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Talent System Discussion page 3

106 posts

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Originally posted by KnowingEyes:
Originally posted by Wredniak:

So i did triggered the mage’s focus after at least 60 lightnings and when i mouse over the icon (cool icon btw) it showed me it’s 30% rage reduction not 50% as described in the talent screen. I don’t know how much rage was actually used as at the same time castinator popped up. Clearly one of 2 descriptions is wrong.

You got it. There’s a number of issues going on. Sorry. :(

Another issue is agoran shield being penetrated.

I have been noticing this too. I just figured I was laggy. That is redic…..

 
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hmm…. i haven’t tried the “increase slasher skill damage by 3% to know if it’s actually critical damage +3% instead.” If it is …. =( who’s doing the translations?

As for the new talents, i’m quite fond of it as a knight. It has increased my pvp abilities, and made knights a slightly better choice to choose for. Back in Nov-mid Dec, 2012, all i keep hearing from various knights in the server were "Archers/Mages OP [They still are at wb (2-3 times faster the gold and daru income than knights that hit 23k rewards per battle at level 58 with bp 38000), Mages kill faster in bg too- 1 hit kill all, 1st to spill blood, farming honor speed faster than knights.)

If it weren’t for World’s Prosperity exp boost, most knights would suffer like how many other veteran knights did back in the days. Slow leveling, constant getting picked by archers/mages below 40-. Back before Jan 2013, there were less than a handful of knights in top 100, most of the other 91+ were all archers/ mages. Few would even consider the knight class and the knight class was the easiest to pick on in battleground.

Before the availability of GardenOfDeath 50-55 or TarratonLair 55-60, one doesn’t event need a knight to do MP runs. 3 mages+ 1 archer as tank can do a nightmare(40-50) just fine. Knights were left out to create parties like 3 knights for cross-server arenas, or having no fixed parties for MP_runs, often scrapping 1-2 available runs whenever they can. It’s like begging for someone to let them do Mp_runs. More so if they aren’t in a guild with higher ups to help them. It was just excruciating pain-leveling.

As of current, with talents and survived few knights breaching through level 55+, getting stronger by the % increase/decrease in stats, all i keep reading/hearing about are “these knights’ talent are OP”, “knights skill should be tuned down”, “Mages/Archers need more boost”, it’s like keeping the knight class oppressed. If one figures the game mechanics, as time drags on, knights get more power in terms of % boost, and mages/archers not quite so. Archers have 40% critical chance excluding stat to begin with, passive and skill set together since the early beginning of game.

Hence, i think the talent system is just fine and balanced as it is.

 
Flag Post
Originally posted by dajaney:
Originally posted by KnowingEyes:
Originally posted by Wredniak:

So i did triggered the mage’s focus after at least 60 lightnings and when i mouse over the icon (cool icon btw) it showed me it’s 30% rage reduction not 50% as described in the talent screen. I don’t know how much rage was actually used as at the same time castinator popped up. Clearly one of 2 descriptions is wrong.

You got it. There’s a number of issues going on. Sorry. :(

Another issue is agoran shield being penetrated.

I have been noticing this too. I just figured I was laggy. That is redic…..

It’s been confirmed – the shield animation is slow to be removed. No issue. :)

 
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Anyone saw working Persistence? I have it for 3 days, but seems like it never triggered.

 
Flag Post
Originally posted by shozeg:

Anyone saw working Persistence? I have it for 3 days, but seems like it never triggered.

Does it let you know the % chance when you get the skill or is it just known as a ‘chance’ the skill will work?

 
Flag Post
Originally posted by Bev0:

Does it let you know the % chance when you get the skill or is it just known as a ‘chance’ the skill will work?

only “Has a chance to reflect 10% damage…”

 
Flag Post
Originally posted by shozeg:
Originally posted by Bev0:

Does it let you know the % chance when you get the skill or is it just known as a ‘chance’ the skill will work?

only “Has a chance to reflect 10% damage…”

Well that’s ridiculous. Is there any reason they can’t tell us the likelihood of that talent working?

 
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Tyranny for the knight is not damage* skill +3%, rather it’s skill critical* (which they forgot to write in) +3%.

 
Flag Post
Originally posted by Bev0:
Originally posted by shozeg:
Originally posted by Bev0:

Does it let you know the % chance when you get the skill or is it just known as a ‘chance’ the skill will work?

only “Has a chance to reflect 10% damage…”

Well that’s ridiculous. Is there any reason they can’t tell us the likelihood of that talent working?

it would be awesome to get more facts in the skill description about percentages on each skill level, maybe even in advance, it would have saves me quite a few vouchers personally…

i learned the “puncture” talent yesterday (has a chance to cause bleeding on whirlwind) and it almost never triggers. i was expecting it to “eventually” activate every now and then, but it seems to be more likely to dodge 6 attacks in a row than to get ONE bleeding effect for me.

for example: in 20 solo arena attempts yesterday, using ww on turn 3 each battle which hit the opponent as well as his knights/angels it triggered twice on one single target out of three (if you use ww/puncture and FINALLY get the effect, it does not add the bleeding to all targets that were hit but instead every single one has an individual chance, making this skill even worse yet again).

overall i hope that they adjust the skill description/translations in the near future for more clarity on how exactly the machanics work because as of now it just seems like a huge waste of gold, exp and in the end vouchers if you learn a skill just to realize it does not work the way it is intended to or is obviously crap on low ranks.

 
Flag Post
Originally posted by Lunto:
Originally posted by Bev0:
Originally posted by shozeg:
Originally posted by Bev0:

Does it let you know the % chance when you get the skill or is it just known as a ‘chance’ the skill will work?

only “Has a chance to reflect 10% damage…”

Well that’s ridiculous. Is there any reason they can’t tell us the likelihood of that talent working?

i agree, i learned the “puncture” talent yesterday (has a chance to cause bleeding on whirlwind) and it almost never triggers. i was expecting it to “eventually” activate every now and then, but it seems to be more likely to dodge 6 attacks in a row than to get ONE bleeding effect for me.

for example: in 20 solo arena attempts yesterday, using ww on turn 3 each battle which hit the opponent as well as his knights/angels it triggered twice on one single target out of three (if you use ww/puncture and FINALLY get the effect, it does not add the bleeding to all targets that were hit but instead every single one has an individual chance, making this skill even worse yet again).

overall i hope that they adjust the skill description/translations in the near future for more clarity on how exactly the machanics work because as of now it just seems like a huge waste of gold, exp and in the end vouchers if you learn a skill just to realize it does not work the way it is intended to or is obviously crap on low ranks.

It also gives a very low damage output. Bryant’s AI does 105 points per round. Not sure how 20% works into that figure but it cemented the deal for me not to use it in its current state.

 
Flag Post
Originally posted by KnowingEyes:
Originally posted by Lunto:
Originally posted by Bev0:
Originally posted by shozeg:
Originally posted by Bev0:

Does it let you know the % chance when you get the skill or is it just known as a ‘chance’ the skill will work?

only “Has a chance to reflect 10% damage…”

Well that’s ridiculous. Is there any reason they can’t tell us the likelihood of that talent working?

i agree, i learned the “puncture” talent yesterday (has a chance to cause bleeding on whirlwind) and it almost never triggers. i was expecting it to “eventually” activate every now and then, but it seems to be more likely to dodge 6 attacks in a row than to get ONE bleeding effect for me.

for example: in 20 solo arena attempts yesterday, using ww on turn 3 each battle which hit the opponent as well as his knights/angels it triggered twice on one single target out of three (if you use ww/puncture and FINALLY get the effect, it does not add the bleeding to all targets that were hit but instead every single one has an individual chance, making this skill even worse yet again).

overall i hope that they adjust the skill description/translations in the near future for more clarity on how exactly the machanics work because as of now it just seems like a huge waste of gold, exp and in the end vouchers if you learn a skill just to realize it does not work the way it is intended to or is obviously crap on low ranks.

It also gives a very low damage output. Bryant’s AI does 105 points per round. Not sure how 20% works into that figure but it cemented the deal for me not to use it in its current state.

i actually thought 20% PATK bleeding is pretty cool if it triggered consistently (maybe 40-50% chance) and would work with will destroyer. it wouldn´t be “huge” of course, but fair enough to invest the talent point(s).

as of now, the talent is really bad of course though i agree^^

 
Flag Post
Originally posted by Tetsuo_Shima:

As far as I can tell, the archer talents are pretty lame, the mage talents are marginally better and the knight talents overpower both other classes’ talents by a pretty big margin.

Ehm, really?
Knight’s talents are useless…only iron wall is a good talent, and maybe second wind will be, but at high lv.
Others talents have that “has a chance” that means “it works one time every 20 attemps”…
And persistence is a trap…you can think “Oh good, i heal with block yet, now i can reverse damage”; but to have more chance of block you need a high block, and high block means low damage received, so low damage reversed…
How should rebounding 100\150 damage be good?

 
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Any archers feel Scrutiny is worth getting before lvl 65?

 
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im a healing mage… and i took a skill called calleousness… where it decreases delphic.. which yayayada sucks b/c rarely anyone ever uses it or skills it.. i dont even have it… but one thing i wanted from the talent was the 5% absorbtion sheild… i am a healing mage.. and i have pretty amazing dammage for a free healing mage… i can make top 10 in arena with players 9 levels higher than me.. but.. the skill i wanted was the absorbtion shield.. so far me experimenting with it.. it does a 20% reduction of my next spell.. but no absorbtion shield…

im trying to figure out is this talent broken.. or i need to put 1 more talent point into it… i have the bare minimum..5 and 1 into callousness ..

anyone have an answer for this… other than…dr of 5% all the rest of the skills except this one i took look worth taking.. any ideas anyone?

 
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keg

so you use delphic hell thunder often then? you know that skill costs 100 rage right?

and 5% of you max hp if you had 30k hp would be a 1500 hp shield for 3 turns, which isnt much imo

so tell me please what does lv2 callousness do? -12 sec cd & 6% shield?

 
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just putting it out here, some of it has been said before.

basically, you level Seal up to 5, then take 1 point in 5% decrease dmg, then next is work Seal up to 15. this is just a standard Talent levelling strat.

as previous posters have mentioned, there are 2 level points to begin considering the Basic Strat:

i) after hitting lv60, so you get both your 55pvp gear and 6th astral slot first.

ii) right off the bat at lv50, so you can stun higher levels and (potentially) win them in duels/bg/gb.

for knights, Seal also allows you to hit the opponent hero before ww, which is a fairly big move imo. for archers/mages, Seal still gives a guaranteed hit on opponent hero, so if your first few moves completely missed the enemy hero (not so likely for mages), you could fire off a Seal and at least get some dmg in.

one question tho: how exactly does 5% reduce dmg stack with Goddess? is it additive (5% + 9%=14% reduce total)? or multiplicative (5% + [0.09*95%]=13.55%)? this game certainly leaves out plenty of details… i think they hate mathcrafters.

 
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In experience from some previous kong games, different % reduce/increase are multiplicative.
Additive reduction would get out of control.
30% astral(for numbers I have heard about(source unverified) red astral, 50%!), 20% medallion, 5% talent, 30% block.
85% additive (105% for red astral theory) vs 62% multiplicative (73% red astral theory).

 
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@alveolate: I will add to that question:
For knights, how does 5% reduction from talents stack with % dmg astral reduction and with Tenacity skill (also % dmg reduction)?

Some knights tell me it doesn’t stack at all, some that it does, but no idea how… and some just have no idea.

 
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Whenever I read “has a chance” I am thinking of 10%.

 
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Originally posted by Atombender:

Whenever I read “has a chance” I am thinking of 10%.

yet for Holy Seal it also says “higher chance to stun those with lower level seal” or something along those lines. if your seal is lower level than your target’s, you will NEVER stun him.

the other chance based talents are varied, and as someone pointed out, the Knight’s Slasher talent actually increases crit chance… so it’s “chance to increase crit chance”. they really need better translators.

 
Flag Post

Focus for mages clearly states that lightning has a 5% chance to trigger it, and it lasts for 2 turns reducing rage consumption by 50%.
THIS IS FALSE. in battle it is only 30%.

scroll over it when its active and you will see it as 30%,
suntoria will cost 21 rage instead of 30,
Restoration will cost 26 instead of 35 rage.

 
Flag Post
Originally posted by thedog1:

Focus for mages clearly states that lightning has a 5% chance to trigger it, and it lasts for 2 turns reducing rage consumption by 50%.
THIS IS FALSE. in battle it is only 30%.

scroll over it when its active and you will see it as 30%,
suntoria will cost 21 rage instead of 30,
Restoration will cost 26 instead of 35 rage.

indeed…which makes the talent pretty useless tbh…

 
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Just for anyone who is curious, each level of talent is +60K gold/3M XP beyond the levels I initially posted.

 
Flag Post
Originally posted by alveolate:
Originally posted by Atombender:

Whenever I read “has a chance” I am thinking of 10%.

yet for Holy Seal it also says “higher chance to stun those with lower level seal” or something along those lines. if your seal is lower level than your target’s, you will NEVER stun him.

the other chance based talents are varied, and as someone pointed out, the Knight’s Slasher talent actually increases crit chance… so it’s “chance to increase crit chance”. they really need better translators.

Definitely. So much in-game Engrish and wrong tool tips, it’s really annoying.

 
Flag Post
Originally posted by KnowingEyes:
Originally posted by Lunto:
Originally posted by Bev0:
Originally posted by shozeg:
Originally posted by Bev0:

Does it let you know the % chance when you get the skill or is it just known as a ‘chance’ the skill will work?

only “Has a chance to reflect 10% damage…”

Well that’s ridiculous. Is there any reason they can’t tell us the likelihood of that talent working?

i agree, i learned the “puncture” talent yesterday (has a chance to cause bleeding on whirlwind) and it almost never triggers. i was expecting it to “eventually” activate every now and then, but it seems to be more likely to dodge 6 attacks in a row than to get ONE bleeding effect for me.

for example: in 20 solo arena attempts yesterday, using ww on turn 3 each battle which hit the opponent as well as his knights/angels it triggered twice on one single target out of three (if you use ww/puncture and FINALLY get the effect, it does not add the bleeding to all targets that were hit but instead every single one has an individual chance, making this skill even worse yet again).

overall i hope that they adjust the skill description/translations in the near future for more clarity on how exactly the machanics work because as of now it just seems like a huge waste of gold, exp and in the end vouchers if you learn a skill just to realize it does not work the way it is intended to or is obviously crap on low ranks.

It also gives a very low damage output. Bryant’s AI does 105 points per round. Not sure how 20% works into that figure but it cemented the deal for me not to use it in its current state.


Yep, ditched that thing by now. Seems best to grab Iron Wall and put everything else in seal. I said it weeks ago, but Knight talents are just as useless as everyone else’s. No idea where people thought they were overpowered. I still don’t see it.