Mardek 3 vs. Epic Battle Fantasy 3 page 7

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I’m just going to say this:

Epic Battle Fantasy 3 does not deserve to be on the top rated list. Way too unoriginal, not nearly enough fun.

 
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Mardk’s story isn’t great

What’s Mardk??

it makes you keep that useless crap for longer than otherwise necessary just to get skills out of it.

So you’ve got to learn every bleedin’ skill??
My complaint was that the random battles were excessive and made progressing anywhere slow and tedious, and you insisted that wasn’t a problem because you could just skip them —except, oops, turns out you can’t.

Yes, you could skip ‘em and then be pwn’d by the bossez.

 
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First you say oh no, all those random battles are unnecessary

Let’s pay attention. You are arguing different things here. You first don’t want grinding. Easy. Don’t do it. Simply move from quest to quest. This is effectively not grinding, even if you battle in between. Then you state “but I don’t want to do all those battles!”. Easy. Skip them. And then you say “zomga I didn’t battle anyone so the boss is too hard!”. I’ll restate my earlier point. You can’t expect to skip all battles and then completely wipe every boss you meet. That’s stupid.

and now you’re admitting that they’re necessary after all.

I’ll restate yet again an earlier point, because this is completely ridiculous. Do you want to watch a movie? That’s where you don’t need to do anything. You can just see them do all the things without worry over screwing up. Oh, right, no, you want to play EBF 3 where you gain 30 levels over beating a single enemy. I’m sure that is valid criticism.

My complaint was that the random battles were excessive and made progressing anywhere slow and tedious, and you insisted that wasn’t a problem because you could just skip them —except, oops, turns out you can’t.

You are completely missing the point. Battles aren’t “excessive”. When you’re used to a hacked server in WoW where you achieve maximum level with a single critter kill, sure, but that is and should not be the goal of any game. There is a lot of battles you can skip and you will still be able to beat the boss. You can’t skip all of them, and frankly, I dearly hope you weren’t expecting that, but you can still skip a fair number.

Thank you for making my point for me.

You know you can only state this when I actually do. Since I didn’t, quite a suggestive statement.

EBF eliminates random battles entirely and enables you to progress sufficiently with only a handful of battles per area

Which is the problem with players these days. They all want easy stuff, gaining impossible badges within a few seconds, and not having to bother at all with a game. EBF 3 is for such kids. Mardek let’s people choose whether or not they want to fight. There will be a certain number of battles required, of course, but that is entirely part of the game. Again, to expect you can beat all bosses without a single random battle is ridiculous.

and allows you to choose when and where and even whom you fight.

Not really. All you see is one of the enemies. You don’t know if he’s supported by four of his buddies, four dangerous allies, another three waves to beat, or if he’s actually alone.

Mardek, on the other hand, spams the hell out of you with random battles

This is to ensure that those who actually want to fight them get a chance. Those who don’t can easily press or even hold the Z button. No sweat. They are not forced.

and is stingy enough with the experience and advancement points to make damned sure you have to do them all and then some.

1. Again, you may be one of those players wanting an easy game with an easy impossible badge. Mardek actually lets you fight a bit before earning something.
2. AP is more than enough, except maybe the first few levels (you start with 3 and need 6 for a passive skill). You don’t need more. It’s only to make the battle easier, which is, I’ll restate, another problem with players these days.

Having to shop

Which you have to do in EBF 3 as well.

I have no idea how this is bad in any way. You earn the in-game currency and find yourself some fitting items, then move on. Almost every RPG has this.

and swap equipment

Which you have to do even more in EBF 3.

Again, what is bad about this? Are you expecting to cakewalk through the game?

and manage a large inventory of mostly useless crap

..you know you can sell stuff, right? Aside from that, before you come to another savepoint, your character inventory isn’t filled yet, so you can easily transfer that which you don’t need into the savepoint inventory and/or sell everything you don’t need.

EBF3 has a single set of equipment that each has various advantages and disadvantages, allowing you to customize your gear to your play style and the enemies you’ll face.

What? Be consistent, man. Either you like swapping equipment, or you don’t. Frankly, I hated how they did it in EBF 3. You had to move through several screens before you could even change one type of equipment on one character. Repeat. In Mardek? You have one inventory, which you can sort, and you can just change your entire equipment from there. Easy. And you don’t need to do it as much as you seem to imply.

Also, I used maybe 2-3 of each type of equipment for each character. The rest wasn’t worth swapping to/upgrading. So much for your “theory”. I also had no idea what you could upgrade your equipment into. Is level 5 going to be 100% defense? 50%? How should I know? What specials do you gain from having level 4-5? This is all clear when buying items in Mardek, and especially when forging special items.

Mardek? Surprise, surprise, nowhere near so convenient or hassle-free.

Pardon? Click that little “sort” and it’s sorted. Done. The only reason it isn’t automatically is that you can choose to sort it in a different way yourself, if you want to. You think selling is inconvenient? Really?

Not only do you have equipment that becomes outdated, necessitating dumping it off at shops to get it off your hands, it makes you keep that useless crap for longer than otherwise necessary just to get skills out of it.

1. Again, I have no idea where you get the notion selling things is bad. In fact, it degrades EBF 3. It’s a vital part of an RPG.
2. Wait, what? Not all the skills are necessary and the core skills generally can be learned from multiple items any way. And if you don’t want that equipment, then obviously you don’t want the skill. Being able to master it is only an extra. In EBF 3? You don’t gain anything of any equipment unless you have it on. Are you going to complain you no longer have that +20% evasion when you equip a better one which instead has -20% evasion?

actually makes you manage FOUR SEPARATE inventories, one per character, just to make sure everyone has usable items in battle.

You’re doing something wrong. Not nearly all of your characters are going to be used for giving potions to others. The rest of the inventory is unnecessary to use. You can drop everything in Mardek, except some of the potions. How do you call it “management” if you equally drop potions in everyone’s inventory and be done with it?

instead of enjoying the game

Funny how I enjoy Mardek and hate EBF 3. I’ll admit I hate it less than EBF 2, which has just a ridiculous impossible badge.

Mardek needs to clear up some serious flaws before it can claim even to be good, let alone great.

Oh, there are always things to improve on. Just that your issues with the game are self-inflicted, false, capable of being removed, or just you expecting an EBF clone.

 
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It’s less on serious flaws and more of design issues, the way I understood what he said. Flaws appear to be more “Bug/exploit” connected (but not always the case).

 
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I liked mardek more despite i spent 40 hours to it. ebf 3 was just too short completed in 8 hours and only problem was akron

 
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I actually like both series, though EBF only became relatively decent/good with the second one, while Mardek has been pretty solid throughout. I also like how completed save files transfer over in Mardek, which provides continuity. Granted, EBF3 is no Other M when it comes to relearning everything, but that doesn’t mean that there is a truly concrete meshing between the two games.

If you ask me, I like EBF for its quirkiness. Some people don’t like how it treats a storyline, but I received it as a breath of fresh air. Hey, it sure beats Sonny’s storyline. Simple gameplay, simple controls, passable graphics, Bob’s your uncle, Fanny’s your aunt.

On the other hand, I like Mardek because its design generates a more authentic RPG experience. While EBF felt like an (obviously) inferior rendition of Grandia, Mardek felt like the FFs of yore (that’s prior to 7, mind you all). It’s hard to describe in words, but take my word for it when I say it feels more RPG-y than EBF does.

I do, however, want to address something Darkruler brought up:

I also had no idea what you could upgrade your equipment into. Is level 5 going to be 100% defense? 50%? How should I know? What specials do you gain from having level 4-5? This is all clear when buying items in Mardek, and especially when forging special items.
If you were able to forge the next level, the empty box next to the “current stats” box would show whatever upgrades would end up on the equipment. Then again, the text was way too small to notice easily.

 
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I think it’s time to bring some life back into this thread. Personally, I like both series, but in my opinion, EBF is much better than Mardek. And no, it’s not because of bosoms.

kupo’s game shows much more polish in not only the graphics and music etc., but also in the gameplay. While Mardek just throws pesky random encounters at you (And a lot, too. No, I’m not exaggerating. Even if you skip the optional encounters, that only skips about 1/4 of the random encounters. Plus during quests all encounters are pretty much required whenever you’re in a dungeon), EBF allows you to choose what monsters you want to battle and when.

The battles in Mardek are more like arcade minigames in the sense that success depends more on whether you can mash a button in a certain time slot than whether you can actually think. Even if you unequip the reactions, all the battles, except for bosses and marathon-health enemies(in which they’re pretty much required), still seem fairly easy. Worse, random encounters can happen in the most inconvenient places, like in front of a save crystal or chest, and although it doesn’t take much from the gameplay, it can be plain annoying. The reactions make Mardek worse by actually rewarding you with experience for doing them correctly. While people are complaining that EBF has a no penalty flee, they don’t seem to notice that in Mardek you can just attack and cast a spell a few times, then flee unharmed with undeserved XP before the enemy can attack.

I like EBF in the sense that it’s more tactically minded. Always starting first ensures that the player has some time to assess the enemies and plan out a strategy. Having only three characters gets the player acquainted with the advantages/disadvantages each one can present. Each skill has both benefits and costs to the player; for example, Matt’s Legend, although it can deal out multiple strikes, costs a lot of MP to use, and Natz’s Black Hole Limit Break can kill the party as well as the monsters. Using some skills is vital to surviving certain battles: for example, Regen helps you recover HP when a monster deals heavy damage regularly and undoes Freeze and Revive applies autolife to already-living characters, allowing them to continue to fight without taking up another character’s turn.
There are probably more I can say about strategy in this game. But I’ll stop here.

To put it simply, I prefer EBF to Mardek because it provides a more satisfying experience with its battles. It’s also harder (not in the beginning, but in the end) than Mardek, which has a relatively flat difficulty curve, has more polish, and has more replayablity. What more can a player want?

 
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Plus during quests all encounters are pretty much required whenever you’re in a dungeon

Yeeeeeees, you can’t just expect to skip battles and then completely decimate bosses.


in Mardek you can just attack and cast a spell a few times, then flee unharmed with undeserved XP before the enemy can attack.

Damn, I need those items…


EBF allows you to choose what monsters you want to battle and when.

Orly? All you see is one of the enemies. You don’t know if it’s supported by four of its buddies, four dangerous allies, another three waves to beat, or if it’s actually alone.
But if you want to be one-sided…
Humour: Completely ridiculous. Sex jokes are supposed to be funny?
Quests: Quests? What quests? All I hear is “get these arbitrary items for me you can buy in the shop or find during the game any way”. Few of them actually require you to search for the items.
Healing outside battles: If you give us regeneration .. just give us our full health back when we finish a battle. Reduces walking time.
Epicness: In MARDEK, we find an incredible amulet on a superboss, a rare ore deep in a temple, a unique accessory in a secret chest. In EBF3? We buy them in the shops, have the skills readily available for us, and there are almost no side paths to take at all. Everything is a straight line, and there’s very few usable items you actually have to loot.
Story: Story? What story? A few pictures with one sentence of text below it doesn’t tell me anything. “Ohi we kind of poked an evil overlord and now it twisted the entire universe in some kind of state while we’re back to level 1.”

 
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Required Encounters-My point is that the encounter system is too easy, repetitive, and boring. The encounters already give you more than enough experience to “decimate bosses” easily.
Choosing Battles-And you just happen to have a Scan skill and the ability to change your equips midbattle at hand.
Humour-You don’t seem to complain when they appear in Mardek in the form of a clingy jealous girl named Elwyen. Also, EBF’s humor is in its references and the whole thing in general (Getting beat up by a cat with a beer flagon is quite a sight). Anyway, humor doesn’t mean a good game. (I do prefer Mardek’s humor, however. In Bartholio’s words, BATTLE TRANSITION FADETHROUGH!!!!)
Quests-This only applies to the early quests. Items in most quests cost too much in the shop to obtain, so you’re going to have to kill a lot of monsters to get ‘em. At least the quests are openly accessible. In Mardek, the only sidequest like that happens to be a FETCH QUEST as well. But I agree that the quest need some retooling.
Healing outside battles-If you give us a save crystal that fully heals you and saves your game…just give us our full health back when we finish a battle. Reduces walking time.
Epicness-There’s a lot of rare equipment and items you have to find in cleverly hidden treasure chests and secret areas. In Mardek? You just stroll up to a chest right in the open, with its location readily available on a map. And I don’t see what’s epic about Drillion Horns and Lizard’s Tails clogging up your inventory. In EBF, every monster drop has a use.
Story-Go criticize the Mario games, then. It serves its purpose, and it shows that a RPG doesn’t need a storyline to prop up repetitive gameplay if it makes the gameplay great.

 
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Required Encounters-My point is that the encounter system is too easy, repetitive, and boring. The encounters already give you more than enough experience to “decimate bosses” easily.

When?


You don’t seem to complain when they appear in Mardek in the form of a clingy jealous girl named Elwyen.

Yeeeeees, ’cause there are much more humour besides that…


This only applies to the early quests. Items in most quests cost too much in the shop to obtain, so you’re going to have to kill a lot of monsters to get ‘em.

Did you read my entire sentence? You would just stumble upon ’em in your adventure.


Healing outside battles-If you give us a save crystal that fully heals you and saves your game…just give us our full health back when we finish a battle. Reduces walking time.

They are giving me regeneration while walking, so obviously they don’t necessarily want me to use food or return to the inn. If they did, don’t give me regeneration (like in MARDEK).


There’s a lot of rare equipment and items you have to find in cleverly hidden treasure chests and secret areas.

Are there a lot? Are they rare? Really?


And I don’t see what’s epic about Drillion Horns and Lizard’s Tails clogging up your inventory.

Use ’em to make items, or sell ’em, you JERK!!!!!!

 
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When?

scoffs ALL the time. Here’s an example in Chapter 2. After making it to the lake, I went into the Lake Hag’s cave and skipped half of the encounters I got into. And guess what? I defeated the Hag easily without using Emerla at all!

Yeeeeees, ’cause there are much more humour besides that…

Mardek also has hit-and-miss humor. Mardek and Deugen saying “Tallyho!” to each other for 2 minutes is supposed to be funny?! Mardek saying “But they’re so sparkly!” is supposed to be funny?!

Did you read my entire sentence? You would just stumble upon ’em in your adventure.

OK, honest mistake. But Mardek keeps almost all of its sidequests secret, so many players don’t find them. And if they do, they usually find stuff like “Go all over the land to find these hidden keys so you can battle this linear progression of ‘gladiators!’” The only easily accessible quest happens to be a FETCH QUEST as well.

They are giving me regeneration while walking, so obviously they don’t necessarily want me to use food or return to the inn. If they did, don’t give me regeneration (like in MARDEK).

kupo707 probably added this for people who wanted to speed rush through the game to allow them to at least regain some health. You’ll probably need the food in battle, and the inn is for the impatient ones.

Are there a lot? Are they rare? Really?

Considering about 70% of your equipment’s in secret treasure chests and the fact that there are precious permanent stat-boosting items (bet you didn’t know that), I think there’s “a lot”. Also, with rare: Would you mind if I changed that to “secret”, or “unique”?

Use ’em to make items, or sell ’em, you JERK!!!!!!

For what? Potions that take a lot of tedious battling to make and that I probably have no time in a battle to use anyways?! And I think it’s hard to sell those Lizard’s Tails when Donovan keeps on reminding you there’s a mission to complete when you try to leave the Sun Temple prematurely. EBF makes better use of its drops.

 
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After making it to the lake, I went into the Lake Hag’s cave and skipped half of the encounters I got into. And guess what? I defeated the Hag easily without using Emerla at all!

Don’t try to fool me. The Lake Hag is the easiest boss in chapter 2. Besides, you said that:


Plus during quests all encounters are pretty much required whenever you’re in a dungeon

Heh. Contradicting yourself is kinda funny, isn’t it?


Mardek also has hit-and-miss humor. Mardek and Deugen saying “Tallyho!” to each other for 2 minutes is supposed to be funny?! Mardek saying “But they’re so sparkly!” is supposed to be funny?!

Again, you’re missing the point. Please take into place all jokes in the game (mostly the ones in the Warport).


But Mardek keeps almost all of its sidequests secret

Orly? You can just find them easily by talking to NPCs. Besides, there’s the suspiciously convenient walkthrough that Pseudolonewolf made himself.


kupo707 probably added this for people who wanted to speed rush through the game to allow them to at least regain some health.

Later, the health recovered is insignificant.


I think there’s “a lot”

Still less than in MARDEK.


Considering about 70% of your equipment’s in secret treasure chests

I don’t think so.


Potions that take a lot of tedious battling to make and that I probably have no time in a battle to use anyways?!

Are battles “tedious”? Are there no time, really?


And I think it’s hard to sell those Lizard’s Tails when Donovan keeps on reminding you there’s a mission to complete when you try to leave the Sun Temple prematurely.

NOOB.
There’s a priest that sells stuff in the Sun Temple.
NOOB.
Just that your issues with the game are either self-inflicted, false, capable of being removed, or you’re just expecting an EBF3 clone.

 
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Chimto, I totally copyrighted those sentences you stole from me.

Even if you skip the optional encounters, that only skips about 1/4 of the random encounters. Plus during quests all encounters are pretty much required whenever you’re in a dungeon),

All blue ones can be skipped. No encounters are required except the bosses. You can even flee from red encounters on your first turn. Since you say all bosses are easy, this shouldn’t actually bother you at all. The red encounters are for those who are .. hmm .. not as “professional” as you imply to be at the game.

The battles in Mardek are more like arcade minigames in the sense that success depends more on whether you can mash a button in a certain time slot than whether you can actually think.

Seriously, if that is what you think, I don’t even have to bother replying to the rest. This is just childish bashing of Mardek for a reason you don’t even know. Look, you dislike Mardek, we dislike EBF. Point is made. This just doesn’t make sense.

Actually, I have to admit, I will accept any reason at all you use to dislike Mardek. It’s your choice, after all. I myself heavily dislike luck-based games, even though others seem to like them for exactly the same reason. Mardek has a lot of what I want in a game. EBF does not. It’s really that simple. Oh, I do want to reply to all your points (some are just heavily flawed), but I’ll leave it with this one:

It’s also harder (not in the beginning, but in the end) than Mardek

Kidding me? EBF is ridiculously easy. All I did the last battle was smack him with my skills, see him get fully healed up again, smash him more, play for a few hours, and then finally beat him up. The only artificial difficulty placed in it is making more modes in which enemies have more HP and damage. Whoopteedoo, I think Pseudo can implement that in a few seconds, but as I said it’s artificial and doesn’t make sense to the purpose of the game any way.

(As I was reading more of your posts, I got more and more the nagging feeling to quote even more and reply to it, but I’ll skip that for now.)

 
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I think Mardek 3 wins.. EBF3 is just too confusing with all those quests :D

 
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They both suck /topic

 
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EBF3 is the best but mardek chapters are to i cant decide ROFL

 
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EBF3 – fun battles and enemies, but story is too meme based, and sidequests are bad.
Mardek 3 – Very great story and gameplay, but can be very tedious at some times.

 
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Originally posted by Laxaria:

Mardek 3.

Best. Flash. RPG. So Far. Ever.

Originally posted by Devlini:

I personally don’t think the EBF series is that funny.

I think Mardek is better in every single way.

I’ll just agree with this instead of writing walls of text.

 
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I haven’t really throughout played through EBF 3 that much but it’d be extremely hard to make a better game than Mardek 3, 40 hours of gameplay, great humor, love the combat system, and the whole skills learned from items and all that can’t wait for the next one.

 
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I’ve only played one of them (EBF 3)… maybe since I’m so bored, I should play the whole series of the other? (Yes, I know about hte benefits from doing so .That’s why I’d play through all 3.)

 
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Mardek 3. EBF 3 is usually very easy, except for the bosses, which are only hard because they respawn their little helpers and have massive amounts of HP, so much that even bosses shouldn’t have it. In Mardek, it’s all strategy and knowing what battles to skip and what ones to fight through. Also, EBF…. kind of loses it’s interestingness after about 15 minutes, while it took hours for me to stop playing Mardek, and only because I had to :(
EBF’s rating: 2/5 I guess, may change that to 1/5, not sure yet. Mardek’s rating: 5/5, 6/5 if I could. That game rivals console RPGs in awesomeness.

 
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Advantages of each game. (Things I could think of off the top of my head, no opinions)

MARDEK 3:
-Longer, allowing for more play time
-More playable characters
-More items
-More enemies
-Optional quests that are more than “Get these items for me”
-Item crafting with misc. items
-Reactions
EBF3:
-Upgradeable skills
-Upgradeable equipment
-Mini games

Winner: MARDEK 3

 
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Off to slay the Dra- er, Demon king thing?

In video games, the best things rarely come in small packages.

This is why Flash Games are often scorned at by other gamers, receiving stereotypes that they are little more than a parade of knock-offs, and/or simple games with no depth. However, there are a fair amount of great games that break this mold, and among these is Epic Battle Fantasy 3.

Is it really that worthy of this praise? Enter my review.

Sweet Adventuring

As the title suggests, Epic Battle Fantasy 3 whisks you off to another adventure in the series, but this time, a huge departure from the rest of the series has been made – there is a world to explore! The battles are now open ended – you can fight the enemies – or not, it’s totally up to you. This was a appreciated change from the traditional RPG, one that I enjoyed. However, the quest is rather linear – with 6 mini-worlds, or dungeons to crawl through in a specific order. There is only one town, but this doesn’t hurt, as each mini-world has a crystal to let you warp back to the town, and vice versa.

This brings me to the next point – as you can see, this is not your traditional RPG. The average RPG takes itself too seriously for its own good, but this is averted with Epic Battle Fantasy 3. Everything in the game – from the characters to the map, has been doused with a layer of humor. The music isn’t all classical RPG fare, with the majority of the tracks having rock guitars and other modern aspects to them, although the game could have more variety of tracks – there are only about 12. The overview map has cartoony caricatures for everything. These are well done, without the “rushed” feeling that many Flash games suffer from.The items and characters all have funny things to say. However, in battle, the animations are great, and characters even change their appearance when they are equipped with different items! It really shows how much effort was put into the game, and deserves serious kudos. All of these aspects really help with immersion in this not-so-serious world. It truly is a “modern” RPG.

However, there were a couple of changes to the RPG formula that I did not like to see. Among these was the changes to the story. RPGs tend to have very deep, engrossing storylines that help the player understand the characters and the world. You won’t find that here. The story is rather light and skimpy, and relies heavily on the humor of the characters and world to keep going. Also, another bothering point – the side quests. Although there are many (30, to be exact), they are all highly uninvolved fetch quests, like, “Get me X of this and X of that, and I’ll give you something cool!” Would it hurt to be more original? This, however, are only tiny blemishes in the gem that this game is.

Epic Battle Fantasy 3 also has many RPG features that will keep almost anyone entertained for a while, foremost the great skill system. Characters have a pool of skill points to learn skills (Obviously!), which logically get progressively more powerful. Because of the skill points are usable to learn anything, you’ll have to balance pumping up a certain skill to become extremely powerful versus spreading the love to make sure your characters are balanced for any situation. It’s fun to just plan which order characters to learn skills. Will you teach Matt a devastating single-target blow, or an multi-target defense buff? Will Natalie learn healing first, or focus on devastating multi-target spells? The game also has upgradeable weapons and equipment, for optimum character customization and 60 medals to collect, for all those completionists out there. It really adds to the experience and appeal.

Also, what I also really appreciate is the targeted audience of the game – just about everyone, not just the hardcore RPG fan. The difficulties are specifically tailored for different types of gamers. The average, or casual gamer will probably choose the easy or normal difficulty, while the hardcore may want to start at the hard or epic difficulty. This is the mark of a great flash game – making it accessible to everyone, from the light-hearted to the hardcore. The game doesn’t “shut out” the casual, who are normally deprived of RPGs, so that the game can appeal to just about everyone. This could and should be a feature on most RPG games.

Happy Ending

Epic Battle Fantasy 3 is executed well on just about every level, and has all the makings of a true classic. Sure, the story is rather skimpy, and the sidequests are uninspired but the atmosphere, the gameplay, and just about every other aspect are almost unmatched by any other Flash game. This is a serious contender for the best Flash RPG yet, but it has some very worthy rivals, including the excellent Mardek RPG series. The fact that it’s exclusively a flash game makes a huge statement for the legitimacy of Flash gaming, and is hopefully a shining emblem of many great things to come.

 
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These are 2 totaly diferent games.The only thing they have in common are the RPG elments.
We might see a split in the RPG genere soon. One would be the funny “battle is everything” game like EBF3. And one the very realistic story gameplay with chalanges like Mardek.
I just cant compare them. Each one is great in its own way.

 
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lol lukemann, did you copy/paste that from fighunter.com?