Do you believe in global warming? page 3

191 posts

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Originally posted by tenco1:
Originally posted by thecartm:

Actually, the way it works makes it take up about the same space.

The way what works, land-based ice melting, sea-based ice melting, what?

Water displacement.

 
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Originally posted by thecartm:

It doesn’t even matter how much water it is. It’s less than 1% of earths water (because only 1% of all water is fresh water, and ice is fresh water). Out. Of. 100% of all water. If it melts, so what? That means +maybe a foot of water. AT MOST. The real problem is…
The heat.

the average depth of the ocean is 3680 meters or 12080 feet. 2.5% of all water is fresh and out of that 2/3 is ice out of which 2/3 is land ice (3680*0.025*2/3*2/3=40 meters or 130 feet.) so it’s a lot more than maybe a foot. This does not take into acount the fact that water will expend when this happens which would make it roughly 50 meters. Think how many people this would displace. In fact just a raise of 1 meter would displace more then 100 million people and cose more then 900 billion dollar

http://www.tos.org/oceanography/archive/23-2_charette.pdf
http://www.grida.no/publications/other/ipcc_tar/?src=/climate/ipcc_tar/wg1/412.htm#tab113
http://www.grida.no/graphicslib/detail/population-area-and-economy-affected-by-a-1-m-sea-level-rise-global-and-regional-estimates-based-on-todays-situation_d4fe

 
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Originally posted by thecartm:

It doesn’t even matter how much water it is. It’s less than 1% of earths water (because only 1% of all water is fresh water, and ice is fresh water).

Actually, a lot of it is frozen saline. When you add salt to fresh water you lower the freezing temperature, but don’t eliminate it. At 0c fresh water will freeze. At ~-20c even saturated saline will freeze. When you consider the temperatures involved at the poles, its not hard to work out that a lot of the ice will have frozen with salt crystals in-situ.

 
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Originally posted by thecartm:
Originally posted by tenco1:
Originally posted by thecartm:

Actually, the way it works makes it take up about the same space.

The way what works, land-based ice melting, sea-based ice melting, what?

Water displacement.

It’s land based, motherfucker, it ain’t displacing shit.

 
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That means +maybe a foot of water.

I heard that it can rise up to a full meter per century. Entire coastal cities can be destroyed that way!

 
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Nvm, I quit. I hate numbers.
I’d rather just wear a shirt for this.

 
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Originally posted by jhco50:

No. In the 60-70s it was global cooling and pushed by the same people pushing global warming. The term global warming is no longer an acceptable term as it has so many bad connotations and falsehoods surrounding it. They now call it climate change.

Gobal Climate Destabilization. which is what’s happening. do we really have to drone up the same thing again? there’s no question climates are changing. wet climates are drying, hot climates are cooling, etc. this is simply the facts. now lets detabe the ramifications.

in the Netherlands, we need to figure out a way to strengthen our dunes, because our unpresedented lengths of drought is causing cracks in them.

 
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Originally posted by Twilight_Ninja:

I’m glad you mentioned that; it would be an interesting (school?) experiment to conduct someday. So basically, an ice cube does not have more density or more “compactly” hold water in a given space than the melted quantity of water?

Water expands when it freezes. If you fill a bottle full of water to the brim and let it freeze, you’ll come back to find either the sides of the bottle have split or the top has been pushed way off the bottle.

Ice is a far lower density way of storing water than the liquid form. So, when you have an ice cube floating on water (or an iceberg for that matter), the entire thing when thawed, including the bit above the water, fits exactly into the space displaced by the bit below the water.

Ice reaches its natural buoyancy point at ~90% under the surface of the water, so its always the same way providing the water is cool enough to allow ice to float in it in the first place.

Warmer waters such as found in the tropics, expand like ice does, so the ice melting will start to add to the level in this situation, because the liquid water is approaching the density level of the ice. However, the ice itself has a cooling influence on the local water, so it starts getting complicated at that point.

 
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The real core of the problem is that we are used to certain weather. If this chances we will have to adopt. I think we should not only be looking at how to prevent global warming but also what we are going to do to reduce it’s impact. If we wait until many large cities get flooded we will suffer massive damage but if we can begin to build dykes and maybe move small towns and villages we can greatly reduce the impact. We will also need to research a new farming distribution so we can grow the right crops in the right place with the new climate.

 
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How are we going to move small towns and villages when it is the people in these that are more likely to believe global warming is a hoax?

On the farming matter, there has been considerable renewed interest in the past year on constructing vertical farms in cities. With a tall building’s climate control capability, the environment outside would be far less of a problem than for an open farm.

 
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Begin moving the once that are willing to move, consider dykes where practical and stop giving building permits for terrains that will flood in the next +-40 years (most buildings won’t last more then 40 years). And general just make it clear that it is their own fault if their home get’s flooded as well as point this out to insurance companies (who will likely increase insurance rates in these areas).

For the food I was more thinking about building a database for various PH levels, temperatures and rainfall patterns and which seeds will grow and produce a large amount of food in these conditions. Then prepare large amounts of seeds and make sure to share this information with the 3rd world(as well as cheap access to these seed keeping the food price down is in all our interests). If done properly this could also reduce the global food price and reduce famine in the 3rd world while reducing pollution. I think that this is probably the most important aspect of prevent global warming damage.

 
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You guys should watch PBS’s Earth from Space NOVA documentary on Youtube
I think it’s fun to watch and there is another video with a different narrator who makes it more emotional, and exciting? Haha.

It doesn’t have a heavy global warming bent to it, and can give the common man/woman a good understanding of why humans can have monumental impact on the environment. Even if we feel so small, and what we do can not change the direction of the planet, we can because of the earth’s fragility.

The Sun itself will be what gives us life and our inevitable death. It still affects our planet’s temperature the most to this day, but that’s a given.
With time, the sun will burn the planet to a crisp, and consume the planet: with us long dead.

 
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thijser, moving the populations of villages is all well and good, but it’s just scratching the surface of a massive problem. A hundred or so years ago, London was the world’s biggest city with a population of around 8 million; these days it’s a very long way down the league table of big cities. Take a look at some of the numbers in this study.

Most of the worst risks are in the developing world, where they can’t afford even to begin constructing any sort of realistic flood defence. These countries are undergoing a process similar to the industrial revolution – people are flocking to the cities because that’s where the work is, that’s where the money is. As fast as you move people out, more will arrive to take their place. Reducing the risks is a wide ranging and complex problem, which requires a lot more than simply evacuating people who don’t want to be evacuated.

 
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You guys are being completely ridiculous. All of you.

Global warming isn’t a myth. It’s not “science,” It’s just propaganda that politics use to make money. If you’ve ever seen the movie, “The Day after Tomorrow,” the government pays a huge part in the people’s “survival.”

The earth does what it does. A volcano puts 50 times more pollution in the air than everyone on earth has put in the air in a year.

All “global warming” is, is political crap. All evidence shows that humans have no control over the planet’s weather.

 
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Originally posted by samuro2:

All “global warming” is, is political crap. All evidence shows that humans have no control over the planet’s weather.

Then you won’t mind providing some of this evidence.

If you’ve ever seen the movie, “The Day after Tomorrow,” the government pays a huge part in the people’s “survival.”

Do you seriously believe life is like a hollywood movie?

The earth does what it does. A volcano puts 50 times more pollution in the air than everyone on earth has put in the air in a year.

Show me the math behind that statement please. Factor in the devices such as cars, ships and planes that the people use, and the industry, both heavy & light that is producing all year round.

Show me the chemicals that volcano releases, compared to the ones our uses release (some of which have wrought unprecedented destruction, remember the CFCs?)

Let’s line them all up together and see how the two really compare.

 
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A volcano puts 50 times more pollution in the air than everyone on earth has put in the air in a year.

The USGS would say otherwise.

 
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Originally posted by samuro2:

You guys are being completely ridiculous. All of you.

Global warming isn’t a myth. It’s not “science,” It’s just propaganda that politics use to make money. If you’ve ever seen the movie, “The Day after Tomorrow,” the government pays a huge part in the people’s “survival.”

The earth does what it does. A volcano puts 50 times more pollution in the air than everyone on earth has put in the air in a year.

All “global warming” is, is political crap. All evidence shows that humans have no control over the planet’s weather.

I take my advice from a literal child and creationist who’s only citation is a roland emerich disaster flick.

 
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Originally posted by samuro2:

You guys are being completely ridiculous. All of you.

Global warming isn’t a myth. It’s not “science,” It’s just propaganda that politics use to make money. If you’ve ever seen the movie, “The Day after Tomorrow,” the government pays a huge part in the people’s “survival.”

The earth does what it does. A volcano puts 50 times more pollution in the air than everyone on earth has put in the air in a year.

All “global warming” is, is political crap. All evidence shows that humans have no control over the planet’s weather.

Can to explain how the government makes money of global warming and why they wouldn’t just put down a type of tax they don’t have to lie about?

 
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The earth does what it does. A volcano puts 50 times more pollution in the air than everyone on earth has put in the air in a year.

I’d like to address that one in particular. Since I used to believe that, oops. But honestly, look at the data, look at the studies. It’s blatantly false, there’s not a thread of science behind it. One lone wolf ‘scientist’ (with large corporate mining ties) whose name I forgot declared that as fact and it has taken a run. He never cited it, it has no information, no data, nothing to support it. It is simply false.

Can to explain how the government makes money of global warming and why they wouldn’t just put down a type of tax they don’t have to lie about?

Because people would resist it instead of celebrating it? I’m not saying global warming is fallacious, but if you think it isn’t being sold then I must disagree with you. Again, as always, never let a disaster go to waste. Dramatic, desperate, warm and fuzzy change is not without its share of dollars to grab. Look at the Kyoto protocols invoking global warming to sledgehammer wealth redistribution, China arguably the worlds largest Co2 producer is held accountable to nothing.

 
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I just love how you guys are easily diverted by troll posts. Even if this samuro2 is not trolling, we don’t need 5 regs to address one groundless post. Now get on topic, fellas.

Originally posted by Draconavin:

You guys should watch PBS’s Earth from Space NOVA documentary on Youtube
I think it’s fun to watch and there is another video with a different narrator who makes it more emotional, and exciting? Haha.

It doesn’t have a heavy global warming bent to it, and can give the common man/woman a good understanding of why humans can have monumental impact on the environment. Even if we feel so small, and what we do can not change the direction of the planet, we can because of the earth’s fragility.

The Sun itself will be what gives us life and our inevitable death. It still affects our planet’s temperature the most to this day, but that’s a given.
With time, the sun will burn the planet to a crisp, and consume the planet: with us long dead.

In a New Ager’s perspective, isn’t global warming the consequence of humans’ attempt to replace the sun with oil?

Now, we know that the lifespan of the sun is much larger than the geological timescale, so there’s no use talking about the sun’s inevitable expansion into a red giant; we better care about our own business first.

Originally posted by beauval:

thijser, moving the populations of villages is all well and good, but it’s just scratching the surface of a massive problem. A hundred or so years ago, London was the world’s biggest city with a population of around 8 million; these days it’s a very long way down the league table of big cities. Take a look at some of the numbers in this study.

Most of the worst risks are in the developing world, where they can’t afford even to begin constructing any sort of realistic flood defence. These countries are undergoing a process similar to the industrial revolution – people are flocking to the cities because that’s where the work is, that’s where the money is. As fast as you move people out, more will arrive to take their place. Reducing the risks is a wide ranging and complex problem, which requires a lot more than simply evacuating people who don’t want to be evacuated.

Most of the world’s population lives near the coastlines. However, for many of the coastal cities, the main threat is NOT global warming floods. For example, the most serious problem is still the hygiene issues.

 
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Originally posted by Ungeziefer:
Look at the Kyoto protocols invoking global warming to sledgehammer wealth redistribution, China arguably the worlds largest Co2 producer is held accountable to nothing.

About 75% of the energy in China is produced by coal. Most of this coal comes from the USA and they also have pretty good contracts. I mean good for the USA. Coal pretty much became the most important export goods of this country. And although China is much more relevant then 10 years ago, they got no chance for better contracts, because they depend so much on this coal. And the USA really want to squeeze out as much money as they possible can. To make thing worse, other cheaper sources for coal aren’t available any more, because the resources where faster exhausted then planned. Which of course rises the question, how much of this “black gold” the USA really has left. A question that I simply can’t answer.

The point is, that China is really motivated to change to renewable energy. And they really take things seriously, although a lot of their solar projects didn’t worked as planned. In general, they have power-breakdowns all the time, because their plans don’t really work. And the USA of course tries everything to fight renewable energy, to keep the US-American / Chinese “friendship” alive. But it seems like they slowly get things under control. Even if they have to use rather unorthodox methods: http://9gag.com/gag/aAYVxLR . (And yes, the usage of coal in private households is relevant in China. So using solar grills helps.)

 
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“believe” lol

lol, “believe”

 
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Originally posted by urine420:

“believe” lol

lol, “believe”

Just put on a dog collar and tell samuro that there’s a newly formed volcano somewhere in the middle of that glacier. She’ll feverently believe that’s what’s making the thing melt. It couldn’t be anything else, right?

Also posted by samuro2:

All “global warming” is, is political crap.

 
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You guys are being completely ridiculous. All of you.

Aaaaaaaand this is the Dunning–Kruger effect in action!! =)

 
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So, if I wait long enough, you super intelligent young people (with decades of life experiences to fall back on) who have listened to your group of scientists (a small group I might add) will be proven wrong. I tried to tell you how all of this works and you all acted like I was senile. Well, you might want to gander at this.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2415191/Global-cooling-Arctic-ice-caps-grows-60-global-warming-predictions.html