'Tipping' for service - do you do it?

I wanted to bring up a social phenomenon that I have encountered in the USA, ‘tipping’.

While it is not mandatory that you MUST tip a server, it is customary and is wildly expected. How did this come about? Why do servers expect to be tipped?

I personally never tip anyone, because they are being paid to do their job. I don’t like this feeling that tipping is EXPECTED. They say you should tip for good service, but what if I am short of money, or felt the service was not good enough?

I am told that in restaurants a servers wage can be lower than usual due to the expectation of tips. I find that very arrogant. Tipping even for good service is NOT a law, so I don’t have to do it. Yet the majority see it otherwise.

The servers must be paid the minimum wage set by the government, and they go into the job knowing that tips are not guaranteed.

If you are curious as to why I am bringing this up, I went to dinner last night at a ‘Outback Steakhouse’, with the bill coming out to just under $30 American dollars. The waitress did her job, I ate my food, everything went fine. I left no tip as usual, but this time I was confronted by another server when coming out of the bathroom, demanding to know why I left no tip.

I politely said that I did not want to leave a tip, and walked out. I could hear her grumble as I walked out, since she could not argue with the logic that I did not want to leave a tip.

So the question for discussion is this I guess, how did this tipping mentality take hold so powerfully in the United States? What is it’s origins? In my travels in Europe and other places this does not exist.

Do you think tipping is fair? Do you think tipping is expected to happen, too much so?

Let’s discuss.

Just a couple random, disconnected thoughts.

First of all, it’s fairly common in some parts of Europe to automatically add gratuity into restaurant fees, so I don’t think you really have a point about the ‘tipping mentality in the United States.’ The tipping philosophy just isn’t uniform in the European Union because it’s a bunch of countries, not just one.

Getting minimum wage at a restaurant that you could expect to get some tips at is far below the wages you deserve. If you’re giving restaurant service, you deserve more pay than the wage of somebody flipping burgers at McDonald’s. So there is merit in the problem of restaurants lowering pay for tips.

I think a major point of the “tipping mentality” is that, if there is the general pattern of tipping for most good service, you then have the power to withhold such a tip for bad service. Somebody who doesn’t give good service will then earn less than an excellent waitress.

When I worked as a waiter, I made about $2.30 an hour based on the paycheck. Why? Because customers tip based on service. Instead of including the tip into your check, we let you decide how much the waiter/waitress should earn for their work.

Tipping probably started as just a way to give a little something extra based on the service and friendliness. But now with taxes and all, we usually end up making minimum wage anyways (so long as we report all of our tips.)

Although I agree it isn’t a law that you have to tip, hell, I got stiffed plenty of times, it’s more like a common courtesy around here. This is because that is what our income is based off of, and leaving no tip is like an insult saying ‘Hey, you sucked, here’s no money’. You are paying directly for our service, rather than being charged for it on your ticket.

No.

Not needed in Australia.

Main point is what Zshadow already said: Servers at most restaurants get paid about $2.15 per hour plus tips. So yeah, if all of the customers come in with a “You already get paid for your job, so why should I pay you extra?” mentality, I go home with $2.15 per hour that I worked.

But regardless, it’s pretty much a common courtesy to tip any service you receive, even if you know that they get paid a ‘regular’ wage. Barbers? Valets? Moving men? They should be tipped too, just out of common courtesy.

They say you should tip for good service, but what if I am short of money, or felt the service was not good enough?

You should tip for good service. If the waiter sucked, don’t tip. Or tip low. A minimal tip for “decent” service would be 10%. So at a normal restaurant like Chili’s or TGIFriday’s or something, you might end up spending $10 – 15 a person for a meal. So that’s a $1 – 1.50 tip, per person, for your service, assuming that it was decent service. Anything beyond that is a judgment call, depending on the quality of service you receive.

If you’re short on cash and can’t afford an extra dollar or two in tip, then you really should reconsider eating out at all.

In the incident at Outback, it’s the same thing — the waitress is getting paid around $2 per hour, and your tip would have been helpful, especially if she “did her job” like you say.

Do you have to tip when you go out to eat? No, certainly not. It’s your prerogative. But I do warn against going out to eat at the same place twice. Waiters and managers alike are amazing at remembering who tips, who tips well, and who doesn’t tip at all. So if they remember you, your next waitress may not ‘do her job’ so well.

I honestly don’t like/understand the idea that customers are paying the salary of people who work at a restaurant, and that the boss will hold it against you if you don’t. Why do customers have to pay for that? Why isn’t the salary higher?

The general idea behind tipping is that you as the customer decides how much the server is paid based on how good you think the service was. If you don’t like the service, you tip low, while if it was excellent, you tip larger. It creates a built-in incentive for good service, and lets the customer decide how good the service was.

You are of course free to not tip at all – but the waitstaff is also free to give you a level of service based on how much they expect you to tip.

Well, I noticed a problem with this whole system when I was working at bars, and it was that if people didn’t tip, the waiters just said “jerk didn’t tip,” and basically blame it all on the customer. Almost none of them ever said “didn’t get tipped, I’d better get it together for my next customers.”
That being said, I tip in restaurants and bars, but not in clubs. Come on, I’ve paid at the door, and I’m paying €2.50 for a small beer anyway, and they are getting night shift bonus. I don’t tip if the service was shitty, and I tip high if it was good, just the way it’s intended.
I do think, however, that it’s a jerk move to call someone out on not tipping as in the OP’s story. “Why didn’t you tip?” “Well, cause I didn’t feel the service was good enough.” is redundant conversation, the tip is there (or not there) to get exactly that message to your server.
By the way, I’m German, and we tip here. I’ve been to most bigger European countries, and you tip everywhere. It’s not an American custom. The only place I’ve been where you really, really don’t tip is Japan, where it would be seen as basically the opposite, namely a gesture that says “your place sucks, I bet you don’t make enough for a living here, I’ll throw you a nickel out of pity.”

I have another point that I’m surprised noone has brought up yet: As ZShadow and Frogmanex so kindly pointed out, industry standard wages for servers is about $2.15/hour. If the restaurants paid waiters/waitresses the wages they deserved without expecting gratuity, then you could expect the cost of your Outback Steakhouse meal to be in the neighborhood of $50-$60, or more. The tip concept allows restaurants to keep their overhead low, therefore keeping the cost of their menu items low. As many have mentioned before me, the idea is to give the customer some sort of control over what kind of service they get in an establishment: poor servers get low tips from everyone, reducing their pay, and effectively “forcing” them to seek out other employment.

personally i tip in the area of 20% even for okay service. usually on really big bills i will do 15% then round up to the nearest 5 or 0 to keep it clean. i rarely tip poorly unless the meal was bad, and the servers was lacking big time. But as an American i learned European Customs when i traveled abroad, learned their habits and if need be, i feel i could have blended in rather well, perhaps you should try this. it makes visiting other countries more enjoyably because you aren’t constantly complaining about how things aren’t the way you like it.

I have another point that I’m surprised noone has brought up yet: As ZShadow and Frogmanex so kindly pointed out, industry standard wages for servers is about $2.15/hour. If the restaurants paid waiters/waitresses the wages they deserved without expecting gratuity, then you could expect the cost of your Outback Steakhouse meal to be in the neighborhood of $50-$60, or more. The tip concept allows restaurants to keep their overhead low, therefore keeping the cost of their menu items low. As many have mentioned before me, the idea is to give the customer some sort of control over what kind of service they get in an establishment: poor servers get low tips from everyone, reducing their pay, and effectively “forcing” them to seek out other employment.

Costs should be the same if there’s a good employee, for customers that is. If it isn’t a good employee, he’ll most likely quit himself. What I think is odd is that this “bonus system” is being applied almost exclusively in this sector. I remember having a subject touching this subject somewhat, but it didn’t give any advantages or disadvantages, just stating that it’s also possible.

I myself think it’s odd, and I don’t think the costs should matter in this problem. Also, yes, tips occur in Europe.

It’s a complicated historical manipulation by restaurant owners and I can’t remember the whole story, but basically we should tip because most waitresses make most of their income on tips and next to nothing from their employer. Really, the system should be fixed so that it’s like any other job and they get paid decently, but that’s not how it works in the land of the free. They don’t do it in Canada.

Originally posted by TheBSG:

It’s a complicated historical manipulation by restaurant owners and I can’t remember the whole story, but basically we should tip because most waitresses make most of their income on tips and next to nothing from their employer. Really, the system should be fixed so that it’s like any other job and they get paid decently, but that’s not how it works in the land of the free. They don’t do it in Canada.

start a petition send it to your local rep. get an interest group together, make your voice heard. be the catalyst of change

Yeah, as a general rule, unless your server is a total douche or you’re drinking a lot of alcohol, tipping $3 per person is normal. I usually make sure that I leave at least $5 for myself, especially if I’m not the one actually paying for the rest of the meal.

I never considered the idea that the price of the whole meal might rise if the employees’ wages were higher. That’s a pretty good point, too.

I generally dislike the whole ‘tip culture’ thing, where it’s gone from being a nice surprise for a server to an expected thing in some establishments. Went in a place in London last year, and my group was presented with a bill… with a ‘discretionary service charge’ of 15% lumped in as part of the final bill. Service was nothing special, so we used our discretion to deduct the charge and were asked ‘did you know you haven’t paid the full bill?’

No, we paid the bill, you understand what ‘discretionary’ means, don’t you?

Tips are for going beyond expectations, while wages are for simply meeting them. Exceed my expectations, and you’ll get a tip. Do your job, and you won’t.

(PS – where I live (in Britain), the minimum wage is £5.80 per hour, and cannot be lower. So using tips to top-up wages has no relevance here.)

What I think is odd is that this “bonus system” is being applied almost exclusively in this sector.

There aren’t many sectors in business where most employees interact that directly with the customers.

Originally posted by Darkruler2005:

I have another point that I’m surprised noone has brought up yet: As ZShadow and Frogmanex so kindly pointed out, industry standard wages for servers is about $2.15/hour. If the restaurants paid waiters/waitresses the wages they deserved without expecting gratuity, then you could expect the cost of your Outback Steakhouse meal to be in the neighborhood of $50-$60, or more. The tip concept allows restaurants to keep their overhead low, therefore keeping the cost of their menu items low. As many have mentioned before me, the idea is to give the customer some sort of control over what kind of service they get in an establishment: poor servers get low tips from everyone, reducing their pay, and effectively “forcing” them to seek out other employment.

Costs should be the same if there’s a good employee, for customers that is. If it isn’t a good employee, he’ll most likely quit himself. What I think is odd is that this “bonus system” is being applied almost exclusively in this sector. I remember having a subject touching this subject somewhat, but it didn’t give any advantages or disadvantages, just stating that it’s also possible.

I myself think it’s odd, and I don’t think the costs should matter in this problem. Also, yes, tips occur in Europe.

I see your point, but consider this: In the restaurant industry, there really is no seniority system in place, nor is there one that can be implemented effectively (while keeping overhead costs for the restaurant minimal), for the service staff. In its absence, the current system of gratuity is used. For example, more experienced servers will be more effecient in their duties and know better how to communicate well with their customers, and will usually receive a tip directly proportionate to how well the said customer liked him/her. But that’s just rehashing what we already know, so, sorry ’bout that.

I also see it as incentive on the part of the servers, though. If all waiters/waitresses were all paid the same wage, then what would be the motivation to rise above mediocrity? Restaurants thrive on their service – build reputations on it. Consider two restaurants equidistant from you, both have similar menu items, competitve pricing: which one will you choose to dine in? The one with the great reputation for the service or the one in which the staff is doing the bare minimum in order to remain employed?

Here in the UK it’s also common to tip for a haircut, more so with ladies hairdressers but becoming more common with the proliferation of ‘unisex’ salons. Strangely, traditional male barbers shops don’t seem to expect this.
I’ve attended a unisex salon for many years and usually tip the girl who cuts my hair. Again it seems wages are low and the tips make up the deficit.

I never considered the idea that the price of the whole meal might rise if the employees’ wages were higher. That’s a pretty good point, too.

Unless people pay less than what wages a normal employee should get, costs are going to be exactly the same. The only difference is that the tips would be added directly on to the costs instead of being expected to be left behind as a “tip”. I don’t see the difference.

There aren’t many sectors in business where most employees interact that directly with the customers.

That’s true, but I don’t see why we would need such a system.

If all waiters/waitresses were all paid the same wage, then what would be the motivation to rise above mediocrity?

Okay, we have a problem here. We can apply such logic to all employees, no matter what they’re doing, or whom they interact with. For example, I worked at a distribution center where you simply had to pick up items, put them in your “car” (I won’t go into details, but it’s some sort of thing you can drive) and eventually bring them to the trucks. You can go fast, slow, or crouching, but you’ll still receive the same payment. There was a set amount of items you had to do per day or you’d risk being fired. Where is the motivation to go higher than that? There is no bonus for doing 100 more, or 500, so why not slack off? Or take it slower during the day so your boss won’t notice that you’re actually working less?

Restaurants thrive on their service – build reputations on it. Consider two restaurants equidistant from you, both have similar menu items, competitve pricing: which one will you choose to dine in? The one with the great reputation for the service or the one in which the staff is doing the bare minimum in order to remain employed?

The managers should see that people aren’t doing their best and act appropriately. I don’t see why customers have to do it.

Okay, we have a problem here. We can apply such logic to all employees, no matter what they’re doing, or whom they interact with. For example, I worked at a distribution center where you simply had to pick up items, put them in your “car” (I won’t go into details, but it’s some sort of thing you can drive) and eventually bring them to the trucks. You can go fast, slow, or crouching, but you’ll still receive the same payment. There was a set amount of items you had to do per day or you’d risk being fired. Where is the motivation to go higher than that? There is no bonus for doing 100 more, or 500, so why not slack off? Or take it slower during the day so your boss won’t notice that you’re actually working less?

There aren’t many sectors in business where most employees interact that directly with the customers.

The difference is that as long as you finish your quota as a ‘distributor’, you’re not going to get fired. If you DO slack off, it’s okay because your job is still being done as long as you finish your quota.

For servers, let’s apply that same logic. There are three servers working tonight, so my “quota” is 1/3 of all tables that come into the restaurant. I can work well, with a good attitude, moving quickly, etc. Or I can work poorly, be rude, take my time, whatever. Either way, I’m getting the same money, and my job is secure because I’m filling my quota.

The managers should see that people aren’t doing their best and act appropriately. I don’t see why customers have to do it.

Because, as a distributor, your manager can look at your ‘car’ when you’re done to make sure you loaded the appropriate amount, and loaded it correctly.

As a server, your performance is almost 100% judged by customer interaction. The only way for a manager to know if you’re doing well or poorly is to either follow you around, which they can’t practically do… Or take customer satisfaction surveys… Which people tend to not participate in.

Double the first number on the bill. Or 4-5 bucks, whichever is closer.

But if the servers of establishment “A” are doing the bare minimum in order to remain employed, there is nothing the managers can do about it, because the servers are doing nothing wrong. They are simply not going above and beyond in their duties. Do you imply that it the is fault of the other establishment’s servers for setting a higher standard of service? Even if “A” did increase the basic requirements of the service staff to match the level of excellence that the servers of establishment “B” choose to hold themselves to, then what’s to keep the servers of “B” from stepping their game up a bit to retain their reputation as the place with the best service? It’s the very roots of free enterprise.

I must ask, though, Darkruler, is there really no place that you frequent or avoid on the sole basis of a great or terrible service experience, respectively? I’m asking because people are creatures of habit (cliched, I know, but fitting and relevant). I’m not saying it’s impossible for a person to be completely unbiased in this situation, just highly unlikely.

Originally posted by NeilSenna:

(PS – where I live (in Britain), the minimum wage is £5.80 per hour, and cannot be lower. So using tips to top-up wages has no relevance here.)

Unfortunately that isn’t true at all. There aren’t many places that dont use the ‘tip pot’ to make up wages, it’s just that most customers dont know it. The posh places are the worst.
I used to work in the kitchen at an Egon Ronay stared place and on average total tips would be about £40-50 a night, at the weekends you could get a couple of hundred. They’d divvy it up once a month and we’d usually end up with about £50 each, out of 5 full time and 2 or 3 part timers.
People like to slate the minimum wage and use it as an excuse why this sort of thing happens but in truth, this was the norm before minimum wage came in, all it’s done is reduce the amount owners & managers cream off the top.
If McDonalds can afford to pay their staff £5.80/hr and still make a profit without using tips there’s no reason why a decently run restaurant cant.
Thats why I always tip in cash and give it to the waiter, not leave it on the table.

Originally posted by mRiz:

Originally posted by NeilSenna:

(PS – where I live (in Britain), the minimum wage is £5.80 per hour, and cannot be lower. So using tips to top-up wages has no relevance here.)

Unfortunately that isn’t true at all. There aren’t many places that dont use the ‘tip pot’ to make up wages, it’s just that most customers dont know it. The posh places are the worst.

I used to work in the kitchen at an Egon Ronay stared place and on average total tips would be about £40-50 a night, at the weekends you could get a couple of hundred. They’d divvy it up once a month and we’d usually end up with about £50 each, out of 5 full time and 2 or 3 part timers.

People like to slate the minimum wage and use it as an excuse why this sort of thing happens but in truth, this was the norm before minimum wage came in, all it’s done is reduce the amount owners & managers cream off the top.

If McDonalds can afford to pay their staff £5.80/hr and still make a profit without using tips there’s no reason why a decently run restaurant cant.

Thats why I always tip in cash and give it to the waiter, not leave it on the table.

I get the gist of your post, but there is an insurmountable difference in the cost of the crap that McD’s (or any fast food joint) thaws out on the grill and even a medium-quality unaged cut of steak from a low-end chain joint like Outback, so you really can’t compare profit margins between the two.

I haven’t read all the posts in this thread yet, but I will, so forgive me if I say something that’s already been said.

I know in Georgia, at least, while waiters get paid less than minimum wage (quite a bit less), if they report all their tips and end up with less than minimum, it’s the employer’s responsibility to increase their paycheck so they effectively get minimum wage.

However, anyone who has ever tried living on minimum wage can tell you this – it’s hard. If you have to support more than just yourself, it’s basically impossible to maintain a decent standard of living. While it is nothing but custom to tip people who serve you, I see it as a little something to show your appreciation for doing so – Any restaurant could make you come to the grill/stove, place your orders, and come pick it up yourself (like Fuddruckers, and other low-end chain restaurants that aren’t fast food). They could even run a more profitable business if they did so, probably. But they don’t – they make it easier for you. And believe me, working as a waiter is hard – they deserve more than minimum wage for their work, and since a few dollars out of my pocket really doesn’t effect me in the least, but the compound effect makes such a huge difference to the waiters, I do so.

As my parents taught me and as I intend to teach my children – if you don’t have the money to tip, you don’t have the money to eat out. I also chronically “overtip”, by the standards I’m reading here – I tip 20%, always.