in numbers is 2 on Lunar base. anybody agree?

 
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Shuttlebay it is possible to 1v6 and still win due to its structure. Moonbase is near impossible to win when greatly outnumbered. Moonbase should be equal teams (If even amout of players) even if it is 1Lft and 3MSg against 4SgM. It would give each team a fair chance of winning. The only time I have been in a game where a team has had less players and won was earlier with me and someone else. I forgot his name It was a 4v2, 4MSg against us 2 SgM’s. The only reason we won is that we were both tanks and stayed together. It seems alot of players don’t try to cap still, they just go for kill then fly off, even with all enemies dead. :/
The teams are based on your Elo rankings. An example of Elo rankings is the top x amount of players in a chosen sport. E.g the world 10 international football teams. As of current Spain is the world#1 and have an Elo ranking of 1.

 
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I’d have to agree with you M_Sixteen.

And on a side note; If anybody looks at the score and has their doubts. Those 2 captures that Blue did make, yellow was just goofing around.

 
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1000000% agreed. WAY too much unfair “balancing” in matchmaking. the algorithms in the programs (if thats what you are using) are wayy off.

 
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The algorithms are not way off. They are creating the most balanced team in terms of Elo ranking as possible. Part of the problem might be numbers of players on a team, but part of the problem may be that the current Elo rankings that people have earned on Shuttlebay were distorted by the fact that pro players could easily cap the point, pick off many new players who didn’t yet understand the objective, and rise in the ranks. Those who dedicated more time may have a higher Elo ranking than equally skilled players who didn’t play as much. —-or such is my personal line of reasoning.

Anyway, we are already discussing it among our team and will try to improve team balancing because we hold it as important.

 
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you use ELO like league of legends then.
I am glad you are discussin it

 
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The amount of players u have in moonbase makes a much bigger difference than in shuttlebay. 1, the skill level of players are much closer. 2, the objective of the game is capturing rather than defending a point, which gives the bigger team an advantage. 3, personally, I’d rather lose a game because the other team was more skilled than lose because they had over twice as many people.

 
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Originally posted by prepkunow:

The amount of players u have in moonbase makes a much bigger difference than in shuttlebay. 1, the skill level of players are much closer. 2, the objective of the game is capturing rather than defending a point, which gives the bigger team an advantage. 3, personally, I’d rather lose a game because the other team was more skilled than lose because they had over twice as many people.

Well said prepuknow.

Thank you FRG for bringing this up with the team, I and many other players appreciate it. Looking forward to your solution to the problem.

 
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Originally posted by freerangegames:

The algorithms are not way off. They are creating the most balanced team in terms of Elo ranking as possible. Part of the problem might be numbers of players on a team, but part of the problem may be that the current Elo rankings that people have earned on Shuttlebay were distorted by the fact that pro players could easily cap the point, pick off many new players who didn’t yet understand the objective, and rise in the ranks. Those who dedicated more time may have a higher Elo ranking than equally skilled players who didn’t play as much. —-or such is my personal line of reasoning.

Anyway, we are already discussing it among our team and will try to improve team balancing because we hold it as important.

Glad to know it’s being looked at. Moonbase is really rather frustrating because of this.

 
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Originally posted by Kelfer:
Originally posted by freerangegames:

The algorithms are not way off. They are creating the most balanced team in terms of Elo ranking as possible. Part of the problem might be numbers of players on a team, but part of the problem may be that the current Elo rankings that people have earned on Shuttlebay were distorted by the fact that pro players could easily cap the point, pick off many new players who didn’t yet understand the objective, and rise in the ranks. Those who dedicated more time may have a higher Elo ranking than equally skilled players who didn’t play as much. —-or such is my personal line of reasoning.

Anyway, we are already discussing it among our team and will try to improve team balancing because we hold it as important.

Glad to know it’s being looked at. Moonbase is really rather frustrating because of this.

Moonbase is still a fantastic map in my opinion but I noticed that quite a few Lft.’s went back to Shuttle Bay because we kept being screwed by teams with the 3 vs 8 sort of thing.

 
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Can you give us an option to see what our Elo is? Maybe show it on the teams?

 
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Yeah. I would enjoy the Elo indicator as well.

 
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Originally posted by Dotrawr:

The picture says it all.

….

With the utmost respect and sincerity,


- Dotrawr

Dotrawr, Thank you for providing the screen shot. I’d like to see more of these.

Now hold your breath (LOL!), I’m not saying I don’t agree that we need to work on the team balancing algorithm, but in isolation, I read this screen shot differently. Neither team made it to 1000 before the timer ran out, so both teams really had to work for it until the end. And the score was relatively close, not like the spreads that sometimes occur in Shuttlebay. You are also one of the highest Elo ranked players right now, which means you win almost all the time, and hence by our current philosophy, you should be challenged more.

Elo ranking is relative and will change over time. Hopefully we see a little natural balancing in the next week or so. We will try to improve things but we will take our time doing it because we don’t want to replace one broken system with a worse broken system. Game designers often get team balancing wrong—we hope our system isn’t way wrong. Plus the number of players we have in the game is relatively low right now compared to some of the bigger established games because we are still in beta. That can cause statistical anomalies because outliers have too much weight until the population size gets very large.

Also with respect and sincerity. -FRG

 
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Well what i think is that the teams should still be 8vs8 or 6 vs 6…
all the bad people are on yellow and good people on blue.. i think you could split up the good people (dot,prep,solar,zaiy,lav,etc) on both teams so they’re more interesting! i dont really care if a team has better people i want even teams… and just to copy of you guys…

with all respect and sincerity! lavkey4
 
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To FRG, that was just a screenshot mid-game, they did end up making it to 1000 with us still at 400 :P

I’m glad Elo ranking was brought up though, I was never aware of it before, and balancing makes a bit more sense now. These crazy teams don’t happen all the time, but occasionally it’ll be these kinds of teams for multiple matches in a row, which can be quite frustrating at times. Hopefully things do balance themselves out a bit more within the next few weeks, we can only hope.

 
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Actually, this kind of balance in matches is very common. Not to diminish this conversation, but I’ve stickied the similar Elo Rating post to combine it into a single thread.