Gay Marriage page 121

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I believe that Gay marriage should be legalized in all countries because it allows people to choose who they want to be with for their life. It is a very personal decision for the couple, but the decision of marriage shouldn’t be disallowed.

You can look at it from another perspective. Let’s say a guy and a woman want to get married, but they can’t because of the law; we have the same issue but with the other group. The world should have less double standards in life, so that way everybody has a happier life in marriage.

Also when you look at it, you want to be with the one you love, and it shouldn’t have discrimination against it because if they are with the one they love, and if they are happy, it is OK for them.

 
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And so, my state joins the modern world.

 
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I fail to see any opposition to why non-Christians should have to follow Christian guidelines.

 
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In related news, today the Minnesota senate passed a bill that allows gays to marry in that state. Now, since our governor, Mark Dayton, is pro-gay marriage, this basically means that we’ll have one more state in the union where you can marry your partner.

EDIT:

Originally posted by TheBSG:

And so, my state joins the modern world.

BSG, are you a Minnesnowtan?

 
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The clan me and my friends play Bloodline Champions and Battlefield was The Superior Ones (tS1). So, yes!

 
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Ok, I have a HUGE issue with what you just said. Put yourself in their shoes; lets say that only the gays were aloud to marrie and that male and female werent. You reallt wanted to get married but nobody would let you. Now, you also must consider the fact that many gays commit suicide every day, they are verbaly abused every day, and in some parts of the US if 2 guys are cought walkin down a street at night, they could get very well beaten or even killed.

So we’re adding the fact that they cant even marrie the ones they love on top of all of these terrible things. How would you like it if you had to deal wit hall of this. At least the lucky ones, their parents accept them. There are a lot of family that have just started acting like they nebver had a son around them.

The only thing i think you said that was correct (in my opinion) is that it is natural. They where born the way they are, liking their same sex. Can you help liking woman?? No, because you alwase have.

My point is, why are we addig mroe stress on top of these people when they already have enough.
And as Macklemore even said, your still lictening to a book that was writen over 3,500 years ago?? I mean you can still worship whatever you do but honestly, your lictening to it about probubly the wrighters opinion on gays.

PtG
(btw im not gay)
Rebel_Gunner was here XD

 
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I agree with rebel 100% XD

 
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Originally posted by GameCrazyKid:

I don’t support Gay Marriage, I am strongly against it. One of the biggest reasons for this is that it is a distinct abomination of a Christian belief. Marriage has always been a religious ceremony (unless one was to bring up Roman marriage, but are we really going to take examples from the Roman empires?)

I don’t think there are any real religions that accept homosexuality, I think all of them either reject it or do not comment on it (But not commenting does not mean they support it. Or “it is fine”)

Also, I am a strong believer that homosexuality is unnatural. If we look at it with a scientific view homosexuality literally drains on the survival of the species. (No, I am not saying the human race is in danger of dying out, but the point still stands.)

And lastly, if we legalize Gay Marriage how can we say no to things like Polygamy? Does banning polygamy not bar the beliefs of Mormons? (The main point of this sentence being, where does it end? Where do we draw the line?)

But while I do realize that not everyone believes in my religion and not everyone should be bound by it’s law I feel like legalizing Gay marriage will tread on the beliefs of billions of people.

Honestly, I could care less if they were “legally bonded” or they were “In a partnership” but it is the term. The term “marriage” that I do not want being changed. Because the bible says “Marriage is between a man and a woman for love and procreation, any other definition is an abomination.”

Which is why I believe Gay Marriage should not be legalized (I realize in some places it is being legalized)

GET THIS. NOT EVERYBODY IS A CHRISTIAN. also, GET THIS: marriage was mostly political for a long time. marriage for love is a recent concept. Homosexuality has been observed in many animal species. Homophobia has only been observed in one. What’s unnatural now? Nobody is going to make it a law that everyone has to marry the same sex.

 
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Originally posted by Rebel_Gunner:

Ok, I have a HUGE issue with what you just said. Put yourself in their shoes; lets say that only the gays were aloud to marrie and that male and female werent. You reallt wanted to get married but nobody would let you. Now, you also must consider the fact that many gays commit suicide every day, they are verbaly abused every day, and in some parts of the US if 2 guys are cought walkin down a street at night, they could get very well beaten or even killed.

So we’re adding the fact that they cant even marrie the ones they love on top of all of these terrible things. How would you like it if you had to deal wit hall of this. At least the lucky ones, their parents accept them. There are a lot of family that have just started acting like they nebver had a son around them.

The only thing i think you said that was correct (in my opinion) is that it is natural. They where born the way they are, liking their same sex. Can you help liking woman?? No, because you alwase have.

My point is, why are we addig mroe stress on top of these people when they already have enough.
And as Macklemore even said, your still lictening to a book that was writen over 3,500 years ago?? I mean you can still worship whatever you do but honestly, your lictening to it about probubly the wrighters opinion on gays.

PtG
(btw im not gay)
Rebel_Gunner was here XD

That’s a great argument.

 
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I’ve no knowledge of what lies in the bible as I’ve never truly sat down to read it. I identify myself as Christian however, but I’m nothing of a hardcore that goes to church every Sunday. The point is, you hear people rambling that God loves everyone. Any race, gender, or sexuality. I’m not sure if you realize this, but honestly I thought that Christianity was to be accepting of everyone with no doubt? You aren’t accepting the homosexuality thus you’re going against the base of your religion and your god.

It’s natural to follow a religion to answer the questions in life that will never have an answer forcing you to come up with one yourself. Even if Christianity is the major religion of the world, that doesn’t mean we can base our laws off of it. Religion shouldn’t base the real world and govern it with an iron fist if we cannot even predict if our god is real in the first place. It’s all stories, isn’t it? Do all books shine the truth with no doubt and no lies? We cannot predict that the god we’re worshiping is real, thus it’s quite silly to give ourselves to cater to whatever whim we THINK they have.

The United States Government is to not judge those on their religion, sexuality, or race. But we have people running around still trying to keep gay marriage illegal. We’re being blinding by religion and also going against our written word. It also says somewhere that the government cannot be swayed by any religion of the sort since we’re all equal under the flag. Yet, we’re still going against our word because we have hardcore religion followers that work for the government spewing their blinded opinion swaying the majority opinion of the crowd as a whole. Can you prove since the beginning that man could not be with another man? Our true nature has been set in stone for years upon years to mate with a female to reproduce, but we’re not simply animals anymore. We have a free will to love and live what we like.

If you’re already against gay marriage, are you against all those who are not heterosexual? Trans-sexual? Personally I believe you’re blinded by your religion and that you must be open to new things. Something that all Christians must look at for a lucid point of view is chance and to not be set in their ways.

 
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I don’t care about whether not not gay marriage is legalized because it doesn’t affect me. I’m not gay so I really don’t care about it. It’s not something I’m going to vote for, but it’s also something I’m not going to vote against.

 
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Originally posted by TheQuietGamer:

I don’t care about whether not not gay marriage is legalized because it doesn’t affect me. I’m not gay so I really don’t care about it. It’s not something I’m going to vote for, but it’s also something I’m not going to vote against.

Since ya’re “younger” than the 21 y.o. ya state on yer profile (and, just what age would that be?), ya very likely just aren’t YET all that “engaged” in the subtle nuances of such societal isssues.

If one is a member of a society, ANY ISSUE WITHIN IT affects ALL members, including him….at least to some degree, even if it be of the smallest, almost unnoticeable ones. Enlightenment (via education: both formal & life experience) is most effect in helping to “notice” these “outer rings” of the “solar system” of a social group.

 
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I’ve no knowledge of what lies in the bible as I’ve never truly sat down to read it. I identify myself as Christian however, but I’m nothing of a hardcore that goes to church every Sunday.

You don’t see a problem with that? That sort of intellectual, moral dishonesty and laziness I also found a little hard to understand. On the one hand you believe God himself not only exists, but came down with some specific stuff to tell you, but that you can’t be bothered to read it?

Although really, I agree with the rest of your post. Nevertheless, I’d highly recommend cracking your bible open. I have to say it will probably surprise you, and not in a good way.

 
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Originally posted by Ungeziefer:

I’ve no knowledge of what lies in the bible as I’ve never truly sat down to read it. I identify myself as Christian however, but I’m nothing of a hardcore that goes to church every Sunday.

You don’t see a problem with that? That sort of intellectual, moral dishonesty and laziness I also found a little hard to understand. On the one hand you believe God himself not only exists, but came down with some specific stuff to tell you, but that you can’t be bothered to read it?

Although really, I agree with the rest of your post. Nevertheless, I’d highly recommend cracking your bible open. I have to say it will probably surprise you, and not in a good way.

Please don’t tell me you disregarded most of my post just to pin-point what I said in the start. Religion is a tricky subject and you can’t possibly believe that I’d devote myself when I’ve questioned every aspect of anything that could be questioned yet throw all of my curiosity away to follow a God blindly? When my parents divorced I lost my bible in the move and I only got roughly a chip off the block into it. I’ve no idea where it is now as my father most likely burned it for his self amusement. I’ve followed under religions to the point where you could call me a religion hopper. I like to know a bit of all.

Please, when you read my post look at it from a non-religious point of view and try to see what I’ve been trying to say. I’m happy you’re at least trying to reason despite the heavy debate over a topic so battered with hate. Do you perhaps agree with any other part of my post, but then again however as I said before I’m not highly religious at all so I’m not following the opinions of the assumed God that my religion follows. I’ll be honest and say that I believe in God only to a certain point. There are quirks that I wonder, doubt, and simply deny because I’m a “I’ll believe it when I see it” type of person which kicks in when people spew theories at me.

 
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Originally posted by WaxenWing:

Please don’t tell me you disregarded most of my post just to pin-point what I said in the start.

He said he agreed with the rest of your post.

Religion is a tricky subject and you can’t possibly believe that I’d devote myself when I’ve questioned every aspect of anything that could be questioned yet throw all of my curiosity away to follow a God blindly?

He’s not asking you to devote yourself to studying the Bible, or to do whatever else you just ranted about, just to read it. I think you’ve misinterpreted his post.

When my parents divorced I lost my bible in the move and I only got roughly a chip off the block into it. I’ve no idea where it is now as my father most likely burned it for his self amusement.

Well unless you live in some weird part of the world (or in the green lands of Not-America) it shouldn’t be very difficult to get a Bible.

I’ve followed under religions to the point where you could call me a religion hopper. I like to know a bit of all.

So does that mean you’ve started to settle on Christianity? If so,

I’m happy you’re at least trying to reason despite the heavy debate over a topic so battered with hate. Do you perhaps agree with any other part of my post,

YES!

Although really, I agree with the rest of your post.
but then again however as I said before I’m not highly religious at all so I’m not following the opinions of the assumed God that my religion follows.

That doesn’t change his opinion that it’s dishonest to say you follow a religion yet not know what its holy scripture contains.

I’ll be honest and say that I believe in God only to a certain point.

How does that work? Do you mean like how you don’t believe some of the things the Bible said God did or said?

 
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Religion is a tricky subject and you can’t possibly believe that I’d devote myself when I’ve questioned every aspect of anything that could be questioned yet throw all of my curiosity away to follow a God blindly?

I question your devotion to questioning every aspect of everything, and the absence of blind faith, in self identifying with a religion whose core scriptures are not only foundational to western culture but the supposed word of God himself. But by your own further admission, you’re a dabbler. I feel I may have come down a little over critically. Although I do wonder now why you would self identify as a Christian at all if you don’t feel strongly about it. Seems a loaded concept to throw your lot in with.

When my parents divorced I lost my bible

It is literally the most ubiquitous book on the planet. I assume any local Christian parish or Salvation Army store would be happy to furnish you with one. Likely even mail you one. Alternatively, it is also on the internet, probably preferably due to the ease of translation comparison.

 
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I don’t really see why not. I find it idiotic that two drunk straight people who barely know each other can get married in Las Vegas, but two gay people who have been in a relationship for years are not allowed to. If people are going to argue the “sanctity of marriage”, you need to argue it for straight couples too. Christ.

 
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The only thing that pisses me off about the gay debate is the fact that we’re still having it. If you are homophobic, stop dressing it up as anything else.

1. There are no studies that show that being homosexual / bisexual / pansexual / asexual harms human well being. Thus, currently, you cannot argue from a point of mental illness or harm.

2. If marriage should be about anything, then it should be about love. In my opinion, this also includes polygamy, as I really don’t see the problem with loving two or more people. (Seriously, what’s the deal with polygamy? Why is everyone so against it?) To be truly equal, marriage shouldn’t have any legal benefits. Thus, the above demographics should legally be allowed to get married, anywhere.

3. Secularism: Religious faith cannot be a justification for a government law. Thus, no religious counter-arguments are valid.

4. The duty of a public service: Due to our equality laws, any public service cannot discriminate. Thus, no church that can marry a heterosexual couple should have the right not to marry the above groups.

5. Being a homosexual does not prevent you from having children. It is not caused artificially. It is therefore natural.

If you find homosexuality, bisexuality, pansexuality or asexuality “icky”, then you have a social or dogmatic problem that you are simply blaming other people for.

 
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u know how this will end up ?
if u allow gay marriage
next they will request “sex with children” to be legal
if u allow that
next they will request “sex with animals” to be legal
if u allow that
u would not want to know what they will request next…

 
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Originally posted by NickWalker12:

The only thing that pisses me off about the gay debate is the fact that we’re still having it. If you are homophobic, stop dressing it up as anything else.

Nick, I don’t want ya to see my post here as being contradictory to yours. Rather, I hope ya see it as being a “from-left-field” approach to explaining some of the reason ya have the opinions ya express in your post.

I can well understand your frustration about how we are yet debating the issue of acceptance of ASO (Alternative Sexual Orientation). Right there, one can generate an opinion that by even differentiating a minority from the majority is a (somewhat?) discriminatory denotation. But, it might help to view the word “discriminate” in a light other than a pejorative . Discriminate:1.Recognize a distinction; differentiate. 2.Perceive or constitute the difference in or between. Of course, just as “The proof of the pudding is in the eating of it”, so is the REASON such distinction is being made.

In the future, such distinction will be observed for very benign reasons. A co-worker won’t be trying to set up an encounter (date) of ya by overly-assuming that ya are straight….as things currently are for most ppl. It has taken me a couple of years to use the term: significant other rather than wife, husband, girlfriend, boyfriend. And, I feel that my rather typical iconoclasm is hopefully being a plus in the transformation our society needs to generate. I also do this w/ gender-distinction….mailperson rather than mailman, etc. I believe great things are accomplish via great steps and by little ones, too.

Sure, of late (last 20 years—give or take)…there has been a whoooole lot of talk about this distinction. And, a whooole lot of it has been negative. But, in order to solve a problem…one needs to first acknowledge the existence of the situation as BEING a problem. Then assess why it is a problem…right down to all of the nasty details so that solutions/corrections can be discussed; then implemented; then tweaked as necessary.

However, as Bill Maher points out…once the overt awareness of the “gay community” came out of the closet (sorry,,, couldn’t resist), the progression of its acceptance into common, mainstream society (in America) has been extremely rapid. At least if one compares it to racism and “equality” between male/female.
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1. There are no studies that show that being homosexual / bisexual / pansexual / asexual harms human well being. Thus, currently, you cannot argue from a point of mental illness or harm.

I’m sure ya’re inferring: SERIOUS, LEGITIMATE, UNBIASED, etc. here. And, well….what are ya gonna do? People have a right to an opinion & to loudly express it….regardless of how ignorantly wrong it is. The squeaky wheel is the one that gets the grease. In the case of the absurd “proofs” about ASO being (on many levels) wrong, the “grease” being applied to such shit is largely a debunking that is simply gobbling them up. Hell, some of them are even self-imploding. Imagine that?
LOL
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2. If marriage should be about anything, then it should be about love. In my opinion, this also includes polygamy, as I really don’t see the problem with loving two or more people. (Seriously, what’s the deal with polygamy? Why is everyone so against it?)

I totally agree…have done so all of my adult life. At the start of it, while not being legal….the concept of “hippie communes” was being widely “explored”.
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To be truly equal, marriage shouldn’t have any legal benefits. Thus, the above demographics should legally be allowed to get married, anywhere.
issendorf touts a similar concept regarding “legality”. However, I’d like for YOU to expound on yer meaning on this. There just has to be SOME form of legaility involved so that the rights of both (all?) partners are legally protected.
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3. Secularism: Religious faith cannot be a justification for a government law. Thus, no religious counter-arguments are valid.

YUP….this wall-0-separation should be obvious. However, try telling THAT to the many ignorant ppl in my community.
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4. The duty of a public service: Due to our equality laws, any public service cannot discriminate. Thus, no church that can marry a heterosexual couple should have the right not to marry the above groups.

Ooopppps.
One might—and quite successfully I add—argue that ya’re now drilling holes in that Wall. Let’s keep govt. out of religion. However, a govt. official can’t be choosy…at all.
.

5. Being a homosexual does not prevent you from having children. It is not caused artificially. It is therefore natural.

YES!
In fact, one might even see such unions as being a positive because of the (likely?) increase of adoptions. Hell, the other options are already in place: artificial (or even “fun”) insemination for Lesbians and surrogacy for Gays.
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If you find homosexuality, bisexuality, pansexuality or asexuality “icky”, then you have a social or dogmatic problem that you are simply blaming other people for.

Yup…so intrinsically true.
But, tell jhco this….lord knows many (most?) of us on this forum have tried.
And, interestingly enough, he has totally failed to provide much of any other reason than: because they are “icky”.

Such attitudes are usually so ingrained in a person that for it to cease to exist…
the person has to cease to exist, also.
Fortunately, progress in the LGBT area is snowballing on three fronts: the literal “dying-off” of homophobic crowd, the enlightenment of the more open minded, and the “so-what’s-the-big-deal?” of the younger generations. I might note that such enlightenment is greatly enhanced by the huge COMMON SENSE information that is now being openly discussed (and “cussed”).

 
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Originally posted by jiuribu:

u know how this will end up ?
if u allow gay marriage
next they will request “sex with children” to be legal
if u allow that
next they will request “sex with animals” to be legal
if u allow that
u would not want to know what they will request next…

Gawd…
I hope that utter shit is sharply-pointed sarcasm.
And, I guess she didn’t know that he next request would be: marry my pickup truck.

 
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Originally posted by jiuribu:

u know how this will end up ?
if u allow gay marriage
next they will request “sex with children” to be legal
if u allow that
next they will request “sex with animals” to be legal
if u allow that
u would not want to know what they will request next…

Yes, because having sex with children & animals is something we all want. NOT!

Originally posted by NickWalker12:

2. If marriage should be about anything, then it should be about love. In my opinion, this also includes polygamy, as I really don’t see the problem with loving two or more people.

I love tens of people. That is my family, of course. I’m sure most others love more than one person as well. But I’m going to assume you are talking about dating and relationships, well, I find that quite absurd. Falling in love with two women/men? Not possible.

 
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Falling in love with two women/men? Not possible.

Ahh, the wisdom and experience of the teeny-bopper. Priceless! I had such a good laugh at that one, you really made my day.

 
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Originally posted by beauval:

Falling in love with two women/men? Not possible.

Ahh, the wisdom and experience of the teeny-bopper. Priceless! I had such a good laugh at that one, you really made my day.

Logically, it’s not possible. You can only love one person (besides family). If you say you love more than one person, it’s fake love.

 
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Originally posted by Kellathor:
Originally posted by beauval:

Falling in love with two women/men? Not possible.

Ahh, the wisdom and experience of the teeny-bopper. Priceless! I had such a good laugh at that one, you really made my day.

Logically, it’s not possible. You can only love one person (besides family). If you say you love more than one person, it’s fake love.

So it’s impossible because it’s impossible.

Ooooooooooooookay.