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> *Originally posted by **[vikaTae](/forums/9/topics/11474?page=2#posts-6373617):***
> If you have enough funds available, a third option is to invest in infrastructure in those third world countries. As the quality of life improves, average wages will start to climb – and the sweatshops will suffer increasing difficulties in finding staff for what they are willing to pay.
> That is however, a long-term strategy.
Or U.S. consumer culture could refuse to buy outsourced products, forcing third world countries into building their own infrastructure instead becoming slaves to U.S. corporations.
(I’m with ya :-)
> *Originally posted by **[Azolf](/forums/9/topics/11474?page=2#posts-6373593):***
> **But in turn, this can leave one in a moral ‘pickle’…where is the line to be drawn? -FlabbyWoofWoof**
> I try to draw that line where human misery is involved in the making of a product. This isn’t about targeting one specific product or country for boycott. It’s about carrying the mindset of a conscientious consumer on a daily basis.
Well I’m glad you can do that.
I just buy what I need..no care for what misrey is involved in my purchase.
While I disagree with some of their motives, I have to agree with their objectives as a whole. It is not that I have anything against jews-Or any religion, as a matter in fact-Merely that I do not believe Israel should exist, or at least, not the way it does.
Before crucifiyng me for that sentence, I would just like to clarify one thing: Of course the Jews have full right to visit their own holy city. I would never deny THAT. The problem lies, when more and more of the territory of a nation is taken away from it through military force, to be given to Israel. If they were christian, muslim, atheists, or even pagans, I would still think the same thing.
It is not a matter of religion, merely a matter of who is entitled to the land. And I believe Palestine( Forgive me if I mispelled it ) is, merely because so it has been for generations. Taking the land away of it would mean kicking millons of people out of their homes, what simply cannot be right.
Of course, this is just my opinion. Feel free to disagree.
I have to agree with Flabby. I look for the cheapest raw materials I can get my hands on. In an ideal world I could 3D print everything I need, but in the world as it is, this often means purchasing from stores that gain most of their stock from overseas.
Saying that, I am going to have a go at casting ferrules tomorrow, see if I can do it. Would make life so much easier for the unusual diameters, if I could do it myself.
You sound right, except…
1. Would you also vote for returning a good half of USA to the native Indians?
Though this is only a very superficial comparison, cause these two cases differ a huge lot.
2. You’re a bit misinterpreting the idea of having rights over having ties.
You see, there are three parameters in which Jews beat Palestinian Arabs:
a. They were there first.
Cue the Kingdoms of Israel/Judea.
While Arabs made any significant appearance there only many centuries later.
b. They never cut of their ties with the Land.
Cue daily prayer for return home, ever since the exile 2000 years ago.
While Muslims have no such intimate home-bound feelings towards Jerusalem or Israel.
c. They turned a desert into a garden.
Cue Israel of the 19th vs the 20th centuries – there are descriptions, eg. Mark Twain.
Until the huge influx of the Jewish returning population, Israel was a wasteland.
Now it’s a country with world-level technological inventions and also a flourishing garden.
To sum up:
Jews were there first, stayed tuned to and improved much more – which would definitely give them more rights over some nearly passer-by’s.
> *Originally posted by **[somebody613](/forums/9/topics/11474?page=3#posts-6377978):***
> You sound right, except…
> 1. Would you also vote for returning a good half of USA to the native Indians?
> Though this is only a very superficial comparison, cause these two cases differ a huge lot.
> 2. You’re a bit misinterpreting the idea of having rights over having ties.
> You see, there are three parameters in which Jews beat Palestinian Arabs:
> a. They were there first.
> Cue the Kingdoms of Israel/Judea.
> While Arabs made any significant appearance there only many centuries later.
> b. They never cut of their ties with the Land.
> Cue daily prayer for return home, ever since the exile 2000 years ago.
> While Muslims have no such intimate home-bound feelings towards Jerusalem or Israel.
> c. They turned a desert into a garden.
> Cue Israel of the 19th vs the 20th centuries – there are descriptions, eg. Mark Twain.
> Until the huge influx of the Jewish returning population, Israel was a wasteland.
> Now it’s a country with world-level technological inventions and also a flourishing garden.
> To sum up:
> Jews were there first, stayed tuned to and improved much more – which would definitely give them more rights over some nearly passer-by’s.
A- So just because your forefather father lived some where
2000 years ago you have right to kick the currents tenants out?
B- This is not arab’s problem, is it?
C- Well following this reason, Nazis were very good as they invented many things. Hell on this scale they are better than jews
(Am I **GOOD** at insults?)
a. No, but these tenants have vast surrounding low-populated territories to relocate themselves, if not for stupid politics.
b. Extension to above.
Having strong ties and feelings towards something makes it more important to happen.
To consciously deny this opportunity, is cruel or hate-driven.
Again, Muslims have no special FEELINGS towards the place, only materialistic.
Which can be paid in money easily – if they wished so.
c. Another extension.
If it was something extremely expensive or labored on, it would be different.
But Israel under Arabs was a WASTELAND.
To hold on it, wasn’t due to its materialistic value, cause it had nearly none, but pure politics.
In this case, to prevent it being given to someone who truly wants the place, not its value.
Also, Jews turned the wasteland into a garden, which means putting in huge effort and resources – why should Arabs benefit from something they didn’t want to do for centuries?
Anyways, this is a stupid topic to “discuss” – if everyone haven’t figured it YET.
> a. No, but these tenants have vast surrounding low-populated territories to relocate themselves, if not for stupid politics.
That is the worse argument for moving people off land that they have been brought up on and farmed for centuries. It’s actually quite a disgusting response.
> Again, Muslims have no special FEELINGS towards the place, only materialistic.
And you know this how?
> But Israel under Arabs was a WASTELAND.
You think Israelies alone have built Israel? No money and help from others? Naive to think.
Sure, cause YOU said so.
a. This is an argument of “I have serious emotional ties to this place, you don’t, so why are you so stubborn to decline my offers to buy it?”
Learn some history, would you.
b. And you know otherwise HOW?
Bring me any linked example of special ties between Islam and Israel.
No, a built Mosque is no SPECIAL tie, they have thousands of them, some very old – all over the ME region and beyond.
Anything either historical or religious that would apply to ALL Muslims, huh?
As of the Jewish ties:
> Observant Jews recite the Amidah at **each of three prayer services in a typical weekday: morning, afternoon, and evening**.
> The language of the Amidah most likely dates from the mishnaic period, both before and after the destruction of the Temple **(70 CE)** at which time it was considered unnecessary to prescribe its text and content.
> The nineteen blessings are as follows:
> …10. Known as Galuyot (“diasporas”), this prayer asks God to **allow the ingathering of the Jewish exiles back to the land of Israel**.
Now, I’m waiting for ANYTHING Muslim-related of the same IMPORTANCE.
c. But they WANTED and so DID, while the “tenants” couldn’t CARE less.
(I wouldn’t call CALIPHS and SHEIKHS “poor”, would you?)