Forums Wartune

Official Rant Thread - Patch 1.46

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Due to the substantial number of PMs and in game world chats, this hopefully will be the adopted place where you as players can let loose – complain, whine, rant, stomp, and curse (within reason). Of course, posts with constructive criticism are welcome as well. :)

Some of the major points at hand were made in this thread, this thread and finally, this thread. Use these as reference, if desired.

Please try and use this thread to keep the forum clean. Thanks!

 
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Rant 1. R2games.com have yet to resolve, begin to resolve, or even contact me about an issue that was reported a number of times from the date of November 16th 2012. Do the developers read here or only post? I cannot understand if they don’t read thier own forum here! I just want it fixed.

Rant 2. Battle Ground needs 10 level tiers.

Rant 3. I’m not paying for every little thing you have in the game separately. Your game is at the forefront of money sucking mechanism greed lol. Yeah bite me and give us some wings!!!!!!!!!

 
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The cost to compete per character, has gone up by 20 dollars now.

Before it was VIP + Sockets to play a character (and dbl skill tree on mage).

People who had all the mounts had a slight advantage but not enough to make it feel hopeless. (they had to overcash to do that, but it was a minority so you could ignore them for most of your day to day gaming life)

But now, you either get wings to continue playing, or you hop off the bandwagon really.

I had a lvl 42 mage on s66 i retired due to low pop over there, i have a lvl 50 archer, lvl 46 mage on pst 1 and a lvl 32 knight on the new oceanic one here.

Obviously i wont be keeping up with the curve on them.

Archer will be retired, mage on s66 already retired. That leaves knight and mage and even those im considering my path forward now.

Too much cash needed to keep up with this game, not enough value for money.

Seems too much greed not enough fun.

Also we know chinese servers have a free set of wings, you guys deliberately not giving them to us when you are just translating the game over here is a very cheap and greedy stunt that your playerbase is aware of.

Quite aggravating.

 
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If you gave people some kind of free wings then this problem would be resolved. I know quite a few who would gladly buy them for $10 as well but not $20.

 
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This is not an effort for me to get wings for $10 I have no intent of spending my money on this game so dun nobody get mad and start hollering that please.

 
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The problem here is not the huge cashers. They have and always will dominate the game. Nobody is complaining about that – that’s just how games like this work. The real problem here is that R2 is losing the middle class in the economy of power. And the middle is what holds the fun of the game together.

Because the middle/low-cash/minimum-pay players serve a doubly important role in how the game works. They’re the ones that provide a vague challenge to the full-pay players (sure, the cashers will win, but it’s more fun than killing an f2p in two hits), and they’re also the ones that give the f2p players hope (sure, they may not be able to kill KE or Avenger or Wonderbar, but that $25 VIP archer, maybe!). Without those players there, what do the f2p players play for? Who do they play to try and beat? Without those players there, what do the p2w players play for, knowing nobody else stands a chance? Beating on each other? But that’s easy, whoever paid more wins. Without the middle there to beat on, what’s the fun?

But as the minimums to remain competitive go up, many players are reconsidering paying and playing at all. Many are willing to pay a minimal amount – VIP + sockets, that’s less than $20 a month + a 1 time payment of $10 for double skills, maybe. Many would go on paying that for months and not minding it! It’s about the same amount as any p2p MMO. Except then you add $ for event mounts. $ for wings. $ for that HP pack skill for GB, maybe. And R2 keeps adding things that you need in order to remain competitive. Then as it passes that critical point, the payments from that player drop to 0 as they quit.

A lot of things could be done to offset the widening gaps between high-middle and between middle-free:

- Give players wings at 50, maybe with 1% and half the stats of the paid ones. Make them look ridiculous if you have to, to make people want to pay for the cooler looking ones. But it’s something at least. The cash wings still give more, but the gap is less wide. It’s also an incentive to hit 50.

- Make a 50-59 BG. Those players who paid their share to get to 45 deserve to rule for a while, even if they didn’t get there first. As is, the money they paid to remain competitive is worthless, as they simply can’t compete due to how the BG is structured. So many 40+s just AFK in BG because they don’t see what the point in even trying is.

- Limit # attacks on WBs – the same idea as with 3v3 arena. Say maybe 15 a boss. The idea would be to get as much damage as you could in within those 15 attack attempts and get on top of the chart. Would people still use balen respawn? Absolutely, because nobody gets a whole 15 attacks on one boss otherwise. Would people still pay for buffs? Yep, to get more/higher damage on the charts within their 15 attempts and beat everyone else. This would, however, limit the (now potentially infinite) damage that huge cash high levels can do on WBs, dam the gap a little, and leave some gold/daru for everyone else. It also makes it less about speed and more about how much damage you do per round, since rounds are limited – archers have the same damage advantage 1v1, but it gives slower classes like mages/knights a chance.

There’s probably more than this that I’m forgetting, but this is tl;dr enough already. Just some things to think about.

 
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Originally posted by atreylune:


- Give players wings at 50, maybe with 1% and half the stats of the paid ones. Make them look ridiculous if you have to, to make people want to pay for the cooler looking ones. But it’s something at least. The cash wings still give more, but the gap is less wide. It’s also an incentive to hit 50.

- Make a 50-59 BG. Those players who paid their share to get to 45 deserve to rule for a while, even if they didn’t get there first. As is, the money they paid to remain competitive is worthless, as they simply can’t compete due to how the BG is structured. So many 40+s just AFK in BG because they don’t see what the point in even trying is.

- Limit # attacks on WBs – the same idea as with 3v3 arena. Say maybe 15 a boss. The idea would be to get as much damage as you could in within those 15 attack attempts and get on top of the chart. Would people still use balen respawn? Absolutely, because nobody gets a whole 15 attacks on one boss otherwise. Would people still pay for buffs? Yep, to get more/higher damage on the charts within their 15 attempts and beat everyone else. This would, however, limit the (now potentially infinite) damage that huge cash high levels can do on WBs, dam the gap a little, and leave some gold/daru for everyone else. It also makes it less about speed and more about how much damage you do per round, since rounds are limited – archers have the same damage advantage 1v1, but it gives slower classes like mages/knights a chance.

There’s probably more than this that I’m forgetting, but this is tl;dr enough already. Just some things to think about.

Yes to everything you stated.

Please do give free players a way to synth wings. CHN servers currently have a way at version 1.6 to do this but the problem will only continue to fester if nothing is done. Some other ideas: hold a temporary wing-specific sale, make a contest – for all servers – giving these out as prizes, or even place this item on the VIP wheel (don’t hurt me bros!) for awhile.

Please do make another tier for BGs. It can’t be fun getting one-shotted by AOEs or not making a dent in an aggressor’s defense. We’re all but forced to do this for better medallions. It would be a welcome challenge in having to pick and choose instead of bezerking lower-leveled players.

God, please, yes. Under the current mechanics, there is simply no class balance anymore on the world boss – with the advent of buffs, that gap is exorbitantly widened. Something has to be done here. Anything.

 
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The level 50+ bg is really needed, since the lvl 55 pvp set is here, how can a player in the low 40 can survive more then 1 second against a lvl 55 full geared. we definitely need this battle ground for the higher level, at 50. The other point listed out per atreylune are important too. We dont want to lose player.

 
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Ok….I get that Dev’s want to make money. I get that wings is a quick buck but WHY RUIN THE GAME?? people that have no way to get wings will quit because the game is too unbalanced. guild will crumble and friendships will break. this may sound extreme but R2games has just Ruined this game. unless they do something about this problem FAST! the game will never be the same..

Might i suggest that they Imply trading asap. top 5 guild leaders have wings free, and have a low low chance of wings dropping from world boss that are UNBOUND. there really needs to be some other way for non paying players to get wings. that is the most important issue that needs to be changed to save this game.

 
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Between this and January’s part 3 of the patch, non-cash players and even those who pay for VIP are screwed. Seriously, I’m not going to shell out over $20/mo. not to play a flash game, but to have a prayer of remaining remotely competitive in a bottom rung. Let alone shell out extra bonus money for little perks that boost people 2k in stats for no in-game effort. Hell, even Wow still costs $15/mo. and hey, you can even make multiple characters on multiple servers without shelling out another $15! Unlike here where they want $20 for each character!? How about this? I’ll take what would have been 3 months of them trying to juice me for money, and go buy Guild Wars 2…

This game has become no less than a time and money sink and I had VIP, I quit today from both of my servers.

- Ixidora (Server 1 & Server 2)

 
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Originally posted by kaygo:

Ok….I get that Dev’s want to make money. I get that wings is a quick buck but WHY RUIN THE GAME?? people that have no way to get wings will quit because the game is too unbalanced. guild will crumble and friendships will break. this may sound extreme but R2games has just Ruined this game. unless they do something about this problem FAST! the game will never be the same..

Might i suggest that they Imply trading asap. top 5 guild leaders have wings free, and have a low low chance of wings dropping from world boss that are UNBOUND. there really needs to be some other way for non paying players to get wings. that is the most important issue that needs to be changed to save this game.

The problem would be is that wouldn’t they just try and give them to THEIR members and screw everyone else so they could have a greater advantage? They’d make it as difficult as possible for anyone but their members to get them even if they chose to trade or auction them off

 
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Good discussion, guys. Much better than what was going on in-game. Thanks!

 
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I agree with what Atreylune’s points. Half stats wings and all. However, I think that the world boss buff should just be removed altogether. Lower levels typically can put in more attacks in a world boss raids (can’t go all the way to 6 hits per round), and let them continue to do so to increase their rewards. So far the balens revive forces top players them to use balens, thus even the top 10 will be wary of clicking revive the whole way. Limiting the 15 I would agree, but this would be bad for the lower levels who can hit more than 15 without reviving.

Now with the voucher buffs, everything is ridiculous. Smiddy pulling in 2% the first world boss today, and everyone else hits less because of it. Not using vouchers, I move from rank 2x, to 3x now. I guess everyone who don’t spend their vouchers have the same predicament.

 
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Oh and for BG, I can still personally look away from facing names like KE “cough” or Chomo or Dink or Derm, by just hauling. Hence if the segregation is not gonna happen, have honor/point rewards drop even further then where it currently is for hitting lower level players OR increase hauling rewards to encourage it.

 
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Everyone is still missing the real issue. Namely, that there is still no trading mechanic (i.e. “Auction House”) implemented, where “free” players could sell items for Balens. “Balens-only” items would be fine, were it not for the fact that it directly translates to “credit-card-only”, at this point.

I have never spent — and will never spend — money on flash games. I’m considerably more willing, however, to use some amount of my time to obtain items which other people will spend money for, which ultimately ends up in the same place.

Until the developers accept this, the divide between spenders and non-spenders will continue to grow, until the non-spenders quit, and the spenders look around wondering where everyone went. And then they ask for their money back.

That’ll be some time around New Year’s, I expect.

Cheers.

-AffableDalek
Server 1

 
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Let’s explore this a little further. Right now, what balen owners would want to buy or consider from trading that “free” players would possibly have… or from my perspective anyway (* indicates it can be bought in game)

  • Whips
  • Major HP pots (Though medium one goes for gold so I doubt this)
    Legendary Stones
  • Socketing Rods
  • Crypt Keys
    VIP Tokens (I would so gladly take this off from non-VIPs)
    *Full Enchanted PVP Set
    *Luck Stones
    *Gems

Anything else I missed?

Here’s another question, besides VIP tokens (for non-VIPs), legendary stones (for those not intending to upgrade it) and obsolete PVP sets (rather then selling your old one for gold – or the player could be a ‘farmer’ and use millions of gold and some insigs and then sell it for balens), would a normal player sell their other items for balens?

And if I did, what would I use the balens for that I just received?

 
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This is a pretty obvious money grab. R2 must not think this game is going to last long anyway. the monthly fees from VIPs should be enough to pay for servers and staffing. not to mention some of the large amounts I have heard of people spending to reset guild build timers.

you are alienating a large portion of your population. you need people that play this game for free just as much as you need paying players. without one there wont be the other.

here is a link to a 9min video on youtube about how microtransactions should be done. Informative video—→ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WXA559KNopI

 
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See? That’s what has me worried about this entire thing. This isn’t their first game, this isn’t their first time with microtransactions, this also supposedly isn’t the first time they’ve pulled this exact money grab.

 
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I know one guy I talked to who spent $5,000 dollars just in balens because he had nothing better to spend it on. So with people like him I know they’re the minority but still plus them people added to all the VIPs for $8 and whatever else the small spenders may buy you have a good profit if you ask me

 
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And I would gladly trade VIP tokens for most anything!! But it only lets me sell em for 1 gold apiece x_x

 
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Originally posted by Death1698:

I know one guy I talked to who spent $5,000 dollars just in balens because he had nothing better to spend it on. So with people like him I know they’re the minority but still plus them people added to all the VIPs for $8 and whatever else the small spenders may buy you have a good profit if you ask me

He had nothing better to spend it on? I would’ve bought groceries, full games, maybe a new tv, a new gaming computer. Point being there’s a lot better things to spend $5k on than this money hungry flash game company.

 
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Originally posted by tacoes:
Originally posted by Death1698:

I know one guy I talked to who spent $5,000 dollars just in balens because he had nothing better to spend it on. So with people like him I know they’re the minority but still plus them people added to all the VIPs for $8 and whatever else the small spenders may buy you have a good profit if you ask me

He had nothing better to spend it on? I would’ve bought groceries, full games, maybe a new tv, a new gaming computer. Point being there’s a lot better things to spend $5k on than this money hungry flash game company.

I aagree with you but HE had nothing better to spend it on not me tell him about Tacoes I completely agree with you

 
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I’d wager that they have another game in the works… that’s the only way they would do something so obviously short sided. Or, they might just be idiots.

 
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Originally posted by balesKY33:

I’d wager that they have another game in the works… that’s the only way they would do something so obviously short sided. Or, they might just be idiots.

It might be they’re coming out with free wings soon or maybe they just thought that people wouldn’t care who knows?

 
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Before the latest update, I enjoyed this game as a non-paying player. But the balance between pay/no-pay was already skewed too heavily towards cash players. Since so much is about the competition between players (both Arenas, GB, BG, mines, etc.), no-pay players had a severe handicap across many different aspects of the game. Time and effort alone can’t make up the gap created by pay-only benefits.

With the part 2 update, and again with what will be coming in part 3, the imbalance is worse. I’m not bothered that R2 is trying to make money off the game. I’m bothered how they are trying to make money off this game. It’s too much for me to be able to enjoy playing any more.

Thanks to all in the community who made playing fun, and good luck to any non-payers who stick with it.

-Tloo, Server 1