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"Worthless" Astrals

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Enhanced Ruthlessness – Assume regularly you do +-10% from your attack/2. At level 1 (7%), this astral makes you do +-17%, which results in the same average damage over time.

In order to improve: Make the damage be straight up added to your +-%, therefore, a 7% Ruthlessness astral would make you do -3%, +17% from your attack/2. A level 5, 35% ruthlessness would make you do 25%-35% from your attack/2. This greatly increase the usefulness of this astral. (Maybe OP so the % could be changed to 5%/level, because that would put it on par with enhanced willdestroyer)


Pristine Brilliance – 2500 more health at level 5

In order to improve: Buff to 1k health/level (or maybe more?)

Edit Or introduce a new class of astrals that give % gains (1% per level) for health, mattack, mdef, pdef, etc.


Refined Blessed Health – at level 1, there’s a 10% chance to gain 400hp.

In order to improve: Either buff the amount healed, or the % to 25%


Enhanced Regeneration – at level 1, there’s a 10% chance to heal 10% of damage dealt.

To improve: Increase % to 25%

Edit 25% may be OP. 15-20% is more reasonable.
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Enhanced Deflection – At level 1, 10% trigger rate for 10% damage reflection.

To improve: this could be a really good astral at level 5 if the trigger rate was 25%

Thoughts? I feel like the suggested changes make these other astrals on par with the def, attack, crit astrals.

 
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Enchanced Ruth = maybe

Pristine Brilliance = 4% per level would be great (level 5 = 20%, assuming you have like 15k health at higher level, it would make some diference)

Refined Blessed = Nah 25% would be too op, but maybe 15%?

Enchanced Regen = Op, maybe 15%

Enchanced Deflection = Op, maybe 15%

 
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Originally posted by mschurma:

Enhanced Ruthlessness – Assume regularly you do +-10% from your attack/2. At level 1 (7%), this astral makes you do +-17%, which results in the same average damage over time.

In order to improve: Make the damage be straight up added to your +-%, therefore, a 7% Ruthlessness astral would make you do -3%, +17% from your attack/2. A level 5, 35% ruthlessness would make you do 25%-35% from your attack/2. This greatly increase the usefulness of this astral. (Maybe OP so the % could be changed to 5%/level, because that would put it on par with enhanced willdestroyer)

So what would be the benefit of using a lv 5 Will Destroyer (25% dmg, cannot crit) over this version of lv 5 Ruthlessness (+25-35%, crits allowed)?

Better might be expanding the damage range like: -3% min dmg / 5% max dmg per level. So at level 5, you’d get 75% minimum, 135% maximum (vs the 90-110% usual range), and your average would still go up a bit, since your max went up more than your min went down. (Also, unstackable with WD.)

Pristine Brilliance should be 1% HP/lvl for purple, 2% HP/lvl for orange or so.

Refined Blessed Health should have a higher proc rate than Enhanced Regeneration to counter the huge healing difference between %-based and flat-rate healing (once you start hitting for 5 figures, it’s a big gap). Leave ER as is, buff RBH’s proc rate to compensate.

And I think Deflection is always kinda going to be either useless or OP, as it’s dependent on your enemy’s damage and not any of the user’s stats.

 
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Originally posted by atreylune:
Originally posted by mschurma:

Enhanced Ruthlessness – Assume regularly you do +-10% from your attack/2. At level 1 (7%), this astral makes you do +-17%, which results in the same average damage over time.

In order to improve: Make the damage be straight up added to your +-%, therefore, a 7% Ruthlessness astral would make you do -3%, +17% from your attack/2. A level 5, 35% ruthlessness would make you do 25%-35% from your attack/2. This greatly increase the usefulness of this astral. (Maybe OP so the % could be changed to 5%/level, because that would put it on par with enhanced willdestroyer)

So what would be the benefit of using a lv 5 Will Destroyer (25% dmg, cannot crit) over this version of lv 5 Ruthlessness (+25-35%, crits allowed)?

Better might be expanding the damage range like: -3% min dmg / 5% max dmg per level. So at level 5, you’d get 75% minimum, 135% maximum (vs the 90-110% usual range), and your average would still go up a bit, since your max went up more than your min went down. (Also, unstackable with WD.)

Pristine Brilliance should be 1% HP/lvl for purple, 2% HP/lvl for orange or so.

Refined Blessed Health should have a higher proc rate than Enhanced Regeneration to counter the huge healing difference between %-based and flat-rate healing (once you start hitting for 5 figures, it’s a big gap). Leave ER as is, buff RBH’s proc rate to compensate.

And I think Deflection is always kinda going to be either useless or OP, as it’s dependent on your enemy’s damage and not any of the user’s stats.

The benefit would be you could run both at the same time. However, they could simply scale back the % per level to 3% so its not quite as good. Either way, something needs to be done so this astral helps your average damage, because keeping it constant (how it is now) is simply, useless.

I like your idea for a Pristine Brilliance, but since mattack, mdef, etc etc are all flat gains, shouldn’t health be kept as a flat gain too? Unless you think they should implement a whole new type of astral with % increases.

I agree with your blessed health/etc thoughts.

Deflection could allow lower levels to have a chance vs. higher levels but yea. Either worthless or OP.

 
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Replying here because the quoting system is a pain, but +25% with WD (or enhanced Determination) with another 15% from Ruthlessness would be OP as heck. Why bother with it if it doesn’t do something unique that Determination or WD doesn’t already do? They shouldn’t be stackable, basically.

The P/M/Atk/Def stuff kinda works, because even at higher levels, +1080 is going to be significant (even at level 50, it’s about +20-25%). 2500 HP out of 35-40k is like 5% though, at level 5.

If it’s a flat number, it should be +1080 per level (which is +216 x 5) – which seems random, except that’s straight from gems – lv 5 patk is +176, lv 5 HP is +880 – it’s at a x5 scale already everywhere else.

(Sorry for all the edits, people are distracting me. :P)

 
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Originally posted by mschurma:

Enhanced Ruthlessness – Assume regularly you do +-10% from your attack/2. At level 1 (7%), this astral makes you do +-17%, which results in the same average damage over time.

In order to improve: Make the damage be straight up added to your +-%, therefore, a 7% Ruthlessness astral would make you do -3%, +17% from your attack/2. A level 5, 35% ruthlessness would make you do 25%-35% from your attack/2. This greatly increase the usefulness of this astral. (Maybe OP so the % could be changed to 5%/level, because that would put it on par with enhanced willdestroyer)

Agreed. Something, anything, needs to be done about this astral, even if it’s underpowered. From what I can gather, it’s purpose was to “take out mobs in potentially X-1 rounds”. That assumes the mobs we are talking about are non-Boss or trash mobs. If so, it doesn’t justify taking up a slot.

Originally posted by mschurma:

Pristine Brilliance – 2500 more health at level 5

In order to improve: Buff to 1k health/level (or maybe more?)

Edit Or introduce a new class of astrals that give % gains (1% per level) for health, mattack, mdef, pdef, etc.

The game is about small increments. 2500 health for me would be just under 5%. What else is at this figure? Scrolls. Are scrolls underpowered? My opinion is it’s fine as-is.

Originally posted by mschurma:

Refined Blessed Health – at level 1, there’s a 10% chance to gain 400hp.

In order to improve: Either buff the amount healed, or the % to 25%

I admit, this one is underpowered. However, there is a corresponding dual set of orange astrals that also suffer from this issue: “Aegis Major” and “Refined Goddess Blessing”. Tweak it a bit depending on what the number crunchers come up with.

Originally posted by mschurma:

Enhanced Regeneration – at level 1, there’s a 10% chance to heal 10% of damage dealt.

To improve: Increase % to 25%

Edit 25% may be OP. 15-20% is more reasonable.
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Erm, no. Each level is an additional 10% of the damage you deal. Increases of percentage will cause this to get overpowered quickly as the levels increase linearly. Though I’d love for this to be boosted to the amounts you’d like, it’s pretty decent @ “the standard level 5”. As a quick example, think of the BG. Angel takers might feel offended now that knight troop users have a godly astral that allows healing. They, the angel users, may quickly state, “but we already sacrificed quite a bit for the angels… to heal 2k-ish @ 20% while they (the knight users) get over double (or more!) the effectiveness of the angels?”

Originally posted by mschurma:

Enhanced Deflection – At level 1, 10% trigger rate for 10% damage reflection.

To improve: this could be a really good astral at level 5 if the trigger rate was 25%

I think Bryant nailed this perfectly. Some classes would consider this a godsend while others would ditch. Not sure how to handle this one but one aspect to note is that the game usually rewards pure offense.

 
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Originally posted by mschurma:

Pristine Brilliance – 2500 more health at level 5

In order to improve: Buff to 1k health/level (or maybe more?)

Purple brilliance is 400HP/lvl, so orange should be 600HP/lvl, just like orange Matk/Patk/Mdef/Pdef is +50% of purple.
Comparison with gems makes sense though.


Originally posted by mschurma:

Refined Blessed Health – at level 1, there’s a 10% chance to gain 400hp.

In order to improve: Either buff the amount healed, or the % to 25%

Orange def is 216 Mdef or Pdef, reducing either physiscal or magical damage by 108. So this one should heal 54 on average, so 10% to heal 540.


Originally posted by mschurma:

Enhanced Regeneration – at level 1, there’s a 10% chance to heal 10% of damage dealt.

To improve: Increase % to 25%

Edit 25% may be OP. 15-20% is more reasonable.


Enhanced Deflection – At level 1, 10% trigger rate for 10% damage reflection.

To improve: this could be a really good astral at level 5 if the trigger rate was 25%


Orange Goddess Blessing reduces damage by 3%, so orange regen should heal for 3% in average, so 10% to heal for 30% of damage.
Orange will destroyer increase dmg by 5% but removes crit. Deflect increases your damage by a % of your opponent’s and have no drawback, so 25% trigger rate seems fine.

 
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Originally posted by mschurma:

Enhanced Ruthlessness – Assume regularly you do +-10% from your attack/2. At level 1 (7%), this astral makes you do +-17%, which results in the same average damage over time.

This is arena astral. It give you chance kill one random enemy faster (Ruthless AOE followed up with Ultimate Slasher/other AOE’s).

Those changes OP, especially later, after you get much more slots for astrals. And we still don’t know about talents – they are can change everything.

 
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Originally posted by relict7:
Originally posted by mschurma:

Enhanced Ruthlessness – Assume regularly you do +-10% from your attack/2. At level 1 (7%), this astral makes you do +-17%, which results in the same average damage over time.

This is arena astral. It give you chance kill one random enemy faster (Ruthless AOE followed up with Ultimate Slasher/other AOE’s).

Those changes OP, especially later, after you get much more slots for astrals. And we still don’t know about talents – they are can change everything.

But what if you “underhit” another opponent? Over time, it just doesn’t appear to give any benefit – any long term benefit as most other astrals do. :(

 
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I simply see the Enhanced Ruthlessness astral as a sort of gamble. Then again, astrals such as Refined Blessed Health and Enhanced Regeneration are also somewhat of a gamble.

What makes Enhanced Ruthlessness the worst of them all, though, is that there is a chance for the astral to be a hindrance on your damage – whereas with the other astrals you simply deal normal damage with no benefits.

 
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Originally posted by End_Of_Ends:

I simply see the Enhanced Ruthlessness astral as a sort of gamble. Then again, astrals such as Refined Blessed Health and Enhanced Regeneration are also somewhat of a gamble.

What makes Enhanced Ruthlessness the worst of them all, though, is that there is a chance for the astral to be a hindrance on your damage – whereas with the other astrals you simply deal normal damage with no benefits.

exactly! which is why i think the bonuses should be added to your min damage instead of just expanding your min.

 
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I did 10k damage reflect to bloodfang with the reflect astral when he used hes “ultimate”.

 
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Originally posted by henri2012:

I did 10k damage reflect to bloodfang with the reflect astral when he used hes “ultimate”.

i’ve heard that doesn’t actually count as damage “you dealt” though. Therefore, the deflection astral takes away gold/daru a player could get.

 
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I’d think Godess blessing is pretty darn useless as well, other than maybe against archers in pvp

Edit: oops, meant guardian angel/enhanced guardian angel

 
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Originally posted by gruntarswe:

I’d think Godess blessing is pretty darn useless as well, other than maybe against archers in pvp

If you’re specifically referring to goddess blessing, it’s a lower levelled version of aegis major / refined godess blessing. So relative to them, yes, it is useless..

 
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oops, kinda wrote the wrong one