RPG Making Comp page 2 (locked)

“I don’t really see how I was sarcastic either.”

…..is this sarcasm?

“The way I said 64digits was “plain awful” was obviously an ironic joke”

….wait, what?

Sorry, but simply rejecting something I’ve worked hard to put together for everyone who might be interested as “lame”, without a single factual word of explanation, is offensive.

It’s great you’ve put this contest together. We do lots of small contests around here and everyone benefits. However, I think people should still be aloud to voice their opinions on something, even if it isn’t backed by a thesis of information. Of course, without supporting evidence, the point may not be as strong, and people won’t give it as much thought. Here’s the thing – if one little comment bothers you quite a bit like this, that means you’re marking your success by the approval of others. Maybe this is fine, but if this is the case, you can’t only accept compliments.

What you’re referring to as “skepticism” was in fact complete fallacies which were spoken as if they were truths. Searching the host site for exploits and then ceasing to post any further details is also offensive, and is exactly the same as posting fallacies, if you don’t even bother showing any evidence.

Just because something is not proven does not make it false. I don’t believe UnknownGuardian would randomly make something up just to irk you.

The way I said 64digits was “plain awful” was obviously an ironic joke designed to lighten the mood and demonstrate the kind of site we are. We don’t take ourselves seriously – not many other communities seem to get that. It was also my way of changing the subject, because those sort of issues are completely out of my hands.

My fault. I thought you seriously meant that the site had many issues and didn’t realize it was a joke.

I fully justify my attitude. I don’t think I was any more rude than he deserved.

I still don’t see how someone voicing their opinion on something in a mostly appropriate way justifies insults, name calling, and sweeping generalizations.

I don’t need to be professional, because this is not a commercial competition. I’m not promoting, I’m publicising. I’m not trying to “sell” you the competition, I’m simply informing potential competitors of its existence.

I’m a fan of professionalism for many reasons. Say in the future you are applying for a job. They do some background research and find your 64digits profile. This immediately makes them uneasy. They look in to you further and find that simple criticism makes you bristle, figure this is not the man they want for the job, and don’t hire you. In addition, typically a professional attitude maintains some minimum of decency. I’m not saying I’m always professional, or that I’m always nice, but I think in general it’s a good thing.

I’m not promoting, I’m publicising. I’m not trying to “sell” you the competition, I’m simply informing potential competitors of its existence.

Eh. Same thing in different words if you ask me.

I don’t really see how I was sarcastic either.

Oh, I wasn’t trying to say you were. I was simply referring to how I ccan easily think of sarcastic replies.

I get how you’re trying be the “voice of reason” here, but really you just came off as condescending, and failed to understand the point of the competition.

Sorry if I came across as condescending. I think the point of the competition is to make an RPG and perhaps with a prize. Correct me if I’m wrong.

Searching the host site for exploits and then ceasing to post any further details is also offensive

If you find vulnerabilities with someone’s code/site/project/whatever, it’s generally considered very bad form to post details in a public place where they can be exploited by anyone who happens to find the information. He specifically asked for contact with the administrators, presumably to tell them in private (even offer advice on how to fix it)

Everyone is allowed to voice opinions, but they should be aware that I will voice my opinion about the validity of their opinion. Constructive criticism is useful, and I respond to that amicably. I ignore compliments, because there’s nothing to say to them. But it someone posts unuseful criticism, I’m not afraid to point out that they’re an idiot. What bothered me about the community as a whole was that the way he commented didn’t seem to bother many of you.

I don’t believe UnknownGuadian would make it up either, but it wasn’t particularly helpful or considerate to post in that way, and then not follow it up.

Hahaha, it’s funny you brought up my profile. It was pointed out recently, quite dramatically so. The truth is that nobody ever uses the profile feature, and I hadn’t updated the profile description in 5 years (since I was 13). Currently it’s there for my own twisted amusement. To be honest, if it truely made someone uneasy, I’d laugh in their face. That’s just who I am. I’m also the kind of person who bristles at unjustified criticism – not because it’s criticism, but because it’s unjustified. Sorry. I don’t believe these views are mutually exclusive to professionalism.

The point of the competition, seeing as you asked, is to motivate aspiring game developers (particularly veteran members of our community) into actually producing some games. You seem to think there’s some ulterior motive – hence why you were coaching me on how to be more persuasive – which there is not.

@truefire I did post an email address, which was removed by moderators. He could have PMed me, which he didn’t.

I’m not particularly bothered about publicising here anymore, so I took the links down.

“The point of the competition, seeing as you asked, is to motivate aspiring game developers (particularly veteran members of our community) into actually producing some games.”

I think this & looking at your prizes perhaps explains the lukewarm reception you’ve had here. Cash, ofc, is always a welcome reward….but also in your grand prize is a copy of game maker, runners up get RPG maker….these are not professional programs, this forum focuses almost entirely on flash, which is a professional format. While the vast majority of people on this forum aren’t professional game developers, it does operate in the same world, it is devoted to actual programming, thus having higher standards than, I suspect, the other, ‘more polite’, forums…where US$400 might seem like a lot of money.
I could be completely wrong about the other forums, I really don’t know anything about your site…..but that’s the impression I get from association with yoyogames/gamemaker.

Our community doesn’t focus on any particular game creation tool, and theres a huge difference in skill level. I wanted the competition to reflect this by including a wide variety of prizes, appealing to everyone from beginners to pros.

But I’m getting the same impression of this site as you, hence why I’m standing down from here. It’s pretty clear that this wasn’t well received. Not that I’m sure that any pro game developers have actually commented on this, no offence to you all.

UG, in my opinion, could be considered pro. The rest lie somewhere between amateur and pro.
Why don’t you show off some of your works, Toasty? We’d like to see what the creator can do. :)

My definition of a pro is someone who’s making a living as a game dev, by the way (or at least makes considerable money from games). I certainly am not, and don’t claim to be.

I entered Ludum Dare with a GameMaker game, which you’re welcome to look at. I’m by no means very good.
http://www.ludumdare.com/compo/ludum-dare-23/?action=preview&uid=6788

As it happens I’ll be taking part in my own competition just for fun, not competitively. Will probably be using Flash or something similar.

…not sure what my game making skills have to do with my competition hosting skills, but oh well.

@Toast: For somebody who is essentially representing that other site, you’re not a very good diplomat/ambassador. I’ve gone from slightly interested in this (as an excuse to make an RPG mainly) to completely disinterested based on how I’ve seen you react to other posts here. Right now, I’m having a hard time taking you or even that site seriously.

@truefire I did post an email address, which was removed by moderators. He could have PMed me, which he didn’t.

I would’ve just taken the initiative and PM’ed him. A much better choice than reacting like this on the forums, don’t you think?

We don’t take ourselves seriously – not many other communities seem to get that.

What exactly is it about my reaction that disinterested you? I fail to understand what I’ve done that was so terrible.

Originally posted by Toast4001:

EWhat bothered me about the community as a whole was that the way he commented didn’t seem to bother many of you.

I hope you don’t mind if that image bothers noone but you.

I don’t believe UnknownGuadian would make it up either, but it wasn’t particularly helpful or considerate to post in that way, and then not follow it up.

The site requires you to register, and it has security issues. How is it “not particulary helpful” to point that out?

Anyway, thanks for the show, this forum has been a bit slow lately.

Originally posted by Ringer:

My definition of a pro is someone who’s making a living as a game dev, by the way (or at least makes considerable money from games).

Do you have any idea how much UG made? lol.

Originally posted by Amibtious:also in your grand prize is a copy of game maker, runners up get RPG maker….these are not professional programs, this forum focuses almost entirely on flash, which is a professional format. While the vast majority of people on this forum aren’t professional game developers, it does operate in the same world, it is devoted to actual programming, thus having higher standards than, I suspect, the other, ‘more polite’, forums…where US$400 might seem like a lot of money.

Most of the professionalism on this forum is only self-perceived. The replies in this thread haven’t been professional – from anyone – and nobody posting so far has a portfolio anywhere near good enough to be considered a pro.

On the same note, outside of the insular Kong dev community it’s generally accepted that Game Maker is a pretty powerful program. RPG Maker is more niche, but also very powerful, and both programs are behind some amazing games. They might not be your game making programs of choice, but you’re only limiting yourself to entirely discount then.

Finally, the fact that Kongregate allows you to post something doesn’t mean that you’re being polite or professional when you say it. Professionalism has nothing to do with being good at a particular line of work, and everything to do with your attitude to the work and to other people.

“Most of the professionalism on this forum is only self-perceived. The replies in this thread haven’t been professional – from anyone – and nobody posting so far has a portfolio anywhere near good enough to be considered a pro.”

Oh aye I know, I wasn’t saying this was a forum for professionals, just that it competes with pros in the way a rpg maker forum doesn’t. I don’t think I’m explaining that very well, but it’s late…and I think (hope) you get my drift. Was just theorising over why he’d percieved a less welcoming….welcome….from this forum than from the others.

“On the same note, outside of the insular Kong dev community it’s generally accepted that Game Maker is a pretty powerful program.”

Now that I can’t accept. I mean, sure, it’s technically good for what it is, but no pro is ever going to use GML to make an exe game over C++

Originally posted by Amibtious:

Now that I can’t accept. I mean, sure, it’s technically good for what it is, but no pro is ever going to use GML to make an exe game over C++

Spelunky
Desktop Dungeons
Shoot First
Hydorah
Super Crate box
Hero Core

all highly rated Game Maker games, though I believe Desktop Dungeons Pro was re-coded in something else.

There are more, but of those 6, five of them were in top 10 lists of indie games in 2010, and the other one went on to be ported to the Xbox.

As far as RPG Maker goes, if you don’t keep up with the RPG Maker scene, you’re missing some fantastic indie games. I don’t often play JRPGs anymore but for fans of the genre, there are some outstanding games coming out of their community. If you want an example, and you don’t haev the genre, try the demo of this one. It easily rivals anything you’ll see in Flash.

What bothered me about the community as a whole was that the way he commented set up his profile didn’t seem to bother many of you. them

E: Gah, typed up a longcat long post, edited something, and it all got deleted with only this remaining^

Originally posted by saybox:

Originally posted by Amibtious:

Now that I can’t accept. I mean, sure, it’s technically good for what it is, but no pro is ever going to use GML to make an exe game over C++

Spelunky
Desktop Dungeons
Shoot First
Hydorah
Super Crate box
Hero Core

all highly rated Game Maker games, though I believe Desktop Dungeons Pro was re-coded in something else.

There are more, but of those 6, five of them were in top 10 lists of indie games in 2010, and the other one went on to be ported to the Xbox.

As far as RPG Maker goes, if you don’t keep up with the RPG Maker scene, you’re missing some fantastic indie games. I don’t often play JRPGs anymore but for fans of the genre, there are some outstanding games coming out of their community. If you want an example, and you don’t haev the genre, try the demo of this one. It easily rivals anything you’ll see in Flash.

I’m not saying there aren’t good games made with GM or RPGmaker, I’m saying they aren’t in the same….circle….as programming, basically. I just suspected the difference he claimed to have noticed between this forum and others was that the others are ‘make your own game without code’ programs (I know they (some) have code, but the advertising claim)…which is a different community, with not just acceptance but expectation that they’re full of amateurs. I know this forum is also full of amateurs & beginners, but so are all game development help forums….difference being this one exists on the side of formats which can be & frequently are used professionally, and has a somewhat different culture….stuff here is not judged in the macaroni & glitter way stuff posted on their forum might be.

Maybe I’m way off, it’s just a suspicion.

Also, that list….I don’t know all those games (though Desktop Dungeons was only ever prototyped in GM), but the number of professional GM developers stood at 0 last I heard.

Originally posted by Draco18s:

Originally posted by Toast4001:

@DannyDaNinja Whatever, man, there’s no need to be insulting. Way to represent your community. Thankfully we don’t have people like you at ours.

Pay no attention to the 12 year old who thinks he’s hot shit, but isn’t.

Hey dats pretty silly

Originally posted by DannyDaNinja:

Originally posted by Draco18s:

Originally posted by Toast4001:

@DannyDaNinja Whatever, man, there’s no need to be insulting. Way to represent your community. Thankfully we don’t have people like you at ours.

Pay no attention to the 12 year old who thinks he’s hot shit, but isn’t.

Hey dats pretty silly

Danny, all i see you do is belittling people who are worse than you.