Are you a good person? page 3

Originally posted by EPR89:

Originally posted by 422537:

Kind of getting sick of tired of this.
Are you ever going to explain how someone can by default be a criminal if the guy making the rules is supposed to be all just?

I don’t know the answer to that question but I can try and find out for you if you really want to know.

Originally posted by tenco1:

Originally posted by 422537:

Well fuck you too.

God bless you too tenco.

Originally posted by vikaTae:

Originally posted by 422537:

If you acknowledge that everyone has already broken the commandments, and will be punished for it, what is the point of bothering to follow them at all? You’re taking pot luck with the judge’s mood either way.

Because if I continue to break the commandments over and over again, intentionally. I am not remorseful and have not truly repented. But If I actively repent and seek forgiveness when I sin, I do so out of genuine remorse.

Originally posted by 422537:

Originally posted by EPR89:

Originally posted by 422537:

Kind of getting sick of tired of this.
Are you ever going to explain how someone can by default be a criminal if the guy making the rules is supposed to be all just?

I don’t know the answer to that question but I can try and find out for you if you really want to know.

Originally posted by tenco1:

Originally posted by 422537:

Well fuck you too.

God bless you too tenco.

Originally posted by vikaTae:

Originally posted by 422537:

If you acknowledge that everyone has already broken the commandments, and will be punished for it, what is the point of bothering to follow them at all? You’re taking pot luck with the judge’s mood either way.

Because if I continue to break the commandments over and over again, intentionally. I am not remorseful and have not truly repented. But If I actively repent and seek forgiveness when I sin, I do so out of genuine remorse.

Tell us aboot yourself 422537
How many of these commandements have you broken?

hey Ungeziefer,

Romans 3:20, Galatians 3:11.

And no it doesn’t contradict. Just because the Law is written on the heart, doesn’t mean it’s not the Law that shows us sin.

If you read the whole passage, it’s clear that John is talking about Jesus. It literally describes in a nutshell Jesus’ actions when he was on earth. If you also look up the definition, you will get the same answer, that it is referring to Jesus.

Tell us aboot yourself 422537
How many of these commandements have you broken?

All 10, according to the Word of God.

This thread needs locking. It’s just religious propaganda. If I want that I’ll take a trip to my local Church (If I can find it)

Also, one does not preach about being theist. One keeps it to himself and simply prays to their deity.

Good people don’t think they are good people. They just think of how to become better people. The greatest human is to humble to know their greatness.

Originally posted by 422537:

Originally posted by EPR89:

Originally posted by 422537:

Kind of getting sick of tired of this.
Are you ever going to explain how someone can by default be a criminal if the guy making the rules is supposed to be all just?

I don’t know the answer to that question but I can try and find out for you if you really want to know.

You don’t know the answer to that?!
Are you freaking kidding me?!
The whole thread is based on you claiming that in the eyes of God we are all guilty by default, even though we haven’t actually done anything ourselves yet, and that God is all just despite this obvious contradiction.

And you want to tell me that you don’t know how this is possible?!

You are literally the worst preacher I have ever come across.

Originally posted by EPR89:

Originally posted by 422537:

Originally posted by EPR89:

Originally posted by 422537:

Kind of getting sick of tired of this.
Are you ever going to explain how someone can by default be a criminal if the guy making the rules is supposed to be all just?

I don’t know the answer to that question but I can try and find out for you if you really want to know.

You don’t know the answer to that?!
Are you freaking kidding me?!
The whole thread is based on you claiming that in the eyes of God we are all guilty by default, even though we haven’t actually done anything ourselves yet, and that God is all just despite this obvious contradiction.

And you want to tell me that you don’t know how this is possible?!

You are literally the worst preacher I have ever come across.

I guess my preaching needs some tidying up then, I’ll try and be more helpful in future.

That’s not how the God of the bible works Shadowhopeful. The God of the bible tells us to preach the gospel to all men. Or maybe He was just talking to the disciples when He said that and I have misunderstood, but I doubt it.

Edit: I hate Kongregate just gobbling up posts when there are quotation marks in it…

If the God you describe actually exists he must be so proud of you.
You are perfect. You don’t question the stuff you have been told, even if there are good reasons to do so, you don’t doubt, you don’t think. You only repeat, without ever understanding what you are actually saying and without ever attempting to understand what you are saying.
You are like a human goldfish, absolutely happy in his tiny tank, swimming around in endless circles, full of bliss. And because that is so awesome you try to get as many other creatures to degenerate into goldfishes and have them move from the ocean into a tiny tank and live happily ever after in that murky water that hasn’t been cleaned in years. And all the time you tell them how the water is clean, while subconsciously you are trying not to swallow too many excrements.

You should be ashamed of yourself.

Oh I do think and I do doubt all the time, but whether or not I doubt and think, I always somewhat feel that my actions or approach is foolish, but I can’t help it. All I can do is try my best to improve upon all my countless flaws and accept what I can through discernment. Hopefully I won’t be so foolish one day. Maybe I’m just an utter fool, but I’m trying hard not to be. I in myself have absolutely nothing to be proud or boastful about.

But one thing I refuse to ever do is be ashamed for trying my best.

God bless you.

422537, I am afraid your comments are falling on deaf ears on this forum, assuming you actually believe what you are saying yourself. Speaking on behalf of informed Christians, please refrain from making such seemingly ignorant posts in the name of our religion. Again, assuming you are not a troll, your comments have good intentions, but please know your audience. They wont respond to religious jargon or maudlin, rhetoric comments. If you want to debate here, get to know your history, current scientific studies, and please, please actually read the book you are preaching if you are serious.

Originally posted by 422537:

All 10, according to the Word of God.

Congratulations, you have acquired murderer status.

1) Pass
2) Pass
3) Fail
4) Fail
5) Fail
6) Pass
7) Pass
8) Pass
9) Fail
10) Fail

I am 50% good by those standards. Sounds about right; I’m pretty ambivalent.

Originally posted by tenco1:

Originally posted by 422537:

All 10, according to the Word of God.

Congratulations, you have acquired murderer status.

According to the word of God, means hatred for someone counts as murder according to Jesus. 1 John 3:15

Originally posted by Benu01:

422537, I am afraid your comments are falling on deaf ears on this forum, assuming you actually believe what you are saying yourself. Speaking on behalf of informed Christians, please refrain from making such seemingly ignorant posts in the name of our religion. Again, assuming you are not a troll, your comments have good intentions, but please know your audience. They wont respond to religious jargon or maudlin, rhetoric comments. If you want to debate here, get to know your history, current scientific studies, and please, please actually read the book you are preaching if you are serious.

Yes it may be falling on deaf ears. But it’s not a good enough excuse for Christians not to preach the gospel, from a biblical perspective. Several times, in the bible, peoples preaching about God fell on deaf ears. If I didn’t read the book I surely won’t be quoting it. Preaching the gospel and apologetics are 2 completely different things. We are told to preach the gospel to all men. Apologetics is good, to be taken more seriously by some. But it’s not a command from God.

You have proven throughout this thread that you may have read it, but you didn’t understand what you were reading. Otherwise you would be able to address the criticism instead of going:
‘I don’t know… Also, PRAISE JESUS, otherwise you will go to hell.’

Seriously, that’s just pathetic.

Originally posted by EPR89:

You have proven throughout this thread that you may have read it, but you didn’t understand what you were reading. Otherwise you would be able to address the criticism instead of going:
‘I don’t know… Also, PRAISE JESUS, otherwise you will go to hell.’

Seriously, that’s just pathetic.

I’ve simply said what the bible claims – that all sinners will have their place in the lake of fire Revelation 21:8. I don’t condemn you, I don’t condemn anyone. The bible Condemns people. I’m not going to apologize for happening to believe what it says. And then for suggesting that you turn from your sin. It’s what we are told to do, to warn people. I just refuse to be disobedient. I’m not your enemy, but it seems the bible is.

Would it not be evil of me to not warn people of eternal suffering if I myself am convinced that some are heading in that direction?

I think I’ve managed to answer most of the questions that have arisen, according to my knowledge. I have failed to answer the one you said about being a criminal by default, and have offered to find out for you if you are really interested in knowing.

Originally posted by 422537:

Originally posted by EPR89:

You have proven throughout this thread that you may have read it, but you didn’t understand what you were reading. Otherwise you would be able to address the criticism instead of going:
‘I don’t know… Also, PRAISE JESUS, otherwise you will go to hell.’

Seriously, that’s just pathetic.

I’ve simply said what the bible claims – that all sinners will have their place in the lake of fire Revelation 21:8. I don’t condemn you, I don’t condemn anyone. The bible Condemns people. I’m not going to apologize for happening to believe what it says.

You don’t have to. But this forum happens to be called Serious Discussion.
So if you say bullshit like that and preach you should be ready to defend your position.
You obviously are not able to do that.

I think I’ve managed to answer most of the questions that have arisen

You haven’t answered a single one of the points of criticism that have been brought up. All you do is repeat the verses as if they were proof for their validity.
I repeat: all you do is preach.
You can either start to argue for your the points you make or you can continue looking like a pathetic bible thumper.

Addressing the concerns other people bring up, would be the preferred approach. Harder I know, but its the only way you’ll get anyone to take your message seriously. Preaching as you are, just makes it look like you don’t know what you are talking about.

You can quote a book without reading it. You can also quote a book without understanding it which seems to be what you are doing. Jesus came to fulfill the law and the prophets; therefore, we are not bound by the mosaic law which includes the 10 commandments. If you want to preach the Gospel, at least understand what the Bible says by studying it closely and not just picking out the really interesting parts. Also, the Bible says that, “All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God.”, but nothing about the 10 commandments.

And no it doesn’t contradict. Just because the Law is written on the heart, doesn’t mean it’s not the Law that shows us sin.

It specifically declares he was ignorant of the law. That is contradictory to the assumption that knowledge of the law is innate.

If you read the whole passage, it’s clear that John is talking about Jesus. It literally describes in a nutshell Jesus’ actions when he was on earth. If you also look up the definition, you will get the same answer, that it is referring to Jesus.

No, I find that rather unclear. Also the definition of Logos has nothing to do with Jesus, inherently. The use of the word “Word” is once again poor substitute as it strips the word of all it’s contextual greek heritage. Something systematically applied to the Gospels in order to render them a definitive authority. I would suggest you consult a non biblical source. John’s use of the word Logos is a call back to greek philosophy and higher thought. Logos has hundreds of years of history describing generative and preservative principles of creation before Jesus.

Originally posted by Benu01:

You can quote a book without reading it. You can also quote a book without understanding it which seems to be what you are doing. Jesus came to fulfill the law and the prophets; therefore, we are not bound by the mosaic law which includes the 10 commandments. If you want to preach the Gospel, at least understand what the Bible says by studying it closely and not just picking out the really interesting parts. Also, the Bible says that, “All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God.”, but nothing about the 10 commandments.

Yes it does, but Paul also says he would have not known what sin was, had it not been for the Law. Meaning the Law reveals what sin is, without it we cannot know. Jesus came to fulfill the Law. Not being bound by the Law is not a free pass to sin all you like. The new testament constantly quotes the old, including the Laws.

1 Corinthians 6:12 You say, “I am allowed to do anything”—but not everything is good for you. And even though “I am allowed to do anything,” I must not become a slave to anything.

The reason Jesus gave the commandments of Love is because it fulfills all the other laws of God. If you love God with all your heart mind and soul and your neighbor as yourself, clearly your not going to break any of the commandments, out of love. That is why Jesus said, by fulfilling these two, you fulfill them all.

When the rich man came to Jesus to ask him how to inherit eternal life, Jesus recited the commandments to him. Mark 10:17-19

Originally posted by Ungeziefer:

And no it doesn’t contradict. Just because the Law is written on the heart, doesn’t mean it’s not the Law that shows us sin.

It specifically declares he was ignorant of the law. That is contradictory to the assumption that knowledge of the law is innate.

If you read the whole passage, it’s clear that John is talking about Jesus. It literally describes in a nutshell Jesus’ actions when he was on earth. If you also look up the definition, you will get the same answer, that it is referring to Jesus.

No, I find that rather unclear. Also the definition of Logos has nothing to do with Jesus, inherently. The use of the word “Word” is once again poor substitute as it strips the word of all it’s contextual greek heritage. Something systematically applied to the Gospels in order to render them a definitive authority. I would suggest you consult a non biblical source. John’s use of the word Logos is a call back to greek philosophy and higher thought. Logos has hundreds of years of history describing generative and preservative principles of creation before Jesus.

It specifically declares had it not been for the Law he would not have known sin. That in no way contradicts the statement that the Law is written on the heart. Because the law doesn’t happen to be in an external location from his heart, doesn’t mean that Paul contradicted himself when he said both statements.

The whole reason Jesus was crucified is because the teachers of religious law accused him of blasphemy. Jesus did claim to be God. in John 8:56-59 Jesus says, "Your father Abraham was overjoyed that he would see my day. He saw it and was happy.”

57 “You aren’t even 50 years old!” the Jewish opposition replied. “How can you say that you have seen Abraham?”

58 “I assure you,” Jesus replied, “before Abraham was, I Am.” 59 So they picked up stones to throw at him, but Jesus hid himself and left the temple.

Why did the pharisees want to kill Jesus? They explain their reason in John 10:33 when they say, “We are not stoning you for any good work,” they replied, “but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, claim to be God.”

Again in John 5:18 where the Apostle John says, “Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the Sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God.”

Also see John 20:28 Thomas said to him, “My Lord and my God!” Colossains 2:9-10 For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form, 10 and in Christ you have been brought to fullness. He is the head over every power and authority.

Philippians 2:5-6 5 In your relationships with one another, have the same mindset as Christ Jesus: Who, being in very nature God, did not consider equality with God something to be used to his own advantage;

Originally posted by EPR89:

Originally posted by EPR89:

You don’t have to. But this forum happens to be called Serious Discussion.
So if you say bullshit like that and preach you should be ready to defend your position.
You obviously are not able to do that.

I think I’ve managed to answer most of the questions that have arisen

You haven’t answered a single one of the points of criticism that have been brought up. All you do is repeat the verses as if they were proof for their validity.
I repeat: all you do is preach.
You can either start to argue for your the points you make or you can continue looking like a pathetic bible thumper.

In your first post you say that if I make particular claims, I have to be able to give evidence for it. Well we both know it’s impossible to find material evidence for; giving an account to a divine and invisible being, the existence of his kingdom, existence of sin and proof for Jesus being the key to an unseeable kingdom and it contents. So why don’t you just stop beating around the bush and tell me to shut up and go away or use axioms.

Yes maybe preaching without historically or scientifically backing up my claims does make me look stupid and pathetic. But fortunately I can live with that.

Originally posted by 422537:

1 Corinthians 6:12 You say, “I am allowed to do anything”—but not everything is good for you. And even though “I am allowed to do anything,” I must not become a slave to anything.

Why not? What is the reasoning behind this, in your take on biblical terms?

The reason Jesus gave the commandments of Love is because it fulfills all the other laws of God. If you love God with all your heart mind and soul and your neighbor as yourself, clearly your not going to break any of the commandments, out of love. That is why Jesus said, by fulfilling these two, you fulfill them all.

Have you never heard the phrase ‘love is blind’? Many an atrocity can be committed by a person blinded by their love. They see someone else doing something they believe is harming the one they love, or the goals of the one they love, and they retaliate. Any of the commandments can be broken out of love.

It specifically declares had it not been for the Law he would not have known sin. That in no way contradicts the statement that the Law is written on the heart.

How can that be? Up above you said:

Paul also says he would have not known what sin was, had it not been for the Law. Meaning the Law reveals what sin is, without it we cannot know.

Does that not completely contradict your claim that these laws are innate knowledge for us? After all, if they are ‘written upon the heart’, that implies they are innate. How can something be innate, when it has to be communicated externally?

In your first post you say that if I make particular claims, I have to be able to give evidence for it. Well we both know it’s impossible to find material evidence for; giving an account to a divine and invisible being, the existence of his kingdom, existence of sin and proof for Jesus being the key to an unseeable kingdom and it contents. So why don’t you just stop beating around the bush and tell me to shut up and go away or use axioms.

Or you could do what the intelligent christians do, and use your own reasoning as your evidence. Explain how this is a valid line of thought with your considered reasoning, and address points raised against you with said reasoning.

Or you could of course just use axioms if you doubt your castle of belief will stand up to careful inspection. If it is so fragile that the merest whiff of doubt would bring it all crashing down, then go ahead, add an axiom every time a reasoned attack on your battlements is launched.

vika,

Well my take on 1 cor 6 is the same as what the bible says about it. You must not become a slave to it, i.e you shouldn’t let it take control of your life or idolize this thing in question.

This is what I am saying, it depends on the way you look at it, if you think of it as the laws having an actual location of residence, which is in the metaphorical heart, then it doesn’t contradict. If you look at it as part of someones natural reasoning, of course you would say it’s contradictory.

It’s already clear I’m not going to use axioms, as I previously mentioned to you.

Yes I have heard the term love is blind. And yes I understand that many atrocities can and probably have been committed because a person was blinded by their love. The commandments can be broken out of love, but they can also be kept in love. It just depends on which love the individual considers greater to them.

For example, an Amish community lost some of their daughters to a man who went into their community school with an arsenal of guns and took the lives of several young girls – he claimed he was taking revenge on God. The dad of one of the deceased girls, went to the home of the man with a couple of elders from the community soon after, to tell the wife of the murderer that they have forgiven him for what he has done. The distraught woman was confused and asked them how they could forgive him. They then quoted scripture to her, saying – “If you forgive men when they sin against you, your Heavenly Father will forgive your sins also.”

It depends on which has the greater love. It obviously wasn’t easy for this man to so easily forgive the murderer of his own flesh and blood, but I think he displayed that he really did love God with all his heart, mind and soul when he forgave this man. It must have took every ounce of strength in his body to do so.

Hatred and wanting revenge is more painful to keep in than forgiveness anyway, I would know from experience.