America, Liberals and Control (Feel better?)

20 posts

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Sandy Hook (R.I.P. to those who died that unfaithful day), that so many “controls” have been attempted?

First gun control, but on the news now, Suffolk County is attempting to control cigarettes, energy drinks and stricter video game controls are being attempted?

Basically, what I’m saying is why has America as a general been more “controlling” lately? Is it because of extreme liberal views? The news milking off tragic events as a scapegoat to blame Y for the cause of X, therefore encouraging the ban of X?

As a content american, these increase in controls are really starting to worry me. An entire virus starts/can be detected by a simple cough (comparison)

 
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“It’s all for your own good. You don’t know what’s good for you and you don’t know how to live your own lives so we’re going to live them for you! Now SHUTUPANDSITDOWN!”

Big Brother and Nanny State are here to take care of you.

 
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gun control

That’s been a debated topic for years, it’s just that now it’s in the spotlight.

Suffolk County is attempting to control cigarettes,

That’s nothing new, major cities have been putting restriction on smoking for years now.

energy drinks and stricter video game controls are being attempted?

Not sure about energy drinks, but people have been trying (unsuccessfully I should add) to get stricter controls on video games for years.

I’m not refuting your point that pushes are being made for stricter government regulations in America, but it’s not something that started with Sandy Hook or something that started in the last few years for that matter. People have always pushed for and against government regulations and the power of the government in general.

 
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I’m not refuting your point that pushes are being made for stricter government regulations in America, but it’s not something that started with Sandy Hook or something that started in the last few years for that matter. People have always pushed for and against government regulations and the power of the government in general.

This is true, and I am not denying that in any way.

However, since Obama’s re-election, he’s been pushing harder (or his large, radical liberalist support group) for control over many debated topics, abortion, gay marriage, gun control, video game violence, energy drinks, cigarettes, etc. and lately, it’s been more sucessful than in the past if you ask me.

 
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or control over many debated topics, abortion, gay marriage, gun control, video game violence, energy drinks, cigarettes,

I’m not sure Obama himself had attempted to gain more controls over abortions/video games/energy drinks/cigarettes (though if he has it’d be nice if you linked the article. The only one on that list He’s pushed for more control over is guns. He’s actually
pushed for less government control over gay marriage by wanting to eliminate governmental restrictions on it.

As for liberals in general pushing for these things, yes, many (though certainly not most) have pushed for these things.

 
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There are always these issues and desires for ‘control’ and ‘banning’ of substances, but when a tragedy strikes, people decide to use it for their own gains. It just becomes more fuel for their ‘selfish’ gains. Look at this horrible bad thing that has [always] happened, now we have to tell you what you can and can’t do since the minority of the population can’t control themselves.

Hoorah for governments that would rather spend more time trying to remove and fix problems after the fact, instead of focusing on prevention in the forms of education, poverty prevention, and health resources.

 
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7. Thread titles should accurately reflect the point of the thread without resorting to sensational language. For example, “California overturning Prop 8 appeal” is a better, more objective choice than “Ex-confederate state denies gays basic rights”. Thread titles should not be misleading, either. They represent your topic, after all.

 
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Is this thread suggesting that politicians will try and use public interest stories and ‘research’ as a cover for passing laws that are really only in the best interests of those trying to pass them?

 
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Because you’re noticing the extreme number groups who want to control and/or regulate any facet of people’s lives more. It’s not that there’s more people saying “this bad thing needs more regulation” it’s just that you’re making a connection that really isn’t there.

 
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There are two kinds of people in this world. The first group, most of us are in. The second group is full of bankers, lawyers, politicians, and lobbyists. This second group isn’t exactly “evil,” but when something, anything happens on Television, in the Newspapers, and Online, they’re imagining how to benefit from it. Who can blame them? The thing is, we the people need to push hard against this force. You have to be skeptical of everything you’re told and why you might be told it. I’m not talking conspiracy theories. There’s enough truth in the world that a news station can decide which truths to withhold, and in that action is deception on a grand scale. The one thing I’ll agree with the NRA about is that enacting breakneck policies immediately after a school shooting is giving undue power to people who’ve just been waiting for it. I’m not sure they were making that point, but I am.

 
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Basically, what I’m saying is why has America as a general been more “controlling” lately? Is it because of extreme liberal views?

It’s more that as time passes, governments gain more and more power and authority. Take, the presidency. The stuff Obama and Bush are doing/did would have been unheard of in JFK’s and Eisenhower’s administration, and the stuff they did would have been unheard of during McKinley’s administration and so on. It not conservative or liberal, it’s the nature of the beast. Everyone wants more power; government, politicians, and bureaucrats are no different.

The news milking off tragic events as a scapegoat to blame Y for the cause of X, therefore encouraging the ban of X?

Politicization of tragedies, from Sandy Hook to Benghazi to 9/11 to the sinking of the USS Maine, happens time and time again by people all over the political spectrum. I find it as abhorring as you seem to, but it’s basically always been done and always will be by both sides.

As an aside and as Reject pointed out, this thread really needs a different name.

 
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Originally posted by DrOctaganapus2:

Sandy Hook (R.I.P. to those who died that unfaithful day), that so many “controls” have been attempted?

First gun control, but on the news now, Suffolk County is attempting to control cigarettes, energy drinks and stricter video game controls are being attempted?

Basically, what I’m saying is why has America as a general been more “controlling” lately? Is it because of extreme liberal views? The news milking off tragic events as a scapegoat to blame Y for the cause of X, therefore encouraging the ban of X?

As a content american, these increase in controls are really starting to worry me. An entire virus starts/can be detected by a simple cough (comparison)

Our president is a socialist. He is in the process of trying to become a dictator. So many red flags are popping up and I hope to hell the people wake up before it is too late. Everything that can be used to gain more power over the people is being used. Sandy Hook is just one incident that has been politicized in order to push controls the left has be trying to push for many years. The soldiers who were killed while training on the defective mortar round is another example. Instead of expressing his sorrow for the families in their time of grief, Biden politicized it and made a speech on how the sequester caused it. Even the military backed up on him for his little speech. Democrats talk a line of bull about how they are the compassionate party, then treat people like they are so much excrement. Exactly why I can’t stand them. Lying, even when it is an obvious lie is a normal part of how they operate. It’s sad so many believe them.

 
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…The soldiers who were killed while training on the defective mortar round is another example. Instead of expressing his sorrow for the families in their time of grief, Biden politicized it and made a speech on how the sequester caused it. Even the military backed up on him for his little speech. Democrats talk a line of bull about how they are the compassionate party, then treat people like they are so much excrement. Exactly why I can’t stand them. Lying, even when it is an obvious lie is a normal part of how they operate. It’s sad so many believe them.

From the Marine’s official statement concerning the issue… “We send our prayers and condolences to the families of Marines involved in this tragic incident,” said the 2nd Marine Expeditionary Force commander, Maj. Gen. Raymond C. Fox. “We mourn their loss, and it is with heavy hearts we remember their courage and sacrifice.”

And I give up… can’t actually find anything about a speech by Biden… I did, however, find plenty of commentary on a speech by Harry Reid who, far from expressing sorrow at the loss of life, etc opened with “My thoughts are with those who are injured and of course with the families of those who lost loved ones…”

“It’s just not appropriate, Mr. President, that our military can’t train and do the maintenance necessary,” Reid said. “These men and women, our Marines, were training there in Hawthorne and with the sequester it’s going to cut this stuff back, and I just hope everyone understands sacrifices made by our military, they are significant.”

The gist of all the commentary appears to be that ‘while using the activities at the Nevada facility as an example of critical training that would be cut, Reid did not appear to directly link the budget cuts to the deaths’… which would have been distasteful, to say the least.

 
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Don, for one to have an “appreciation” of the ideology-of-jhco, we should entertain the strong likelihood that he gets most of his “data” from sources that soooooo blatantly TWIST, SKEW, DISTORT, etc the facts of events in order to feed the absurdly ignorant biases their audiences of malcontents so luv to nurture.

I’m most happy that ya took the time to research jhco’s claims and gathered some rather strong data to disprove his claims. BUT, that swooooshing sound ya heard is all of it going right OVER his head (maybe in one ear & out the other…lol) because he is very adept as ducking such rebuttals-to-his-bullshit.

Ppl who believe ANYTHING they hear will spout it off as being the unquestionable gospel.
Of course, the one strongest motivator to believe is simply that it “fits” what they need to support their bias….rather than a seeking of the TRUTH.

Ya know….SELECTIVE HEARING.

 
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The gist of all the commentary appears to be that ‘while using the activities at the Nevada facility as an example of critical training that would be cut, Reid did not appear to directly link the budget cuts to the deaths’… which would have been distasteful, to say the least.

You didn’t include the most damning quote from Sen. Reid though:

“This sequester should go away. We have cut already huge amounts of money in deficit reduction. It’s just not appropriate, Mr. President, that our military can’t train and do the maintenance necessary.”

I question how much Sen. Reid even knew about the incident. It was a training mission and an accident happened. We could have doubled defense spending and an accident like this still could have happened.

I really like how the Democratic Party has suddenly become defenders of defense spending. When the hell did that begin? Oh, right, when it became politically advantageous.

It’s also amusing that Sen. Reid bemoans these arbitrary defense cuts when it was his BFF in the White House and his administration who proposed the cuts in the first place.

 
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Originally posted by donseptico:
SNIP

“It’s just not appropriate, Mr. President, that our military can’t train and do the maintenance necessary,” Reid said. “These men and women, our Marines, were training there in Hawthorne and with the sequester it’s going to cut this stuff back, and I just hope everyone understands sacrifices made by our military, they are significant.”

SNIP

Looks like I got most of it (remember I was going from the commentary, not the actual speech)

So he prefaced it with ‘This sequester should go away. We have cut already huge amounts of money….’ – and? as I (and it seems most of the analysts) read it does not say ‘the sequester caused a lack of maintenance which caused this accident’… all I see is, in precis, ’don’t take away this money, it’ll affect how much maintenance and training we can do in the future’

Pass on the Democratic Party / Senator two facedness (hey, he’s a politician, I expect no less) on the whole… the point I was raising was simply that JHCO appears to be misinformed and ‘scaremongering’ once again.

e.g. The senator, rather than the VP, made the speech*, in which he did express grief for the human cost, as did the marine spokesman… and that, from the surrounding commentary, there was no indication that anyone was suggesting the sequester caused this accident (although you could reasonably infer that reduced maintenance budgets may lead to a higher likelihood of such accidents (or reduced training opportunities) in the future).

*at least I still can find no reference to the VP making any such speech.

 
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Originally posted by karmakoolkid:

Don, for one to have an “appreciation” of the ideology-of-jhco, we should entertain the strong likelihood that he gets most of his “data” from sources that soooooo blatantly TWIST, SKEW, DISTORT, etc the facts of events in order to feed the absurdly ignorant biases these malcontents nurture.

I’m increasingly certain Jhco gets all his data third-hand from the guys down at the coffeeshop (after they’re all added their own biases in). Whenever anyone’s gone out of their way to find the sources Jhco claims exist (because he usually refuses to), they always contradict what Jhco himself is saying.

Which basically says he didn’t read them himself in the first place.


Originally posted by jhco50:

Our president is a socialist. He is in the process of trying to become a dictator. So many red flags are popping up and I hope to hell the people wake up before it is too late.

Yes Jhco, the red flags have been popping up for quite some time. Its why we don’t take anything you say seriously any more.

 
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So he prefaced it with ‘This sequester should go away. We have cut already huge amounts of money….’ – and? as I (and it seems most of the analysts) read it does not say ‘the sequester caused a lack of maintenance which caused this accident’… all I see is, in precis, ’don’t take away this money, it’ll affect how much maintenance and training we can do in the future’

I’m not really buying this stance by Reid. To me, it looks like nothing more than political posturing. If Reid really didn’t want the sequester to go into place (and again, since when are Democrats opposed to defense cuts?!?!), then he wouldn’t have moved the goalposts in the Senate by demanding adding revenue to something that was always intended to only be cuts. The Democrats pitched that the sequester would be armageddon: planes falling from the sky, ecoli in every hamburger, and there would be no more firefighters to put out a house fire, causing neighborhoods to burn to the ground. When the sequester happened and, shockingly enough, the world didn’t end and the President’s poll numbers began to drop, the Democrats decided maybe they didn’t want this sequester thing anymore.

*at least I still can find no reference to the VP making any such speech.

I’m not sure if Jhco mentioning Biden was an intentional mistake or an accident, but you are right in saying the VP said nothing of the sort. This was all Reid.

 
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I should also mention that Reid’s comments seriously pissed off the USMC.

 
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Originally posted by donseptico:
…The soldiers who were killed while training on the defective mortar round is another example. Instead of expressing his sorrow for the families in their time of grief, Biden politicized it and made a speech on how the sequester caused it. Even the military backed up on him for his little speech. Democrats talk a line of bull about how they are the compassionate party, then treat people like they are so much excrement. Exactly why I can’t stand them. Lying, even when it is an obvious lie is a normal part of how they operate. It’s sad so many believe them.

From the Marine’s official statement concerning the issue… “We send our prayers and condolences to the families of Marines involved in this tragic incident,” said the 2nd Marine Expeditionary Force commander, Maj. Gen. Raymond C. Fox. “We mourn their loss, and it is with heavy hearts we remember their courage and sacrifice.”

And I give up… can’t actually find anything about a speech by Biden… I did, however, find plenty of commentary on a speech by Harry Reid who, far from expressing sorrow at the loss of life, etc opened with “My thoughts are with those who are injured and of course with the families of those who lost loved ones…”

“It’s just not appropriate, Mr. President, that our military can’t train and do the maintenance necessary,” Reid said. “These men and women, our Marines, were training there in Hawthorne and with the sequester it’s going to cut this stuff back, and I just hope everyone understands sacrifices made by our military, they are significant.”

The gist of all the commentary appears to be that ‘while using the activities at the Nevada facility as an example of critical training that would be cut, Reid did not appear to directly link the budget cuts to the deaths’… which would have been distasteful, to say the least.

Yes, I named the wrong person. The speech was by Harry Reid….my bad.

The cuts amounted to a pittance of the current spending and was not a cut at all in actual spending, but a cut in the increase of spending. this means the military didn’t experience any cuts that would affect this incident. Basically, the administration has, is, and will continue to lie.