[Game] Dual Mafia (Experienced Game) [GAME OVER] page 2

162 posts

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Yeah, brah, I got this. Don’t you worry.

 
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Joke phase will pretty much never end until you grasp the NK pattern

NK patterns are completely inaccurate when it comes to lynches. Admittedly, I like to NK in an unconventional pattern every now and then when I’m a maf to push blame onto someone else if someone actually falls for it.


I never said we shouldn’t try to find scums. Exactly how are you going to do it?

I don’t understand the point to this question, but obviously I’m attempting to scumhunt right now.


I also never said my vote on coolo is final, if someone can manage to post something with heavy scumtell, I’ll change my vote.

t’s called a joke phase for a reason, a player’s going to get lynched for pretty much no reason to progress the game.

You talked about it as if you expected your lynch on coolo to go through.


Right now, it’s more like an anchor to ensure that NL doesn’t happen.

Helltank’s vote already guaranteed that one wouldn’t happen unless he unvoted.


Town shouldn’t know anyone’s roles, but you sound like you know coolo’s and you’re trying to protect him. I’m thinking you’re a potential werewolf or mafia goon.

You’re a little quick to jump to that conclusion, don’t you think? What makes you think I know coolo’s role? And if you’re argument actually holds evidence, what makes you discard the possibility of me being a mason?


There is none if everyone can act like townies.

First you say that it’s impossible to get a logical lynch on D1, so we should wait until D2, using the entire D1 as a joke phase. Then you say that it’s also possible for it to be impossible on D2. You also seem to be dodging the question; what’s stopping people from displaying scumtells on D1? What are you trying to say here?

 
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(Cowfriend)

There’s not point in RNG voting another person if a vote has already being led.

Explain how that helps town to scumhunt and/or have a higher chance of lynching scum.

Town shouldn’t know anyone’s roles, but you sound like you know coolo’s and you’re trying to protect him.

Point out where.

I’m thinking you’re a potential werewolf or mafia goon.

There is also the possibility of both of them being Town Mason.


(devourer359)

You’re a little quick to jump to that conclusion, don’t you think? What makes you think I know coolo’s role? And if you’re argument actually holds evidence, what makes you discard the possibility of me being a mason?

He beat me to the punch.

*notveryhappyface*

FoS Cowfriend in the meantime. I’d like him to deliberate on the points I want him to deliberate on. They are italicized.

 
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You talked about it as if you expected your lynch on coolo to go through.

I expect the lynch on coolo to go through if we can’t catch any scumtell by another player. This kind of situation has happened in many mafia games where people just barely post anything and just let the deadline meet.

Helltank’s vote already guaranteed that one wouldn’t happen unless he unvoted.

I’m at fault here. I thought this was another mafia that required majority votes.

And if you’re argument actually holds evidence, what makes you discard the possibility of me being a mason?

I realized that after I posted. You could still be a potential scum, so can’t say I want to drop my FoS. And since when does any argument hold any legit evidence unless the target deliberately roleclaimed. I still see people getting voted off and revealed to be town.

First you say that it’s impossible to get a logical lynch on D1, so we should wait until D2, using the entire D1 as a joke phase.

Where in my posts did I say it’s impossible to get a logical lynch? I said it was unlikely because if players can play it right, it’s hard find any scumtell.

You also seem to be dodging the question; what’s stopping people from displaying scumtells on D1?

Player skill. We could assume every post by the scum to be consider “scumtell”, but we’re still unable to detect/analyze it because it blends in so well.

 
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@Adeeb

Explain how that helps town to scumhunt and/or have a higher chance of lynching scum.

Not sure what you’re asking. I’ll assume that you’re asking how RNG voting helps scumhunt.

It promotes discussion, which helps scumhunting. There’s no talking point on the first day unless someone gets voted or reeks scumtell without a reason to.

Point out where.

I was a bit rash here, but he sounded like he just wanted to stop the random voting. There’s a reason to start it, but there isn’t a reason to stop it, yet. The deadline is still 48 hours (or whatever it is), there’s still the same amount of time for someone to post scumtell. He’s acting like the vote is definite.


Also, I want to ask something, and I highly encourage everyone to answer it.

If you’re town, and it’s the first day, what would you do if the day is about to end and no vote has been cast?

 
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This kind of situation has happened in many mafia games where people just barely post anything and just let the deadline meet.

I trust the people here to be active enough, but I see your point.


And since when does any argument hold any legit evidence unless the target deliberately roleclaimed. I still see people getting voted off and revealed to be town.

You still don’t state how I established myself to be connected to coolo. Again, don’t dodge questions.

As for evidence, nothing is for certain, but there will almost always be a player scummier than the others. A clear liquid might not be water, but there’s the possibility that it is through the tell of sight. It doesn’t deny the chances of it being something like hydrochloric acid, but it certainly is a lot more likely to be plain water than, say, orange juice.


Where in my posts did I say it’s impossible to get a logical lynch? I said it was unlikely because if players can play it right, it’s hard find any scumtell.

Perhaps the absolute nature of your posts threw me off. Still, what would change if D2 started? If “players play it right”, wouldn’t we still be in the same situation according to you? I stick to the opinion that it’s entirely possible to scumhunt in D1. The mentality that it isn’t is a problem around here.


We could assume every post by the scum to be consider “scumtell”, but we’re still unable to detect/analyze it because it blends in so well.

I still don’t understand what point you’re trying to get across. A scumtell isn’t something that’s invisible, and can only really be consider one once it is noticed. And it is possible to scumhunt on D1, as long as activity isn’t skyrocketing downward.


but he sounded like he just wanted to stop the random voting.

Random voting is only advantageous to scum, as there’s a higher chance for the vote to land on town and it’s much easier for scum to control. It has been explained in past mafias that RNG is just as useless as NL. As for the fact that if facilitates discussion, your original post doesn’t seem to show that as your intention and there are safer ways to start it.


He’s acting like the vote is definite.

The way you worded your posts made it seem like you intended to end D1 while still in the joke phase.


If you’re town, and it’s the first day, what would you do if the day is about to end and no vote has been cast?

Find a way to start discussion, hopefully without resorting to the RNG. This can be done through multiple ways (jokes, RQS, temporary RNG, etc.), and frankly should be done at the beginning of the day instead of the end.

 
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Still, what would change if D2 started?

ffuu, y u keep doing this to me.

I already said nothing will change if no one reveals any scumtell. If we can’t do it, it’s a victory on mafia’s side. And we would have to resort to random voting if that happens.

You keep saying that it’s possible to find scumtell on day one (optimistic), I’m just saying it’s unlikely (pessimistic). Both works depending on how the game goes.

It has been explained in past mafias that RNG is just as useless as NL.

Well, it depends on the roles we have in the game. There are four scums out of 11 people, that’s 36% to lynch a person who can NK vs a person who can only post (I don’t see coolo posting that much anyways, as with pretty much everyone in this game). I feel this is a pretty high chance to lynch a scum and isn’t held back by such a big disadvantage (some mafia games usually have townies with special abilities, and random voting those would be a pretty bad idea IMO).

jokes, RQS, temporary RNG

Jokes doesn’t do anything.
RQS is, eh, kinda sketchy. Doesn’t really help that much against slightly experienced players.
What exactly do you mean by temporary RNG? Are you just gonna unvote if you can’t spot any scumtell?

 
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Here’s my analysis of the game so far:

I get the ball rolling with an RNG. Adeeb FoSes me-joke? He’s not the type to scream that RNG should never be used in a mafia. Then CowFriend votes the same person I do, without giving a reason. Coolo accuses CowFriend of trying to start a bandwagon and votes him, probably partially from the “You vote me, I vote you” mentality. CowFriend defends her actions by claiming “D1 is joke phase, also I’m avoiding NL”.

racefan posts the votecount.

Then everyone starts attacking CowFriend’s actions, either claiming that he “wasted D1” or picking out minor scumtells(ie. lashing out randomly when under pressure, trying to quickhammer ultra-early in the game ec. etc.). CowFriend defends himself with the classic “I want to get discussion started” line. Then devourer, who has been pressuring CowFriend, lightens the load a little, but I don’t think he’s buddying or anything like that. From my view, it sounds like a direct analysis with no gambits or deceptions.

All in all:

I think CowFriend is either VI who just got a bandwagon started on him by mafia, or noob mafia trying to start a bandwagon on coolo and getting ripped to shreds.

So, I unvote Coolo and vote CowFriend.

If he’s town, he’s VI, so we got rid of a possible liability. Also, it means the bandwagon and hate-fest on him was probably engineered by mafia, so we need to look more closely at coolo’s, devourer’s and Adeeb’s(his three attackers’) posts.

If he’s mafia, well, hooray.

 
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(Cowfriend)

Not sure what you’re asking. I’ll assume that you’re asking how RNG voting helps scumhunt.

You are right.

It promotes discussion, which helps scumhunting. There’s no talking point on the first day unless someone gets voted or reeks scumtell without a reason to.

Point noted.

I was a bit rash here, but he sounded like he just wanted to stop the random voting.

I believe he wanted to stop a possible bandwagon. It was a step taken preemptively, yes, since two votes are far from majority.

If you’re town, and it’s the first day, what would you do if the day is about to end and no vote has been cast?

I would FoS people into getting into the thread. If someone was active enough everywhere but in the thread despite my FoS, I would vote them to hopefully draw their attention. Votes always do that.

Alternatively, I’d start the RQS. It is the best topic starter in the world after peanuts.


(devourer)

You still don’t state how I established myself to be connected to coolo. Again, don’t dodge questions.

Well,

I was a bit rash here, but he sounded like he just wanted to stop the random voting. There’s a reason to start it, but there isn’t a reason to stop it, yet. The deadline is still 48 hours (or whatever it is), there’s still the same amount of time for someone to post scumtell. He’s acting like the vote is definite.

This answers it better, IMO.

Random voting is only advantageous to scum, as there’s a higher chance for the vote to land on town and it’s much easier for scum to control.

Explain, please, how it is easier for scum to control a vote that has been decided by the Random Number God. Also, explain why scum would want to get rid of town before getting rid of the opposing scum faction first in the current setup.

Find a way to start discussion, hopefully without resorting to the RNG.

The RNG can start discussion though. As evidenced by the current discussion,


(Cowfriend)

You keep saying that it’s possible to find scumtell on day one (optimistic), I’m just saying it’s unlikely (pessimistic). Both works depending on how the game goes.

Lolno. The words in the brackets should be, respectively, practical and impractical.

Well, it depends on the roles we have in the game. There are four scums out of 11 people, that’s 36% to lynch a person who can NK vs a person who can only post (I don’t see coolo posting that much anyways, as with pretty much everyone in this game).

Doing math is a scumtell in my book because I often do that as scum. Also, do you think lynching someone who is more suspicious than others has a higher chance of landing scum? Like, do the math please.

What exactly do you mean by temporary RNG? Are you just gonna unvote if you can’t spot any scumtell?

I am not devourer’s alt, but I believe that is what he meant.


(helltank)

Adeeb FoSes me-joke? He’s not the type to scream that RNG should never be used in a mafia.

Obvious.

Coolo accuses CowFriend of trying to start a bandwagon and votes him, probably partially from the “You vote me, I vote you” mentality.

AKA OMGUS, which is slightly suspicious as well. N.B, it was hardly a wagon at L-4.

Then devourer, who has been pressuring CowFriend, lightens the load a little, but I don’t think he’s buddying or anything like that.

devourer is usually obvious when he buddies, so yeah, I agree.

From my view, it sounds like a direct analysis with no gambits or deceptions.

Explain which part of said analysis got you voting CF.

I think CowFriend is either VI who just got a bandwagon started on him by mafia, or noob mafia trying to start a bandwagon on coolo and getting ripped to shreds.

Views noted.

If he’s town, he’s VI, so we got rid of a possible liability.

Lolno. In a game with so few town and dual NKs waiting for the night, I’d say we be careful in executing lynches. Days are like precious drops of lifeblood at present.

Also, it means the bandwagon and hate-fest on him was probably engineered by mafia, so we need to look more closely at coolo’s, devourer’s and Adeeb’s(his three attackers’) posts.

I did not attack him, actually. I was questioning him, which is entirely different under normal circumstances.

If he’s mafia, well, hooray.

Why will getting rid of an SI help town in a game with four scum? I know it lowers scum density, but it seems a trivial bonus for town when SIs can hardly hide themselves anyway.

 
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Everything I have said is referenced by the fact that we can’t find any scumtell.

You guys keep saying “logical lynch” is better than “random vote”, no shit, but we can’t find any right now (or any that actually convince me). Why do you think I would keep the random vote if there’s a lead to a scum?

 
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I would FoS people into getting into the thread. If someone was active enough everywhere but in the thread despite my FoS, I would vote them to hopefully draw their attention.

That makes sense. Came up with a list of people who’s active in other threads but not this one.

FoS S_98, N1NjA546 (thought he hasn’t even posted the confirm), reaper765


And I don’t even think Adeeb and Devourer are directly attacking me, more like questioning me on why I did what I did.

 
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Town shouldn’t know anyone’s roles, but you sound like you know coolo’s and you’re trying to protect him. I’m thinking you’re a potential werewolf or mafia goon.

[This makes no sense. Coolo being lynched for no reason helps no-one.]

You’re a little quick to jump to that conclusion, don’t you think? What makes you think I know coolo’s role?

[And instead of questioning him on it calmly, you jump on him like an angry hornet.]

And if you’re argument actually holds evidence, what makes you discard the possibility of me being a mason?

[This sounds like a poor excuse to spread doubt among people. Rather than denying the possibility due to his lack of evidence, you proceed to ask ‘BUT WHAT IF I MASON’ as if you really do know Coolo’s role and need a backup plan.]

And since when does any argument hold any legit evidence unless the target deliberately roleclaimed. I still see people getting voted off and revealed to be town.

[Nuclear weapons do not have a 100% chance of exploding, therefore they are not dangerous, according to you.]

There’s a reason to start it, but there isn’t a reason to stop it, yet.

[The whole point of starting it is to stop it.]

If you’re town, and it’s the first day, what would you do if the day is about to end and no vote has been cast?

[Lynch you.]

[Vote quickly based on my current suspicions, probably.]

Explain, please, how it is easier for scum to control a vote that has been decided by the Random Number God.

[Pretend RNG, though that never results in the person being voted.]

Also, explain why scum would want to get rid of town before getting rid of the opposing scum faction first in the current setup.

[Scum will also scumhunt due to this, so there is a small chance of victory.]

FoS Devourer, Cowfriend.

[Given that there are two NKs, though, I feel sadfaic as it is likely I will be NK’d early on.]

 
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[This makes no sense. Coolo being lynched for no reason helps no-one.]

So you’re saying you support NL more than a random vote in a mafia where there’s a pretty good chance of random lynching a scum vs just a townie with no special ability? And how does it not help?

[Nuclear weapons do not have a 100% chance of exploding, therefore they are not dangerous, according to you.]

How does that even compare to what I said?

[The whole point of starting it is to stop it.]

Keyword: yet

When we were discussing about that, there weren’t any valid scumtell.


Feels really irritating when we’re arguing among ourselves when a scum is just lurking around not posting anything. Feel like voting someone inactive could help us right now.

Unvote Coolo

 
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So you’re saying you support NL more than a random vote in a mafia where there’s a pretty good chance of random lynching a scum vs just a townie with no special ability? And how does it not help?

[I’m somehow left wondering why you seem to be advocating random voting as a valid tactic for removing the Mafiae.]

How does that even compare to what I said?

[You said that using evidence is invalid if it’s not a 100% method.]

Keyword: yet

When we were discussing about that, there weren’t any valid scumtell.

[>Discussion i.e. where scumtells are found.]

 
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[>Discussion i.e. where scumtells are found.]

Doesn’t mean it will be found in every discussion we have. There might not even be a scum in this discussion. They’re too busy lurking.

My through so far is that the lurking players are usually scums, and voting them could prod them into the game. That will probably be better than random voting now that we know who’s more active in the thread.

Vote S_98

And if my prediction is right, S_98 is probably gonna scurry into the thread trying to vote me with little to no reason to try to get the lynch secured.

 
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The “Should CowFriend have been in the Newbie Game?” Votecount:

CowFriend (2): coolo2011, helltank
S_98 (1): CowFriend
Not voting (8): everyone else

With 11 players alive, it takes 6 to lynch before the deadline.

49 hours left until deadline.


Everyone has confirmed except N1NjA—hopefully he’ll do so before the end of the day.

 
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The “Should CowFriend have been in the Newbie Game?” Votecount:

No u, I’m trying, k? My tryhard meter is like off the chart right now.

 
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Oh god; this mafia tutorial thingamajig is going on and my hopeless inactivity means I had no idea until I saw the role PM 2 days late – I’m sorry. I’’m guessing I’m one of the people here to learn rather than teach, right? God help us all if I’m an “experienced player”.

Anyway, I’ll read through discussion and report my findings in another post.

Just in case I need to say this, I Confirm.

 
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I know it may seem like I’m lurking, and I don’t blame you for your suspicion, but I just don’t know what to post without seeming like an idiot.

 
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I’m not in a good mood right now, so I probably missed something in this post.


Jokes doesn’t do anything.

I find that they usually start discussion, strangely enough.


What exactly do you mean by temporary RNG? Are you just gonna unvote if you can’t spot any scumtell?

I mean that the vote would be taken off once discussion actually starts.


Alternatively, I’d start the RQS. It is the best topic starter in the world after peanuts.

But it wasn’t too helpful in Corrupted :P.


Explain, please, how it is easier for scum to control a vote that has been decided by the Random Number God

RNG is almost impossible to defend against and has a higher chance to land on town. There’s also no way to prove a vote was truly RNGed and if played right, a scum could start a RNG that would finish the day.


Also, explain why scum would want to get rid of town before getting rid of the opposing scum faction first in the current setup.

I completely forgot about that.


The RNG can start discussion though. As evidenced by the current discussion,

It wasn’t the RNG that started the discussion, but rather, Cow’s way of going about it.


[And instead of questioning him on it calmly, you jump on him like an angry hornet.]

What’s the problem with that? If he’s scum, it has the possibility of making him nervous and making him show scumtells. If he’s town, he should have a legitimate reason, and not be nervous.


Rather than denying the possibility due to his lack of evidence

I kind of did. I think you’re reading too far into this.


My through so far is that the lurking players are usually scums, and voting them could prod them into the game.

A smart mafia tries to stay away from the lurking strategy. I don’t think I have ever lurked as a mafia without a legitimate reason in real life.

 
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A smart mafia tries to stay away from the lurking strategy. I don’t think I have ever lurked as a mafia without a legitimate reason in real life.

If player is a townie, they have no reason to lurk. They can’t use the excuse “I’m busy” if they’re clearly active in other mafia games. I can bet that there’s at least one scum in the discussion, though.

I know it may seem like I’m lurking, and I don’t blame you for your suspicion, but I just don’t know what to post without seeming like an idiot.

Why would you think that if you’re a townie?

 
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Because, I’m tired of “Headdesk” comments. Anyway, I really have no observations since when I was reading it I was kinda distracted. I would have voted Helltank if his RNG had been more than just a conversation starter. I really can’t see any signs of partnering, although I’m probably missing something.

 
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(Adeeb)

Explain which part of said analysis got you voting CF.

devourer’s analysis did not affect me in any way whatsoever. Currently I’m just making what I think is an impartial judgement and voting CowFriend for suspicious and nooby behavior.

Actually, maybe not lynching VI is a good thing after all… but I’m afraid he might turn into a long term liability(ie. if mafia are clever they can manipulate him to essentially get a free vote).

 
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I actually don’t know how to do those partial quotes, but from Helltank’s mistake, I’m guessing you use <quote> outside the actual quote.

 
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It’s <blockquote>, not <quote>.