Abortion page 120

3076 posts

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Originally posted by Darkruler2005:

The both of us agree the adoption system needs a reform, and the both of us agree that we want to lower the amount of abortions, and that this can be done through a better adoption system. However, that updated adoption system currently is not in place. So, the discussion of values is between those of the woman and those of the fetus.

But there is an adoption system in place. It isn’t the best, but it is there. I mean, you can drop the kid off with any social worker, and he/she will be fine. Life won’t be optimal, but it never is. At least the kid has a chance then.

 
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You’re not arguing with me over women that aren’t physically, mentally, or financially affected over having a fetus delivered and/or taking care of a baby, because I don’t think they should abort either.

 
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So, I think you and I have this topic covered. We aren’t going to change our opinions, and we each think each other’s opinion is shit, at least, where we disagree.

 
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Here’s a new spin on what we should do: you can abort until around 5 months pregnant. after that, we consider the child alive. sound cool?

 
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Originally posted by rann13:

Here’s a new spin on what we should do: you can abort until around 5 months pregnant. after that, we consider the child alive. sound cool?

Has been proposed before.

Honestly, I’d rather it much earlier than that. I think the point vika generally uses is around 11 weeks.

 
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Originally posted by Ketsy:

Honestly, I’d rather it much earlier than that. I think the point vika generally uses is around 11 weeks.

Yeah. I agree that is not ideal. But, without two key things we have to draw an arbitrary line in the sand. Currently that line in the sand is when the brain’s formation begins in earnest and the first connections to the brainstem begin to form. It is not life we are trying to detect, but sentience.

The two key issues are as follows:

1. We do not yet have an accurate picture of which brain structures are home to self awareness, nor the earliest possible developmental configuration in which they can function.

2. Even assuming issue 1 above, was solved, we lack any way to monitor the fetus in the womb, with sufficient depth that we can determine when it has hit that point in its individual development.

So, whilst the yardstick we do use, is not measuring sentience itself (it is certain that sentience has not formed at this point), we use it because it is the only yardstick we can use.

 
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Abortion is wrong. It is murder. If you don’t want to get pregnant DON’T HAVE SEX!!! Wait until Marriage for sex when you are prepared for a child.

 
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I find that the amount of abortions are completely disgusting.
There’s no reason for this many abortions.

Originally posted by EPR89:

Even a perfect adoption system would not offer a place for every child that is the result of an unwanted pregnancy.

Well, from what I’ve seen/heard/read the adoption system is pretty strict right now.
Sometimes you can’t adopt just because you are single from what I know, it’s not always the case, but it seems to happen all the time.

If it wasn’t so hard to adopt a child, then more people would adopt.

Originally posted by QuabbinHiker:

A baby is not a baby until it is born, simple as that. What a fetus might turn into is meaningless. A fetus is part of a woman who is pregnant – a fetus does not walk around on its own. It needs to suck the life out of its mother. It frankly is more like a parasite.

When the fetus is delivered from the female, it then is a baby and human, thus has the full rights of a human. A fetus is not a human. A fetus is simply a human in development with no rights at all.

It really is not that hard to understand

So let me get this straight, this is what you are saying.

A baby FETUS that’s inside the wound isn’t a baby.
Once the fetus comes out of said wound it becomes a baby and gets rights.
This baby, jumps up and starts walking on it’s own.

A fetus can’t walk around on it’s own, and a baby can’t.
Simple as that, bad analogy.

BUT NO YOU ARE TWISTING MY WORDS!

Here, let me explain.
You know of how pregnancy works don’t you, and you know about how a baby can be delivered early or be delivered late.
Does this mea-

Okay, I’ll make it shorter and slow down on making an ass out of myself.

A fetus is simply a HUMAN in development, so it should have no rights at all.
By this logic, until you stop growing, you have no rights at all, even though you are human.

Well back to making an ass out of myself.
Babies can be born early or late, forced, naturally, or delaying.
What makes a baby that is forced out of the wound days early because of complications, or anything really, less human than a baby that is hours from birth?

“It is really not that hard to understand”.

 
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Originally posted by Zachary_Greene:
There’s no reason for this many abortions.

There kinda are, actually.

Originally posted by Zachary_Greene:
By this logic, until you stop growing, you have no rights at all, even though you are human.

That’s sort of already in place now, considering there are very few rights you get while you’re still (legally, at least) a child when compared to a legal adult.

Though, one thing I would like to point out here, in the early stages of fetal development, it’s not even sentient yet, so it’s mentally on the same level as, say, a cow, and can be considered to not be a person yet, and as such not have the same rights as a person would.

 
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Abortion is wrong.

When I was a child, I was taught to recycle.

Abortions are thrown into the trash.

We should find a way to recycle abortions and protect the environment.

 
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There kinda are, actually.

No, not this many.
Shouldn’t people learn from others mistakes?

Lets assume all abortions are made by logical people, that had lets say a condom break or birth control fail, even though they should still expect it, lets assume that’s how it is.
Birth control improves and I’d guess condoms are too. So why are abortion rates skyrocketing?

That’s sort of already in place now, considering there are very few rights you get while you’re still (legally, at least) a child when compared to a legal adult.

Well, that’s partially true.
But does he agree with that? That’s my point.

I was saying completely though, we get rights before we are done growing.
At 18, not everyone is finished growing, often times not even 21.

But we never stop growing to be honest anyways, even if the majority is done with.

so it’s mentally on the same level as, say, a cow

>Crow


EDIT:

Originally posted by Cdr_CROWface:

Oh dear god he beat me back.

 
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I hate abortion like you hate pedophilia.

No, really, murdering a child is murdering a child, whether it happens inside or outside the mother’s belly.

 
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Originally posted by JohnDoe2:

I hate abortion like you hate pedophilia.

See, there you are just implying the world away. Again. -Cocoa.- That, trashcan of a poster, that is according to this, “toddlercuddle”.
There you are, just trying to stir shit up with a simple word. Shame on you.

Seriously though, stop trying to stir shit up everywhere. No one cares.


EDIT:
Editing in so I don’t bump this thread responding to the same person over such a short period of time.
[6Minute edit.]

Originally posted by JohnDoe2:

Toddler Cuddlers are very nice toward toddlers. They’re not pedophiles, on the contrary, they hate pedophiles for the bad things they do to children, Einstein.

Just because someone reported your account for shits and giggles and you actually got banned doesn’t mean everyone here feels that way.
Stop getting so defensive, it’s okay that you are in denial.

Oh, and here, let me just edit your wording a bit.
Pedophiles are very nice toward children. They’re not child molesters, on the contrary, they hate child molesters for the bad things they do to children, Einstein.

Take it a step up, or a step down from your wording, it all makes the same thing happen.

And yes, I’m able to read the tiny typing even without zooming.

I have never heard of anyone actually considering zooming in on it.
Disgusting.

 
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Toddler Cuddlers are very nice toward toddlers. They’re not pedophiles, on the contrary, they hate pedophiles for the bad things they do to children, Einstein.

And yes, I’m able to read the tiny typing even without zooming.

 
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Originally posted by Cdr_CROWface:

We should find a way to recycle abortions and protect the environment.

OK, Tyler Durden.

 
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there isn’t much to recycle in a standard abortion. A little spot of flesh and goo about the size of a pencil eraser.

 
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Would you kick a mother hen off a fertilized egg and step on it?

 
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Would you kick a mother hen off a fertilized egg and step on it?

If the analogy is trying to say we’re forcing women into abortions, you’re wrong.

 
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Originally posted by JohnDoe2:

Nobody would ever burn bucks like that, yet lots of mothers annihilate living creatures!

And we eat a lot of living creatures.

 
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Originally posted by FlabbyWoofWoof:
Originally posted by JohnDoe2:

Nobody would ever burn bucks like that, yet lots of mothers annihilate living creatures!

And we eat a lot of living creatures.

Apparently having a hamburger is somehow comparable to aborting a pregnancy. Brilliant!

 
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Originally posted by MyTie:

Apparently having a hamburger is somehow comparable to aborting a pregnancy. Brilliant!

Except for the part where you’re ignoring what John said in the first place.


Am I the only one noticing that this thread gets necro’d more often than not by trolls?

 
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Nope!

Remember, Gamecrazykid is the one who started it.

 
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Apparently having a hamburger is somehow comparable to aborting a pregnancy.

Please remind me again how killing one life is objectively worse than killing another.

 
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Originally posted by Darkruler2005:

Would you kick a mother hen off a fertilized egg and step on it?

If the analogy is trying to say we’re forcing women into abortions, you’re wrong.

That’s not what I was implying at all.