Why is unassisted suicide illegal? page 2

53 posts

Flag Post
Originally posted by Azolf:
Originally posted by QuabbinHiker:

Un assisted suicide?

What is the penalty for that crime? The death penalty? Do the cops slap the cuffs on and read you your rights if you choose to break the law and kill yourself?

In Singapore and India, a person who attempts to commit suicide and survives can be imprisoned for up to one year.

Better get it right the first time in those third world countries. Guess they have no clue about mental health treatment or something.

 
Flag Post
Originally posted by QuabbinHiker:
Originally posted by Azolf:
Originally posted by QuabbinHiker:

Un assisted suicide?

What is the penalty for that crime? The death penalty? Do the cops slap the cuffs on and read you your rights if you choose to break the law and kill yourself?

In Singapore and India, a person who attempts to commit suicide and survives can be imprisoned for up to one year.

Better get it right the first time in those third world countries. Guess they have no clue about mental health treatment or something.

That is a strong possibility. U.S. suicide laws have only been revoked in the past 100 years.

 
Flag Post

it’s nonsene to stop someone from doing what they want to themselves. Whether it’s only temporary depression or not. their life is not anyone elses property . it doesnt matter if their actions are rash and their problems exaggerated.

 
Flag Post
Originally posted by QuabbinHiker:
Originally posted by Azolf:
Originally posted by QuabbinHiker:

Un assisted suicide?

What is the penalty for that crime? The death penalty? Do the cops slap the cuffs on and read you your rights if you choose to break the law and kill yourself?

In Singapore and India, a person who attempts to commit suicide and survives can be imprisoned for up to one year.

Better get it right the first time in those third world countries. Guess they have no clue about mental health treatment or something.

Singapore is not a third world country, and neither is India. Although that sort of treatment is deplorable, it’s pretty awful in first world countries.

 
Flag Post

A frequent argument I encounter against suicide is that you’ll leave so many people that love you, e.g. your mom, your dad, your dog, your girlfriend just kidding, you’re a virgin. And I say girlfriend because men commit suicide at least 400% more frequently than women. Anyway, I submit to you that this is a false ideal. You’re evaluating it from your perspective. This person, call him “x”, also has emotions, and feelings. To him, the best thing he can do is leave, and your pressuring for him to stay is selfish on your part—you only want him to stay so you don’t feel grief, at the expense of his grief. In this sense, people who use this argument against suicide are the true selfish ones.

I understand that some people are in the wrong frames of mind when they attempt suicide, but I don’t think we should toss them into an asylum where they can’t commit suicide (if they fail). Who are we to decide their life is important? The whole “every life is sacred” ideal is actually a view proliferated by religion, and is not a rational, logical view to have. Rationally, if someone wants to end his life, it is his choice. If he fails and we stumble upon him, we can nurse him back to health, then offer him a cognitive behavioral therapist (since those are the most effective, though granted psycho-analysis processing groups may work since the depressed swine just wants some attention).

I actually really enjoy Futurama’s suicide booth. You get to select how you die, and I feel this may be an acceptable thing in the future. It’d have to be isolated, for one, so people don’t witness it and become sympathetic (sympathy is bad; empathy is good), blithering crybabies at the sight of a death. It’d also have to have a failsafe mechanism, like a questionnaire to weed out the generic, depressed for one day people (e.g. my girlfriend left me just kidding, you never had one, and now I hate life and want to die).

 
Flag Post
Originally posted by DarkBaron:
And I say girlfriend because men commit suicide at least 400% more frequently than women.

It’s my understanding men on average also commit suicide through more violent and decisive means than women; i.e. shooting out their brainstem, as opposed to a bunch of sleeping pills. I think when they finally do decide to check out, it is with more intent (again, on average) and with less of a cry for help than females.

I actually really enjoy Futurama’s suicide booth. You get to select how you die, and I feel this may be an acceptable thing in the future.

But still, couldn’t it be said that suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem? All religion aside, checking out permanently wouldn’t leave anyone the opportunity to get better. Regret would be a null point, since they’d be dead, but if they lived and found a quality of life they might be glad they did not go through with it.

 
Flag Post
If he fails and we stumble upon him, we can nurse him back to health, then offer him a cognitive behavioral therapist (since those are the most effective, though granted psycho-analysis processing groups may work since the depressed swine just wants some attention).

I don’t have a whole lot of faith in CBT (Cognitive Bullshit & Twaddle) as a means of ‘fixing’ mental health issues. It works in some cases and is utterly disasterous in others, strongly suggesting it is not a one-size-fits-all curative method. The problem is, in many cases we don’t know how to fix a broken mind. So fumbling about in the dark is better than doing nothing at all.

Often the desire for suicide is just a symptom. It’s no good treating the symptoms if you don’t also attack the root cause. Arrest a suicide attempt if you can, and then try and work out what the root issue is, and what can be done to remove it.

 
Flag Post

Cause its cheaper letting people kill themselves than doing it for them
Pretty much the result you get

 
Flag Post
Originally posted by Azolf:
Originally posted by QuabbinHiker:

Un assisted suicide?

What is the penalty for that crime? The death penalty? Do the cops slap the cuffs on and read you your rights if you choose to break the law and kill yourself?

In Singapore and India, a person who attempts to commit suicide and survives can be imprisoned for up to one year.

Do they get a shrink to help them with their problems? I certainly hope so. The old ‘Sit here and think about what you’ve done’ probably won’t work very well there.

 
Flag Post
Originally posted by Azolf:
Originally posted by QuabbinHiker:

Un assisted suicide?

What is the penalty for that crime? The death penalty? Do the cops slap the cuffs on and read you your rights if you choose to break the law and kill yourself?

In Singapore and India, a person who attempts to commit suicide and survives can be imprisoned for up to one year.

And then they bite their tongue off while in solitary confinement.

 
Flag Post

it should have the death penalty

 
Flag Post
Originally posted by DarkBaron:

A frequent argument I encounter against suicide is that you’ll leave so many people that love you, e.g. your mom, your dad, your dog, your girlfriend just kidding, you’re a virgin. And I say girlfriend because men commit suicide at least 400% more frequently than women. Anyway, I submit to you that this is a false ideal. You’re evaluating it from your perspective. This person, call him “x”, also has emotions, and feelings. To him, the best thing he can do is leave, and your pressuring for him to stay is selfish on your part—you only want him to stay so you don’t feel grief, at the expense of his grief. In this sense, people who use this argument against suicide are the true selfish ones.

An interesting perspective, for sure. One that removes intent from the equation, yes, but an interesting one. They aren’t trying to be selfish, they just want to minimize pain and suffering. Certainly, we can drag people out of depression much more effectively these days, and we’ve got some hot stuff on the horizon.

I understand that some people are in the wrong frames of mind when they attempt suicide, but I don’t think we should toss them into an asylum where they can’t commit suicide (if they fail). Who are we to decide their life is important? The whole “every life is sacred” ideal is actually a view proliferated by religion, and is not a rational, logical view to have. Rationally, if someone wants to end his life, it is his choice. If he fails and we stumble upon him, we can nurse him back to health, then offer him a cognitive behavioral therapist (since those are the most effective, though granted psycho-analysis processing groups may work since the depressed swine just wants some attention).

Certainly, a dangerous path to follow. For starters, emotion serves a purpose in such interactions- knock religion all you want, but it does serve a valuable purpose in imparting morals, or at least the fear of punishment. Remove it from the equation, and it’s that much easier for people to kill each other, which I would like to, at least personally, avoid. A human life has a non-intrinsic value- they are consumers, if not producers, of goods, and that ultimately drives the economy.
And the person certainly isn’t in the right state of mind. If you took two worlds, one in which the person was alive because of forced therapy, and in the second one, dead, because he wasn’t forced, I’m sure the living one is going to be pretty damn happy that he was forced through therapy and got all those extra years, that he would have regretted killing himself. I am, of course, assuming that we can effectively cure the root cause of the desire to commit suicide. Which we are getting better and better at.

 
Flag Post

To answer the topic title: It’s insurmountably difficult to get the people who are healthy and alive to empathize with the position of those who are dying or in so much pain that they would like to die; The latter people have far less time to make their case than the former.

 
Flag Post
Originally posted by TheBSG:

To answer the topic title: It’s insurmountably difficult to get the people who are healthy and alive to empathize with the position of those who are dying or in so much pain that they would like to die.

This is why the push to permit euthenasia as signed off by at least two consultant-specialists is so important. Medical professionals are healthy people who have plenty of opportunity to become intimately familiar with the position of those who are in unbearable, incurable chronic pain or dehabilitating, progressive, permanent illness.

 
Flag Post
Originally posted by PaperCap:

they should rathre turn it into a business. like abortion clinics. you should have control over your own life and be able to choose to end i whenever YOU want to. this way its cleaner

euthanasia is illegal

 
Flag Post

Depends on the state and the country, Crowbar. Some US states allow it, some countries allow it.

I also said, if you will note, the ‘push to permit’. That a push is needed to permit it, should have told you that it is not currently possible in many places.

 
Flag Post

Suicide heh
What a shameful way of dying.
People should kill themselves before committing suicide :)

 
This post has been removed by an administrator or moderator
 
This post has been removed by an administrator or moderator
 
Flag Post

Well, it has no reason not to be illegal, since if it were legal, people who contemplate suicide would think that the government thinks its OK that they kill themselves, aka, they don’t care if they kill themselves.

….Except for the fact that if you kill yourself, it’s kind of hard to receive punishment from the gov’t since you’re too dead to feel the consequences….

 
Flag Post

i dont think you would really care weather or not suicide is illegal…especially if you wont be around to face the consequenses

 
Flag Post

People who failed at suicide should really try harder killing themselves….
People who are just unable to commit but have thoughts of sucide, however, should be given at least an evaluated option as vika suggested.

Is it a reset function or just forfeiting own entity in the grand system?

 
Flag Post

There are a plethora of reasons, but a primary one is that suicide is most-often considered by those who are clinically depressed. These people are not in their right minds because of said depression. If unassisted suicide was legalised, it would work to say that it is okay to take your own life, and that would affect those at their most vulnerable times. The risk is, that they would be eencouraged to take their own lives by those to whom they are considered a burden.

What stops them from killing them self now? If they want to kill themselves, I am fine with it. Fewer resources will be used.

 
Flag Post

What stops them from killing them self now? If they want to kill themselves, I am fine with it. Fewer resources will be used.

You’re forgetting the resources that are wasted, due to the person’s death.

 
Flag Post

You’re forgetting the resources that are wasted, due to the person’s death.

Such as…?