Atheist view of Animal Rights

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Assuming we came from evolution, what rights do animals deserve? I say none.

 
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Originally posted by pacaholic:

Assuming we came from evolution, what rights do animals deserve? I say none.

I say they deserve human treatment. There’s a thread on this already, if you want to necro it. I’ve said my piece on there.

Linky: http://www.kongregate.com/forums/9/topics/29082

 
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I wanted to specify from the atheist viewpoint. However, i read what you wrote. You say they deserve human treatment, yet you also say its okay to kill them to eat. So do you believe it is okay to eat humans?

 
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I never said that, actually. I said in certain cases killing them could be human_e_. I also did say

but I personally think that the rule of thumb here should be “Could I do this to another person, without getting in legal trouble?”. Right up to the point where we kill them, that is.

Meaning we shouldn’t be allowed to intentionally starve, torture, etc. Medical testing carried out in a humane fashion, is, similarly, acceptable, because the animals are cared for fairly well.

 
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I think that even though we came from apes. We still evolved beyond them. Therefor that puts us higher on the food chain. Therefor we can eat them.

When an animal comes up to me and says “Don’t eat me and my race” I’ll stop eating them.

With rights. As long as we aren’t doing cruel things to them, like live skinning and testing experimental medicine on them, I don’t think animals have a lot of rights.

 
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Assuming we came from evolution

It has been pretty much established.

what rights do animals deserve?

Deserve? You mean in my opinion? Because there are laws for animals already. I feel the way it is going now is pretty much downhill. Some companies indeed abuse animals to provide them with eggs, milk, food, anything. That is not even legal in some countries, and I feel it shouldn’t be.

I think that even though we came from apes. We still evolved beyond them. Therefor that puts us higher on the food chain. Therefor we can eat them.

Just because we have the bigger guns, doesn’t mean we have evolved beyond them. That is only in our view. You could argue we have devolved, what with destroying nature and killing our own race.

When an animal comes up to me and says “Don’t eat me and my race” I’ll stop eating them.

That’s a joke, right?

 
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i am quite atheist and i respect all animals. except for the pests such as rodents, wild dogs, or other dangerous animals which i will kill humanely. I also am a fisher/hunter but i only shoot what i need. i actually have a predominantly vegetarian diet and only eat animals i hunt/catch and sometimes wild caught seafood from the grocery store.

 
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Animal rights include humans.

Might makes right.

Of course, you always have to consider other mights before doing something.

If you can do it, and you want to, go for it.

Only the consequences are stopping you.

 
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Originally posted by RMcD:

Animal rights include humans.

Might makes right.

Of course, you always have to consider other mights before doing something.

If you can do it, and you want to, go for it.

Only the consequences are stopping you.

some things are non consequential for instance i could spam and troll up this forum post things i most definitely shouldnt and oh knows i got banned like i cant make a new account and do it all over. i find actions like that would be more consequential for this website as compared to the offender.

 
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When an animal comes up to me and says “Don’t eat me and my race” I’ll stop eating them.

So you are perfectly okay with eating mute people or small children? I mean if the criteria is an ability to say no then certain groups of people should be edible as well.

 
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I eat meat, and I use animal products, so in all honesty I cannot think of any reason based on morals why they should have rights.

However, I personally believe that mistreatment and cruelty is something that animals do not deserve, although we are all rather picky about what animals have rights and what animals don’t. Generally speaking though, animals essentially have no rights.

 
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All life is precious, but when it comes down to it, humans always take priority over the others. I don’t want to see any life needlessly wasted, but when it’s done in a way to save of improve human life, it is entirely justifiable.

 
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I don’t accept the idea of “rights” in general, which alters the conversation somewhat.

Having said that, they should be treated as best we can manage. We won’t stop eating them, or using them for experiments, but we can avoid unnecessary cruelty while we do it.

 
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Originally posted by SaintAjora:

When an animal comes up to me and says “Don’t eat me and my race” I’ll stop eating them.

So you are perfectly okay with eating mute people or small children? I mean if the criteria is an ability to say no then certain groups of people should be edible as well.

He doesn’t mean literally (I assume). Any animal with a certain intelligence should not be eaten, like humans.

I can’t see how an athiest view of animal rights is different from a theist view.
Athiests also have sympathy and common decency.

 
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I’d say atheists are more likely to be sympathetic towards other animals – the “other” bit being the key point. Religions very often elevate mankind above the rest of the living things on this planet – as though we’re somehow better, or more special, or more deserving of good lives and so forth. An atheist is more likely to recognise that people form just another species of life on Earth, as they don’t have that mental block.

 
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I’d say atheists are more likely to be sympathetic towards other animals – the “other” bit being the key point. Religions very often elevate mankind above the rest of the living things on this planet – as though we’re somehow better, or more special, or more deserving of good lives and so forth. An atheist is more likely to recognise that people form just another species of life on Earth, as they don’t have that mental block.

Ashamed to be part of the group you’re saying having a mental block. Any way, your theory doesn’t hold. I haven’t actually seen anyone state animals deserved equal rights. Apparently, everyone thinks we are “better”.

With that said, it’s impossible for us to grant animals an excessive amount of rights. It would cost us too much pressure to maintain them.

 
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I haven’t actually seen anyone state animals deserved equal rights.

Behold.

 
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First of all, humans are animals. But I won’t put that into the context of this post.

Assuming we came from evolution, what rights do animals deserve? I say none.

Nice to know that you can’t give reasons for your opinions.

However, i read what you wrote. You say they deserve human treatment, yet you also say its okay to kill them to eat. So do you believe it is okay to eat humans?

No, because humans are our own species? Cannabalism is not natural among us as it is with some animals.

Meaning we shouldn’t be allowed to intentionally starve, torture, etc. Medical testing carried out in a humane fashion, is, similarly, acceptable, because the animals are cared for fairly well.

I bet you would be in outrage at medical testing on children. But at least you’re a lot better than many other people in terms of realising animals have rights…

I think that even though we came from apes. We still evolved beyond them. Therefor that puts us higher on the food chain. Therefor we can eat them.

I am more powerful than disabled people. Therefore it puts me higher on the food chain. Therefore I can eat them.

When an animal comes up to me and says “Don’t eat me and my race” I’ll stop eating them.

When a man who cannot speak comes up to me and says “Don’t eat me” I’ll stop eating mute people.

As long as we aren’t doing cruel things to them, like live skinning and testing experimental medicine on them, I don’t think animals have a lot of rights.

Reasons please.

except for the pests such as rodents, wild dogs, or other dangerous animals which i will kill humanely.

except for the pests such as diseased people, tramps, or other dangerous humans who I will kill humanely.

I eat meat, and I use animal products, so in all honesty I cannot think of any reason based on morals why they should have rights.

And I thought you were a good person. They should have rights because they are sentient and have forms of intelligence.

Generally speaking though, animals essentially have no rights.

Why?

All life is precious, but when it comes down to it, humans always take priority over the others.

Don’t you know that if the majority doesn’t protect the minority (in this case animals, which there are much less of in each species) when they have the ability and are able to act on conscious decisions, they are being selfish gits? Might makes right…to help.

I don’t want to see any life needlessly wasted, but when it’s done in a way to save of improve human life, it is entirely justifiable.

If I go and kill some kind of form of human I believe lesser (like a tramp-though I don’t believe them lesser, I’m just making an example) in a way to improve my life (eat him), it is entirely justifiable.

I may sound hypocritical, since I eat meat, but I only eat things killed humanely, kept humanely and having had a good life, unlike many people who simply pick up some battery chicken without a trace of doubt.

Any animal with a certain intelligence should not be eaten, like humans.

So we should eat the mentally disabled?

I’m getting ready to be flamed for this post.

 
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I bet you would be in outrage at medical testing on children. But at least you’re a lot better than many other people in terms of realising animals have rights…

Not really. Ever hear of medical trials? We do test drugs designed for children on children, though only after extensive animal testing.

I may sound hypocritical, since I eat meat, but I only eat things killed humanely, kept humanely and having had a good life, unlike many people who simply pick up some battery chicken without a trace of doubt.

Were I in a position to do so, I would do this as well. However, I eat at my school cafeteria, and who knows where they get their meat from. =\

 
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You go to a SCHOOL?

Holy crap, you’re way above the normal intellect level for your age (on forums, at least). I’m way below it.

 
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Originally posted by pacaholic:

Assuming we came from evolution, what rights do animals deserve? I say none.

Paca, by your own logic, then human beings by no means have any rights whatsoever, either.

 
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Everyone has rights.

Cows have the right to be eaten.

Cats and dogs have the right to be our pets.

Some animals just have more rights then others. Dogs and cats have the most out of all.

 
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So rights in your eyes are something exclusively granted by humans?

 
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Originally posted by zamininc:

Everyone has rights.

Cows have the right to be eaten.

Cats and dogs have the right to be our pets.

Some animals just have more rights then others. Dogs and cats have the most out of all.

That’s a very speciesist viewpoint to take. To quote Michael Pollan, what make cats and dogs prone to better treatment by humans than say, a possum or an eel? Because cats and dogs are cute to us. They’re useful, because we made them that way. So then by that logic, the rest of the world and all its ecosystems can go to heck because some animals aren’t as cute or cuddly as others?

 
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Originally posted by Rothycat:
Originally posted by zamininc:

Everyone has rights.

Cows have the right to be eaten.

Cats and dogs have the right to be our pets.

Some animals just have more rights then others. Dogs and cats have the most out of all.

That’s a very speciesist viewpoint to take. To quote Michael Pollan, what make cats and dogs prone to better treatment by humans than say, a possum or an eel? Because cats and dogs are cute to us. They’re useful, because we made them that way. So then by that logic, the rest of the world and all its ecosystems can go to heck because some animals aren’t as cute or cuddly as others?

Cats and dogs can learn more tricks. So they are more intelligent, thus having more rights.