Obamacare Causes Companies to Cut Hours page 4

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Originally posted by scoopolard:
Originally posted by karmakoolkid:

Ya know, MyTie….
“they” say the same fucking bullshit nonsense when the MINIMUM wage is raised.
A hard kick in the nutsack to all those who piss, whine, moan, wail, sob about SHARING this country’s great wealth (wealth, by the way, that also IS CREATED BY the working poor) w/ those who have no REAL, SENISBLE health care.

All this crap about Obamacare is just the new bigotry.
Ya can’t hate niggers,,,,
ya can’t hate faggots,,,
ya can’t hate Jews,,,
ya can’t hate Pollocks,,,

SO, let’s hate those fucking POOR PEOPLE who ought to be pulling themselves up by their own bootstraps. YEAH. They are the cause of all the problems in America. Let’s blame them.

Sound familiar?

What are you talking about?

.

Originally posted by jhco50:

I haven’t figured out half his posts, so I just ignore them for the most part.

That this is the the position of the two of you…..surprises me HOW?
And, jake-o is onto something there in the way of an answer when he sez: so I am just ignorant on them for the most part.

Originally posted by Darkruler2005:

How is it possible the Netherlands (and other countries) are capable of providing health care for everyone, and the US is too poor for that?

And THAT pretty much “tells the tale” of why there is soooooo fucking much bullshit in all the excuses//reasons why America can’t treat its “lower classes” of citizens decently…..esp. when we are supposed to be Christian in nature AND able to leap tall builings in a single bound.
 
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Originally posted by Ungeziefer:
In fact, I’m pretty sure it shouldn’t – but that is guess work.

I think there is too much resistance, and far too little money. That the most difficult period will be the transition period, and the most volatile. I feel to do this they need to do it right, and that any problems will be used to flagellate them and poison the well.

Unfortunately, I would agree with this assessment. A lot of the medical ‘technology’ offered in mainstream medical expos stateside is full of 1980s-era technology. Its why out of personal choice, I attend the european ones now, not the stateside ones. The stateside expos depress the hell out of me.

We have a long way to go, in the states, to get to a point where medicl capabilities rival those of first-world nations, and we’re only going to have one shot at creating a proper national healthcare system, so it may well be worth waiting till we get to a point where we can do it right.

There is considerable interest from European healthcare firms at tapping into the virgin US market. Because we are so backward in our capabilities there’s precious little local competition for what they can do. My employers are a perfect example of this mindset, and it is definitely paying dividends.

Once more European medical care providers are involved in the US market, and US medicl hardware has been pulled kicking and screaming into the 21st cenbtury as a result, then we will be in a far better position to nationalise it.

 
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So basically, the CEO of Papa Johns got butthurt over politics and decided to screw over a bunch of poor people to prove a point.

How are you guys defending this?

What if you lost your job because some rich guy wanted to prove a point?

 
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Originally posted by Darkruler2005:

How is it possible the Netherlands (and other countries) are capable of providing health care for everyone, and the US is too poor for that?

Because those nations have the US to provide for their defense.

 
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Originally posted by issendorf:
Originally posted by Darkruler2005:

How is it possible the Netherlands (and other countries) are capable of providing health care for everyone, and the US is too poor for that?

Because those nations have the US to provide for their defense.

ghahahahahahaha good one did you come up with that yourself?

 
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Originally posted by MyTie:
Originally posted by sCROWt:

So basically, the CEO of Papa Johns got butthurt over politics and decided to screw over a bunch of poor people to prove a point.

How are you guys defending this?

What if you lost your job because some rich guy wanted to prove a point?

This isn’t just an isolated case of one person who has a beef with politics. There are already more companies making the cut. For instance, I predicted that some companies would raise the price of goods, the DAY BEFORE news broke that Dennys would be adding a surcharge to cover obamacare. This is not rocket science. A new expense gets added to business, and good businesses must make changes to cover that expense. The three ways that is done: cut hours, cut workers, increase prices. This doesn’t come from “butthurt” but from the fact that the money must come from somewhere to pay for this. Why don’t you libs understand this? That’s the big news story here. Not the fact that companies are dealing with the costs, but the fact that libs are so oblivious to the costs and implications of their policies that they get defensive when the actual costs and implications hit the very people they wanted to help. Of course, the way that they deal with it is the way that the chosen one has trained them: blame others. So now its the companies fault that the costs of their burdensome regulations are hurting people. Fucking brilliant!

you may also notice that the CEOs of these companies are republicans

think about it for a moment

 
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The three ways that is done: cut hours, cut workers, increase prices. This doesn’t come from “butthurt” but from the fact that the money must come from somewhere to pay for this. Why don’t you libs understand this?

But we libs do understand this. (I’m considered a conservative over here btw). Obviously the money has to come from somewhere – it’s all a matter of priorities. Is a few cents on the price of your meal such a terrible price to pay for all that company’s employees to get access to decent health care?

 
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Originally posted by MyTie:
Why don’t you libs understand this?

And that’s where I stopped reading.

Although, I do like this word to descibe a lot of what these companies are doing: Self-fulfilling prophecy.

 
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Originally posted by beauval:

The three ways that is done: cut hours, cut workers, increase prices. This doesn’t come from “butthurt” but from the fact that the money must come from somewhere to pay for this. Why don’t you libs understand this?

But we libs do understand this. (I’m considered a conservative over here btw). Obviously the money has to come from somewhere – it’s all a matter of priorities. Is a few cents on the price of your meal such a terrible price to pay for all that company’s employees to get access to decent health care?

No, it wouldn’t be a really big deal, if it were just that, but it isn’t. The farm has to charge more for the food it produces to pay for the workers. The gas company that supplies the shipping company has to charge more from the transport trucks. The truckers have to charge more. The packaging companies have to charge more. The food outlets have to charge more. The brokers have to charge more. FINALLY, the restaurant has to charge more. When you buy ANYTHING, you are paying for a plethora of people’s health insurance. The price of EVERYTHING will increase, while the costs of individual healthcare will increase.

Originally posted by waffle_god:You may also notice that the CEOs of these companies are republicans. think about it for a moment.

Some of them are, some of them aren’t. They could be communist or anarchist, it doesn’t matter. The companies they run will have to deal with the costs one way or another. Expecting that CEOs will pay out of pockets for the health insurance of the US is silly. Expecting that they should is class warfare. Expecting the government to force them to is discrimination.

In other news: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/11/16/medical-supply-giant-stryker-corp-makes-pre-emptive-strike-against-pending/

From that article:
A “medical device excise tax” included in the mandate imposes a 2.3 percent levy on medical device manufacturers and suppliers, which critics say will raise prices on everything from pacemakers to prosthetics to stents. Companies will be required to pay the tax regardless if they have a profit or loss for the year. The tax is estimated to cost the medical device industry $20 billion.
House Republicans tried to have the tax repealed, drafting a bill called the Protect Medical Innovation Act, but the Democrat-controlled Senate has blocked the measure.

 
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Originally posted by MyTie:
Originally posted by beauval:

The three ways that is done: cut hours, cut workers, increase prices. This doesn’t come from “butthurt” but from the fact that the money must come from somewhere to pay for this. Why don’t you libs understand this?

But we libs do understand this. (I’m considered a conservative over here btw). Obviously the money has to come from somewhere – it’s all a matter of priorities. Is a few cents on the price of your meal such a terrible price to pay for all that company’s employees to get access to decent health care?

No, it wouldn’t be a really big deal, if it were just that, but it isn’t. The farm has to charge more for the food it produces to pay for the workers. The gas company that supplies the shipping company has to charge more from the transport trucks. The truckers have to charge more. The packaging companies have to charge more. The food outlets have to charge more. The brokers have to charge more. FINALLY, the restaurant has to charge more. When you buy ANYTHING, you are paying for a plethora of people’s health insurance. The price of EVERYTHING will increase, while the costs of individual healthcare will increase.

Originally posted by waffle_god:You may also notice that the CEOs of these companies are republicans. think about it for a moment.

Some of them are, some of them aren’t. They could be communist or anarchist, it doesn’t matter. The companies they run will have to deal with the costs one way or another. Expecting that CEOs will pay out of pockets for the health insurance of the US is silly.

I agree, expecting that the rich make sure that the poor people who work for them and allow them to make money have health care is asking too much.

 
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also these companies have more than enough money to pay for their employee’s health

 
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Originally posted by sCROWt:I agree, expecting that the rich make sure that the poor people who work for them and allow them to make money have health care is asking too much.

It doesn’t matter! (see below)

Originally posted by waffle_god:

also these companies have more than enough money to pay for their employee’s health

It doesn’t matter! What you guys haven’t figured out, is that it doesn’t matter who should pay for Obamacare, nor who has the money to, nor what is moral, nor any of that. What matters is who WILL pay for it. Who will? The consumers, the workers, the “poor people” you profess to help. They will pay with their hours. They will pay with their wage. They will pay with every extra dollar they have to spend to get the things they need. They will pay with increases in healthcare costs. They will pay. The poor will pay. The people you fight for are hurt most by your fight.

 
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Of course the poor will pay for it. So will the middle class, so will the upper class. What the intent is, is to put paying for healthcare within the reach of the poor. If they are really poor, then the cost will be waived, as is done in nationalised healthcare systems throughout the world. It is a tax yes, but a tax for an absolutely essential service, in the same way as we tax to provide police coverage.

The way it is currently being done is piss-poor, I agree, but its still a step up from how things currently are, and is probably the only way we could realistically move from the way things are done now, headed towards a basic health safety net for everyone.

 
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Originally posted by vikaTae:

Of course the poor will pay for it. So will the middle class, so will the upper class. What the intent is, is to put paying for healthcare within the reach of the poor. If they are really poor, then the cost will be waived, as is done in nationalised healthcare systems throughout the world. It is a tax yes, but a tax for an absolutely essential service, in the same way as we tax to provide police coverage.

The way it is currently being done is piss-poor, I agree, but its still a step up from howthings currently are, and is probably the only way we could realistically move from the way things are done now, headed towards a basic health safety net for everyone.

Do you think that the food industry should also be nationalized? And the home building industry? The clothing industry? The electrical and telephone industry? I wonder what our lives would look like if government controlled and provided all our needs. That apple iphone 5 would look more like a 1990s brick phone. The food at the grocery stores would be generic and scarce.

Government providing what we need leads to mismanagement. Left to devices of supply and demand, the market reacts intuitively to the needs of individuals. Instead of subsidizing what doesn’t work, and monopolizing everything to the point of stifling innovation, we should let the free market do what it does best.

 
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Originally posted by MyTie:

It doesn’t matter! What you guys haven’t figured out, is that it doesn’t matter who should pay for Obamacare, nor who has the money to, nor what is moral, nor any of that. What matters is who WILL pay for it. Who will? The consumers, the workers, the “poor people” you profess to help. They will pay with their hours. They will pay with their wage. They will pay with every extra dollar they have to spend to get the things they need. They will pay with increases in healthcare costs. They will pay. The poor will pay. The people you fight for are hurt most by your fight.

What a crock of shit.
Are ya gonna buy that bridge from those same folks that made ya such a good offer on that load of shit?
I’m guessing there is a whoooooole lot about Obamacare that ya just plain ol’ do NOT understand. Maybe if ya’d stop using extrme rightist sources…..maybe.
 
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Originally posted by karmakoolkid:What a crock of shit.
Are ya gonna buy that bridge from those same folks that made ya such a good offer on that load of shit?
I’m guessing there is a whoooooole lot about Obamacare that ya just plain ol’ do NOT understand. Maybe if ya’d stop using extrme rightist sources…..maybe.

What? I honestly don’t understand what you are saying here, or the point you are trying to make. Are you saying “no”, but trying to make it insulting or something? Dude, I really wish you knew how to form complete sentences.

 
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Do you think that the food industry should also be nationalized? And the home building industry? The clothing industry? The electrical and telephone industry? I wonder what our lives would look like if government controlled and provided all our needs.

I’d rather not live in that world till the government is not human controlled, thanks.

Basic healthcare is not like the food industry or the construction industry. Basic healthcare is a fundamental service of civilisation, same as police and firefighting.

A better parallel for you to make, would be an argument as to why we should take the police out of government hands, and give them over entirely to private corporations.

 
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Originally posted by MyTie:
Originally posted by karmakoolkid:What a crock of shit.
Are ya gonna buy that bridge from those same folks that made ya such a good offer on that load of shit?
I’m guessing there is a whoooooole lot about Obamacare that ya just plain ol’ do NOT understand. Maybe if ya’d stop using extrme rightist sources…..maybe.

What? I honestly don’t understand what you are saying here, or the point you are trying to make. Are you saying “no”, but trying to make it insulting or something? Dude, I really wish you knew how to form complete sentences.

LOL….THAT is exactly just what I said: YOU don’t UNDERSTAND much about Obamacare…..OR, much of anything at all….it appears, then.

AND, the likely reason is that YOU listen to the WRONG sources for you VERY MISINFORMED UNDERSTANDING about it. Such “sources” as ones who would sell ya the Brooklyn Bridge.

 
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No one addressed the single payer healthcare truth in my post at all and it really discourages me from posting here.

 
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When did you post that, then please BSG? I don’t remember seeing it, and a quick scan through the thread hasn’t helped.

 
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Originally posted by TheBSG:

You’re pointing fingers at the wrong people calling this problem “obamacare’s” fault. Your fellow conservative lobbyists for the insurance companies fought tooth and nail to insure this provision. Properly executed nationalized healthcare would have seen the premiums for employers’ benefits go down due to single payer provisions, cutting out unnecessary price gouging that doesn’t reflect the real value but a market value. The same reason Papa Johns bitches and moans about having to pay for healthcare on employees they wouldn’t have otherwise had to pay for is the same reason insurance companies fought so hard to make conservatives stunt nationalized healthcare: CEO’s pockets don’t have enough green lining. There’s nothing fiscally responsible about their reaction to Obama’s reelection, it’s posturing and you should really work towards leaving these childish things behind if you want the republican party to be taken seriously in the future.

 
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Yes, that’s the one of yours I found back on page two. I remembered it fro mthe first time you posted it, and at the time read it, agreed with what it had to say, then moved on. It was complete unto itself, a statement rather than an argumentative point, which wasn’t meant to be replied to.

You were talking about the far right’s handling of the issue, and why they try to blockade it. As I’m not on the far right, I personally cannot really comment – that would be up to someone who supports the GOP to do, but again there’s nothing really to argue there. It is factual, and to the point.

I was looking then for an argument you had made since that, which I was unable to find.

 
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Right, I was looking for some of the conservatives to address that point, since they keep going on about ideals without actually addressing the practical issues with NHS that were caused by uncooperative and corrosive legislation by the same people who are crying now.

 
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