The Madagascar Plan & The Holocaust

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No, not the movie. Not like Pandemic either.

The Madagascar Plan was the Nazi Final Solution before they decided on death camps: mass population transfer of European Jewry to an African colony. It would operate as an open-air police state run by the SS, paid for using all the Jewish combined assets.

Some reasons they didn’t do it was that it depended on stealing a fleet from the British if their invasion of the Home Islands had been successful. It wasn’t, obviously, so transportation was a problem. Also land estimates reported no more than 7000 families could fit. These are Nazi estimates – Jewish surveyors thought only 500 could comfortably fit.

Eventually it all fell apart. It appears they were hoping to wait until after the war to actually kill all the Jews, but by 1942 the Nazi leadership realized the war could last for, like years, so they drew up plans to kill them while the war was going on – the Wannsee Conference

The question here is, if this had worked…would there still have been a Holocaust? Madagascar sounded pretty hellish. They actually counted on Jews dying during the sea voyage. And, regardless of the land estimates, they wanted to transport a million Jews a year for four years [!] and did I mention there were already people living there? But suppose it somehow worked, Nazis lose anyway…would we remember the Nazis with Wolfensteinesque loathing? It’s still a war crime – ethnic cleansing, and I imagine it wouldn’t have been too different from a death camp, except that death wouldn’t be the explicit purpose.

Thoughts? Note that I’m not trying to minimize the holocaust, it just seems like a curious what-if scenario. Nazism even moreso than vanilla fascism, forms much of our cultural ideas on evil…but take away the holocaust, and suddenly they aren’t so special.

here’s an essay about it, parts 2-4 cover it.

 
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It sounds like the Final Solution by the back door. If the Nazis were relying on Jews dying even before they reached their destination, then no doubt they were relying on many more dying once they got there. They would have struggled to find a more unsuitable habitat for farmers used to the Russian plains, so how were they supposed to feed themselves and four million others?

And what would have happened when the money ran out, or the German war machine was considered to be more deserving of some cash. It would have been like Gaza without the international aid.

 
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Nazism is basically a severe type of fascism.

 
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Uuuum I’m having a really hard time understanding what ur talkin about since i have studied World War 2 II yet or anything but, all I know is that the Nazis were baaad people. :P

 
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Perhaps we would have realized what they did, perhaps it would have ended like the Armenian Genocide

 
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Janton, i’ve looked at the links you provided, and if anything, I’ve come to the conclusion that the Nazi’s original plan was more vile than the one they carried out, not less.

In a hokey, diabolical overly-evil cliche villain kind of way, they literally intended to hold the world hostage, using several million innocents as human shields.

“Don’t you dare attack us back, or all these innocent lives will be immediate forfeit. Can you live with being responsible for all their deaths?”

On top of that, it shows a systematic lack of care for the health and welfare of the Jewish population, which is perfectly in line with the thought that as soon as the Nazis have won, they’re going to kill all ‘inferior’ segments of humanity anyway, so might as well save costs in the short term.

Sending them to Madagascar would however have been immensely stupid, strategically. It’s an island with no Nazi controlled territories nearby, so if it was attacked, reinforcements would be a long time coming. Strategically keeping the Jews in the Polish ghettos would have made more sense, as they would have been surrounded on all sides with territories directly controlled by their oppressors.

If anything, the Nazi’s own extreme xenophobia did them in, as they could not stand to have any Jews living in Europe, what they saw as ‘their’ territory, and the Jews had to be shipped somewhere else. Where they were shipped didn’t really matter – as that plan to stick them in Siberia attested to. Just so long as they were completely out of Europe, waiting somewhere else for slaughter, everything was hunky-dorey. Out of sight, out of mind.