Recent posts by Lloyd_Majere on Kongregate

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Topic: Kongregate / Kongegate Becoming TOO Adult?

@LouWeed, first, you can paraphrase with quotes, it’s a form of citation. Sorry that I wasn’t clear. Second, I’ve reported and seen people punished for simply discussing sexual acts (literally for just a conversation on ‘best position’), fairly innocently, and far less innocently than what some of these examples describe/show. Third, if you think “overly-sexual” gives enough wiggle room for blatant sex, then yeah, we’re definitely going to disagree.

You’re right though. The rule is not explicit. So, for simplicities sake, I’m asking them to MAKE it explicit. They should tell us why they allowed these games, but not the act of chatting about them. And I believe I stated “But I expect that in [explaining themselves], their statement will be weak, and left to question by people other than myself.” In other words, I’m not expecting much, but I do think they crossed a line.

You came into this thread seemingly to ask clarification. I gave it to you without any form of offense, and you jumped down my throat. If you were looking for a fight, congratulations, I pushed back. But again, like I just stated to FC, I’d appreciate it if you didn’t speak for those you don’t represent. I appreciate you bringing up the ambiguity of the Conduct page, but am rather against you calling me a “righteous zealot” and attacking my punctuation. This thread was to discuss the examples and the rules as they apply to users. If you think it’s within Kongregate’s right, say it and be done with it. In that vein, I believe you said everything you wanted to say on that matter, so yes, thank you for ending it there.

 
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Topic: Kongregate / Kongegate Becoming TOO Adult?

Originally posted by FlyingCat:

Again, I’ll reference Fifth Planet Games, the creator of LotS. Despite how violent their game is, the necessity for one specific character to curse in every line he speaks (it’s actually pretty impressive), and all the other unpleasant (although without a doubt hilarious) themes, they prohibit foul language, and mentioning of adult subjects in their chats?

Is Fifth Planet Games composed of hypocrites? I’d argue not, because one is a story rooted in fiction, while the chat itself is composed of real people. Just as it is okay for characters in a movie (Austin Powers again) to streak around a hotel naked or like some action film, show people getting shot in face, commit crimes, etc. it’s only part of the show. Theatrics if you will, and adult themes are just part of the story.

Should a art be compromised for the sake of it suiting everyones tastes? I’d personally so no. I mean really, just look at Pixar. They really try to fit in a lot of adult humor that fly over childrens heads. Cows and Rocketfingers are just a little more direct.

That… doesn’t make sense, sorry. Or are you saying that ratings are entirely pointless? That Kongregate should be allowed to host any and all manner of adult games for the simple matter that “art can’t be compromised” ? No, of course not. You can’t just upload of a ton of porn games to this site and call it art. There’s no doubt a gray area, but the fact is, SOME things aren’t allowed. Case and point, we have a flagging option for games that “violate Kongregate’s standards.” And based on the only reference page we have, a PG-13 rating is one of those standards. Yet Kongregate has endorsed some games that violate those standards. And I want to know why.

I get that you are still trying to defend this, but you can’t speak for Kongregate here. THEY are a company. YOU are a person with that opinion. A valid opinion, sure. But you don’t have to have a terms of service that you must abide by. Kongregate does. And Kongregate, as a company, can’t get away with excuses like “but it’s just art.” I’m not asking Fifth Planet Games about their ToS. I would if I was a part of their community, but that’s completely irrelevant here. I played a game once that censored the word “Damn” even though characters spoke it in every fight, and I fought against that too. But that doesn’t apply here. I want Kongregate’s defense. And I’m not going to get it from you.

You keep trying to reference movies from the past, or movies where things aren’t literally in your face. Pixar? Really? Show me one Pixar movie with full frontal nudity. Show me one Pixar movie where they discuss and smoke pot, or blatantly have sex on screen. If you want an answer, the fact is that the PG rating takes into account what the underage audience will and won’t notice. But of course, you’re going to loop that back around to “but 13 year olds are already corrupt” which is just circular and I’ve already addressed it. So stop.

Here’s the point. There is adult content in these games. If these games were a movie, they would certainly get worse than a PG-13 rating. You cannot deny that – I stated why in the first post. These are FACTS. It’s also a fact that Kongregate.com prohibits R-rated content on their site. Yet, (also a fact): they badged and promoted an R-rated game. How did they get away with this? Why did it happen? That’s what I want to know.

And, let’s say it’s allowed, and this is the content that Kongregate provides. Why am I not allowed to discuss the… situations… of these games in detail in the chat? Johnny Rocketfingers: He’s LITERALLY receiving oral sex right in front of me. But if I comment that to the rest of the chat room I’m in, I’m breaking the rules. Two facts contradicting here; non-debatable. How does that make sense?

You can nitpick this all you want, you and everyone else. It doesn’t change the facts of the matter. And I think Kongregate should have to answer for them. I hate to be rude, but I’d appreciate it if you stop trying to excuse behavior for them, or answer it for yourself. Sorry, only they have the authority to do that. You’ve made your opinion abundantly clear. So clear that others have quoted you agreeing with it. I get it. We’re on two opposite sides. Now I want to hear the true answer. And if I don’t get it in this thread, I’ll go directly to them. But as it directly concerns their audience, I figured I’d start here.

 
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Topic: Kongregate / Kongegate Becoming TOO Adult?

Originally posted by LouWeed:

Pretty sure it doesn’t say “you cannot talk about sex and drugs and Rated R stuff in our chat rooms and forums” anywhere on this site (well except in this thread, by you. And now me too). Pretty sure I’ve had conversations, in kong chat rooms, about sex, and drugs, and R-rated stuff (possibly rock and roll). Pretty sure in fact, that this very thread is about sex and drugs and R-rated stuff.

And I think it should bother you that all manner decapitation, torture, bloodbaths, death etc. is OK but a single pixelated nipple is guaranteed to cause some righteous zealot to make a thread like this. Because it sure as fuck bothers me. Goodbye.

I think you’re a little… unnecessarily mad? There’s not much I can say to that. If you have a problem with all the violence, that’s an issue for a different thread. I’m not getting into the debate of violence simply because I’d be fighting almost every major franchise targeted toward teenagers. But you’re free to delve into that yourself.

But anyway, I’m pretty sure is does say that: if you bothered to read the Conduct page you’d clearly see:

“Because everyone using Kongregate are 13 and over, the language throughout the site should be approximately PG-13. … Extreme profanity will automatically be censored by our chat filter, so please allow the filter to do its job. Even so, both swearing and overly-sexual language anywhere on the site may get you silenced by a moderator.”

and

“Linking to pornography or shock sites in chat, in the forums, or in game comments will result in an instant week ban. We consider them srs bsns, so please: just don’t post them. Remember the PG-13 approximation? Porn sites sure ain’t.”

I said that pretty clear in the first post, quote “The Kongregate Conduct Guidelines are listed as….” And I’m pretty that counts as “on this site.” As far as this thread goes, I’m obviously debating the act of regulating… unless you actually think that debating what should be censored deserves the same R-Rating that actual porn does. Then we’ll just have to agree to disagree >.>;;;

 
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Topic: Kongregate / Kongegate Becoming TOO Adult?

Originally posted by LouWeed:

I’m not sure exactly what the question is. I think the question is: “where is the line for a badged game?”
And the answer is somewhere between johnny rocketfinger’s fellatio and meatboy’s hot coffee
Seems kind of arbitrary to me but there it is, and that’s only if you’re talking about sex
If you’re talking about violence, I doubt there is a line
If you’re talking about drugs or rock and roll, I’m not really sure

I want to know why it’s okay for a site that says “you cannot talk about sex and drugs and Rated R stuff in our chat rooms and forums” to allow for games with clearly R-rated material to be sponsored on their front page.

Like, greg added badges to these games, or at least this most recent one, right? So at some point, he should have played the game and seen the Rated R content we see. Apparently, there’s multiple games like this, as this thread shows (mostly thanks to FC there :P). So how did these things get through the radar, if we are still technically forbidden from talking about them? What, exactly, was going through greg’s (or any other admin’s) mind?

Is it just that the Conduct page is out of date? Has Kongregate now officially acknowledged what their userbase is like, and are they tailoring to that? If so, why is that page still saying that it’s wrong? And why are Moderators sort of expected to enforce that page, if it is out of date?

Or was this an oversight? Is Kongregate supposed to be PG-13, and the admins aren’t doing their job properly in screening things? That calls to question: what IS the screening process? What gets ruled out, and what is the criteria for it being ruled out?

I admit there’s a grey area, sure. Violence in particular… these are flash GAMES, of course. Games have naturally become more violent, so like I mentioned – no one is going to bat an eye at literal bloodbaths on the screen. Fine, that’s fair, a ton of games marketed toward teens are like that as it.

But sex, drugs, nudity, and other things… where is the line for that? For example, ‘Cows had pixel boobs in it. Johnny Rocketfingers had stick figure fellatio. Can a developer use these as precedent and continue pushing the boundary until it bursts? it’s already happened with language: nobody ever bats an eye at even the worst obscenities now. But maybe these games should be relooked at, and maybe some decisions about the site be made?

I’m not bold enough (cough) to think I can tell them how their site should be run, of course. But again, I’d like a statement of sorts to address the matter. Publicly, which is what this thread was for. Of course, we are free to discuss what each of us think, but personally, I don’t care about it all that much. I’ve seen far worse, as I’m sure many people here have… it’s a matter of principle though. The rules say one thing, the admins do another. Users are subjected to rules while the games they play break them apart. It’s a contradiction I think the staff should be made aware of, at the very least.

 
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Topic: Kongregate / Kongegate Becoming TOO Adult?

I will clarify that I know these things are minor, compared to what we all have seen on the internet. I am not so naive to think that censoring or hiding certain content will keep any 13-year-old ah… pristine from adulterated content.

But my question is still directed toward Kongregate as a company, and as a source for this content. For example, the question arises: If there can be a full-on oral sex scene in Johnny Rocketfingers, a game that is badged and therefore previewed and allowed by Kongregate staff, why would we be prohibited from talking about it in detail? And what, pray tell, could be worse than that? Why do we need moderation at all, if we are allowing such content to be sponsored, and encouraging users to see it by giving away a badge to those who play?

I will not deny the Austin Powers thing, FC. I know. But I want to hear that interpretation from the mouths of Kongregate staff. Austin Powers came out in 97, 99, and 02… we are 13+ years past that. The rating regulations I stated in the first post apply from the very source Kongregate CoC gives. So I want to hear their defense, given the up-to-date information they provide. If they deem these types of content allowable, so be it. I have no complaints therein. But I expect that in doing so, their statement will be weak, and left to question by people other than myself.

Again, it is more a question of the site regulation, than it is of age restriction or appropriateness. I know that video games as a media form have become more sexual, more violent, and more explicit than ever before. But as for the environment Kongregate as a website gives, as an environment advertised in every GameStop in the United States… I expect a bit more formality from them. And as such, I simply want an explanation. If that explanation is pitiful, I expect a reworking of the Code of Conduct, either to allow such content or to find a work-around within it. That isn’t too much to ask, for the sake of preserving the image of a company.

 
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Topic: Kongregate / Kongegate Becoming TOO Adult?

I knew of Johnny Rocketfingers, but I thought they didn’t have badges… I was thinking about them when I said “unbadged games.” But okay, fair point. I forgot since it has been 5+ years since I played them. Yeah, there’s a pretty blatant sex scene in one of them and I’ll gladly add them to my list for demanding clarification. Because looking from where I stand now, those games are clearly not PG-13 either, despite being stick figures.

As for Legacy of a Thousand Suns, it’s an MMO… I imagine most young players wouldn’t put forth the effort to that one. I certainly didn’t when I played it, and therefore never noticed… but again, if you are correct, that’s another piece of ammo for me.

And if you’re referring to RPG Shooter Starwish, then I apologize but I feel like you are mocking me. My issue is with the ratings system – “Implied death” is absolutely normal for PG movies (and particularly common for Disney, tbh), and hardly problematic for PG-13. Unless I’m misremembering, none of the scenes in that game were remotely close to my issue here.

So, back to the point… You say it’s nothing new, and I agree more or less. My point is it’s crossing a line at times, and I’d like to hear the reasons for that. You and I differ on the ideas of what will corrupt children, and that’s fine. But as a company, Kongregate isn’t allowed to consider something “ok enough.” Either it crosses a line or it doesn’t. Maybe the fanservice in Witch Hunt doesn’t – it’s minor and artistic. But blatant sexual language and scenes? I want an explanation for endorsing that.

(On the illegal drugs bit, I meant that they BUY it illegally. Like, it’s intentionally shown that it’s under-the-radar. They didn’t walk into a liquor store for the whiskey – the implication is it was bought illegally because that type or their laws made it illegal. My apologies for it being unclear.)

 
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Topic: Kongregate / Kongegate Becoming TOO Adult?

Before I get called immature, I want to clarify: I am 23, and I have no problem with personally seeing anything on the Internet. What I’m getting into is not about being personally offended, but about the rules and regulations of Kongregate itself, and the general audience therein.

That said. I feel like Kongregate is getting more and more adult-themed in the games they endorse. One aspect is, of course, the violent nature of games, but that’s hardly a real problem. Games and movies have been tailoring violence to teenagers in general, so I’m not too concerned with the fact that the Decision games are pixelated bloodbaths. But this has been an increasing trend since Kongregate’s inception.

However, it’s every other area that Kongregate has begun to… “push the boundary,” so to speak. I should say now that I primarily want to deal with badged games, since that is a clear Kongregate endorsement and promotion. But before I get in to specific offenses, lemme clarify Kongregate’s rules:

The Kongregate Conduct Guidelines are listed as applying “throughout the site.” Now while that is generally for user posts, such as comments, forum posts, and chat room content, I’d imagine this goes for game submissions as well. So with that in mind, the Guidelines emphasize twice on a “PG-13 approximation.” Using the link they provide, here’s the relevant facts:

1. Intense and Persistent Violence generally require at least an R rating
2. Multiple occurrence of the harsher sexually-derived expletives will usually incur an R rating
3. Drug use content is restricted to PG-13 and above
4. Nudity that is sexually oriented will generally require an R rating.
5. And while not specifically listed, sexual content itself generally gets PG-13 to R ratings.

Okay. So now I want to address these in light of Kongregate’s most recent badged game: ’Til Cows Tear Us Apart. In it, all of the following can be seen:

1. One of the main characters blowing a hole through the antagonist’s head.
2. Consistent use of profanity, including their sexual meanings: the whole game is about selling cows to an alien race so they can fornicate with them.
3. The main characters not only buy illegal drugs, but use them at various moments.
4. A flashing scene from one of the female main characters.
5. An implied sex scene between the two main characters that is basically explicit enough.

Despite the fact that this game is a pixel game, and therefore it is seemingly less mature, these themes still apply, as should the rating. Again, I’m not personally offended by these, but I’d imagine the parents of a 13 year old child would be… rather averse to the exposure. Kongregate does ensure a PG-13 environment, but these games simply don’t fall in line with that.

I’m cautioning on a slippery slope here. I know one game doesn’t mean much, but extreme violence has already become commonplace, and language is practically there too. When will it stop? I was wary about the “Fanservice Mode” in Witch Hunt, for example. If you keep pushing the boundaries – “It’s okay if it’s just a little fanservice. It’s okay if it’s just pixel boobs” – when do you plan to stop? Will implied sex scenes become blatant ones, will pixel nudity become high definition over time?

I don’t know. If this trend continues, it may be wiser to have an adult section for games rated R. I know Kongregate will never do that, since they advertise to little kids in GameStop all the time. But even non-badged games have plenty of violations in them that just go unseen by players not playing them. I think it’s a very bad decision to endorse such games with badges if they clearly break the rules that Kongregate imposes. If you don’t allow your players to discuss things in your chat rooms, don’t allow developers to do it in your games.

I imagine that this is an unpopular opinion, so cue any flames about me being prude, killjoy, or naive below. But I’d love to hear Kongregate’s reasoning for giving this game badges. Because honestly… this game crosses a line. Pixel or not, this is one porn scene away from being an X-rated game. If you don’t have a defense for this, then something needs to be done, either with your badging habits, or with your Code of Conduct.

 
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Topic: Kongregate / [New Feature] Introducing Kongpanions!

What does the 60614 mean on Steve’s description? >.>;;;;

 
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Topic: Kongregate / I don't Find my ID number

To be more specific, if you are trying to find your number, follow this:

1. Go to your profile (it’ll read http://www.kongregate.com/accounts/YOUR NAME HERE” ) by clicking your profile name anywhere on the site.
2. Next to your big level number, there will be a section that says “Forum Posts” with a number underneath that. Click it.
3. The page you’re on will now have a URL that says http://www.kongregate.com/users/NUMBER/posts. That number is your Kong ID.

This will appear regardless of whether you have any posts or not.

 
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Topic: Kongregate / Should I Trust tramfanthe?

Okay, I’m not trying to get involved, but.

peachgirl, you are clearly not an innocent one here. Your level in Sandbox Hero about tramfanthe is incredibly inappropriate and offensive. And I’m fairly certain your account is a troll account, based on some other stuff.

That being said, if he did try to send you a disguised malicious link, you should probably report it anyway. Two wrongs don’t make a right, and depending on what kind of link it was, he could have broken a far more serious rule. So please check the actual link location as I advised in the previous post.

Assuming you aren’t just some troll… You should probably remove your level in Sandbox Hero, if you can. Just saying.

 
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Topic: Kongregate / Should I Trust tramfanthe?

From what I can see, the link is:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PBSdUI_IpRs
Which is just some Mario music? That’s a little confusing.

peachgirl64, if you could, check the link location. In Kongregate and Chrome, this appears if you hover over the link and look at the bottom left corner of your screen. If that doesn’t match up to the text (if it doesn’t read “https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PBSdUI_IpRs”) then you can either tell us what the box says, or if it’s clear that it’s something bad, report it.

However, it seems there’s some underlying drama here that’s being left out… From this link it looks like you have a history with this user… Idk.

 
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Topic: Kongregate / Handling Hackers?

The only reason I can think of that someone would hack JUST for badges is for Power-Up Rewards points… While that may seem minor, I’d think Kongregate would want to put a stop to it.

MMOs are a different story, of course. Hackers will exist in any PvP-based game, and they will likely exist in any game that involves cash transactions. But I would put that more on the developer to put in the effort to stop hackers, rather than the game host.

But, since what I found just looks like badges, I think Kongregate should be capable of stopping it. And if they’ve linked a Power-Up Rewards account to their Kongregate account, then losing it would prevent them from continuing, I think.

 
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Topic: Kongregate / Handling Hackers?

Okay, so I found this in the Code of Conduct:

Hacking is bad, don’t do it. Even if you consider yourself 1337 H4XX0RZ, please refrain from bragging about it in chat or the forums. If we find out that you have indeed cheated in any way, you risk losing your points and your account. That being said, we know various things can happen that look like cheating but are not. Because of this we wait until we are certain before taking action on someone’s account for hacking. If you are sure someone is cheating and can prove his or her scores cannot have been achieved another way, you can make your case by emailing support@kongregate.com.

Which, I suppose I should have looked at first. I thought they were only detailing chat and forum rules though, my mistake.

So NOW my question is, is this the only and recommended method, or is there something more to do? Should I report the profile under “Other,” or alert someone specific, etc.? This is now more for future reference than anything else.

 
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Topic: Kongregate / Handling Hackers?

I’d rather not say, I dunno what Kongregate’s stance on libel is, plus I’m not looking to throw someone under the bus.

I get that I might be wrong – maybe they found an exploit in that game and all the other stuff was circumstance. Which is why I assume there’s a way to tell Kongregate directly, so they can investigate it on their end some way. Because I might be wrong, I don’t want to name names.

For simplicity’s sake… Let’s assume that it’s a highly suspicious account, with a score of 3,000,000 on a high score board “Levels Complete” in a game with 10 levels. Would that make the cut?

 
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Topic: Kongregate / Handling Hackers?

Not that I think it works, or even has a proper benefit, so please no lectures about that.

I stumbled upon a profile that I’m 100% sure of hacking. They have 100% badges, but aren’t a bot. They get BotD’s and complete challenges. They have a ton of fans, but no friends, and they only favorited the two badge managing games. Zero other interaction on the site. On top of that, they recently attained an impossible score on a particular game, with the developer confirming the max theoretical score to prove it.

So I’m curious if there’s anything Kongregate can do, or anything I can do to point this out for them to see. Not that I want to start a crusade against hackers or anything, but it would be nice to know the channels of communication if they are there.

If there’s not, that’d be understandable, albeit a bit sad. I’m aware that hacking isn’t really something this site can prevent. But I can’t imagine they do nothing about it at all.

 
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Topic: Kongregate / Concerning the "A Sweepstakes [sic] of Fire and Ice" thingamabob going on right now

Not to contradict my earlier post, but yeah… this game’s pretty bad.

Like, it’s definitely pushing you to pay. Everything takes a long time, so it’s a lot of waiting. The premium content is vastly superior, so it really does put the pressure on, even early in the game. But outside of clicking where it tells you to click, and waiting for resources or timed events to complete… there’s not much to this game at all.

And, on top of that, they gave us over two weeks to complete the sweepstakes? I’ve been playing for about five hours now, and I’m nearing the 1,000 mark. Just 500 more after that, so I estimate no more than 10 hours to complete this Challenge in full. That’s… I feel like my points were ruined, lol. It’s not a fun or great game, and it’s not a difficult challenge… So I won’t be playing it beyond the challenge marks (which go beyond the badges, btw).

So yeah. Outside of pandering, I don’t really see the benefit here. I stick to my earlier guns, but I don’t agree with the choice overall. >.>;

 
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Topic: Kongregate / Concerning the "A Sweepstakes [sic] of Fire and Ice" thingamabob going on right now

I think you may have the idea of sweepstakes a little wrong…

Of course a whole sweepstakes is going to be focused on the MMOs and the P2W games. Like, it just makes more sense. You don’t want your sweepstakes to be a “play this once and never look at it again” game. You want it to be a game where people will willingly get involved and continue to play it, even after earning the reward. The challenge is incentive to BEGIN to play, not just a free reward to get and move on.

They wouldn’t put a sweepstakes on A Dance of Fire and Ice because that’s a game that, with proper skill, can be beaten in 15 minutes. With only three levels and a concept that was only developed for three ideas, there’s nothing that makes that game notable. It’s just a basic tap-to-the-rhythm game. But this goes for all basic flash games. They aren’t really worth actual cash prizes – they just aren’t innovative enough.

That isn’t to say you don’t have a point, which I’ll get to in a moment. But remember that sweepstakes are sponsored. Kongregate is the sponsor for the contest, but I’ll bet someone is behind them pushing to get something out of it themselves. Maybe it’s a deal with the game developer, or maybe there is something Kongregate stands to gain. But either way, Kongregate is giving out almost 5000 dollars worth of prizes. They’ve definitely got incentive.

So, while you should accept that they will never put a contest out for a single game that isn’t an MMO, I think that you may still be onto something. Maybe they should put out a contest with quests instead. Pick badges that would roughly take 2 weeks to gather, or hold off on badging new games to give everyone the same starting point. Then offer rewards for those who complete it. I believe they’ve done this in the past, but if not, it’s definitely something to look into. That would give more spotlight to smaller games, which I think is your main concern?

TL;DR – Consider why Kongregate puts up Challenges, and what games are likely to get them. That’ll explain their reasons. Then suggest ways of reworking that system to include the games that don’t, like Challenges related to badge quests.

 
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Topic: Kongregate / Enough with the idle "games" bullcrap

I have to agree with Ubernomaden. The sentence may not be logically contradictory, but it is definitely misleading. Saying “the genre is developing so slowly” is supposed to be a negative qualifier, while “the genre appears to be saturating itself on kong” is a positive statement.

So instead of arguing semantics, I’m left wondering: Is the genre poor because of its development, or successful due to saturation? Which was the “good news” here? >.>;;;

 
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Topic: Kongregate / In this thread, we discuss how greg badged the same game twice lol

Originally posted by VforVendetta:

You’ll notice how he pretty much just posted a claim, his grounds for the claim, and his conclusion (yay I get to use what I’m learning in school). He didn’t really go in-depth or out of his way to provide further evidence or proclaim his anger about it. It’s mostly just to get a reaction, and to be funny.

High-five from a fellow rhetoric/debate student.

I know it probably wasn’t that serious, but I took the claim against the developer seriously enough. Personally I don’t like letting accusations go. It tends to give the wrong impression to anyone lurking or otherwise… But I feel like I’m repeating myself from other threads now. And I’m… honestly kinda avoiding off-topic, if that’s the normal scenario I’ll find. Not really my cup of tea – I’m too serious for that.

 
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Topic: Kongregate / Official Level Hater Thread

I’m part of the 65 group who didn’t rate every game or use referrals… :( /sobs. Though I totally agree with the “No Life” part – for one year, I did nothing but get badges on Kongregate and play Borderlands.

I don’t dislike badges – I think they were a push in the right direction in 2008. I do think points and levels were wrecked by those two systems, and need to be reworked… if this site had any intention on maintaining itself as a standalone site. But I’ve seen plenty of other sites pop up over the years rewarding people through their games. This site set a good standard, if nothing else.

Also, @kudamon, totally not the purpose for that rule. Like… just no.

 
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Topic: Kongregate / In this thread, we discuss how greg badged the same game twice lol

Given that, if I understand correctly, the thread is angry that Greg gave badges to similar games, right?

I would say that you would then have to be mad at every level pack, sequel, and series that obtains badges on this site. From Ultimate Assassin to Cursed Treasure to City Siege to Snail Bob to the many RPGs with sequels. Some of them are pretty much the exact same game every time (I’m staring Snail Bob down pretty hard). And level packs are literally the same game, just with more levels. But that’s ridiculous – Most of these games deserve their badges, or at least deserve their right to be considered separate games.

I am against the notion of calling them a reskin of each other simply because they aren’t. And I’m against the idea that badging them both was wrong because they are each valuable as games. I think both parts of the argument are faulty. You can make the argument that they are too similar, or that the developer cut corners, but… I don’t think this thread was intended for that.

EDIT: Also, FC, that would be the proof that should have been provided. That’s more than enough to make the claim against the game, as well as descript enough that a non-informed player doesn’t have to wild goose chase the stuff down. While I don’t think it’s enough to claim reskin, I do believe it’s enough to make an case for a bad game, so… Thank you.

 
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Topic: Kongregate / In this thread, we discuss how greg badged the same game twice lol

Originally posted by Pulsaris:

EDIT: This is the map for Decision Medieval. Feel free to use it while playing Decision 3. At least all the large buildings are in the same location.

Okay, you know what? I’ll give you that point. But I decided to check it myself. So I typed into google “Decision 3 map” and you know what the FIRST link I found was?

http://flyanvil.com/decision3.php

That’s the developer site for Decision 3, which was updated during its development. Where they readily admit that they reused that map. Quote: “Meet the map of the town. Those who played the Decision:Medieval, will be able to recognize the familiar streets. But now they are in a modern style.”

But, wait. What’s that farther down the page? It looks like… a list of NEW stuff? New stuff that wasn’t in Decision:Medieval? Uh oh. Looks like it’s not a clone after all.

So I concede that the maps are the same. Even the developer isn’t trying to hide that. And granted, the tutorial wasn’t enough to give me that knowledge. But was it enough to show me that they aren’t reskins or clones of each other? Absolutely. The entire claim was “it has the exact same maps, story, upgrades, weapons, buildings, and enemies.” But from where I stand, only the maps are the same. Everything else in that statement is a lie.

 
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Topic: Kongregate / In this thread, we discuss how greg badged the same game twice lol

Originally posted by Pulsaris:

If you have only played the tutorial, why not admit that you are completely uninformed and just shut your face now?

Wow, okay. Did you miss the part where OP said “you even start off on the same map” ?? Cause you know, I said that’s what I was addressing specifically.

The tutorials and systems shown immediately after indicated that they were NOT clones. By definition, clones are literally the same games; same assets, same coding, same EVERYTHING, aside from visual and aesthetic details. Images and textures are replaced, and text is rewritten, but the game operates the exact same way. This is what OP claimed in the first post: “the only difference is the textures over the roads and buildings.”

What I’m saying is, just by the tutorial alone, I can prove this is not the case. The games do not have the same structure or the same coding. That’s all I need as a counterargument. I don’t need to play through a whole game to realize it’s not the same.

Now, if at some point later in the game, they merge into the same, then I’ll retract my statement. But again, OP emphasized “you start off on the same map.” If he’s already lying about that point, what’s to say he isn’t lying about the whole thing? So, the burden of proof for his claim is on him now.

And please, if you’re jumping into an argument halfway, try to get a little informed yourself. You can start by reading the whole thread, instead of just the last comment of the last post.

 
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Topic: Kongregate / In this thread, we discuss how greg badged the same game twice lol

So… admittedly, I haven’t played much of the Decision series, due to getting mad at the first game a long while back… But I’m finding it really hard to believe these are clones.

Specifically, I find the comment “If you play them, you even start off on the same map.” to be completely untrue.

I played about five minutes of each. In the beginning, I was playing on tutorial maps that had completely different layouts; the only similarity was that the control scheme and basics were the same. (You know, like series tend to have, to make them a series?) But even the tasks were different, and the opening storyline was clearly not the same: Decision 3 has a cinematic opening, with the plot focused on the main character – Decision:Medieval just has an intro paragraph, with the plot focused on helping the kingdom.

Thinking that maybe the region map was what OP was referring to, I completed both tutorial missions… and again, outside from the fact that there WERE region maps, they looked nothing alike. I assume it’ll be close to a 3×3 grid, as the prior Decision games have had, but I don’t think they are copies… I mean, in Medieval, I’m given the shop option and 8% completion immediately after the tutorial, which does not happen in Decision 3.

Also, skimming the comments, literally no one is saying anything about copying. I see a handful of people claiming Decision 3 feels like a level pack to Decision 2, but no one is saying anything about them being the same. You’d think if fans of the series / badge hunters played each iteration, this would have been discovered by now.

Conclusion: this does not constitute a “reskin” of a game, in any way. The games of the series are similar, just like every other flash series in existence – sequels build upon and improve existing mechanics and code. But that does not make them the same. If you have a problem with Greg badging all the games in a series, well… that one’s an opinion between you two. But to go and claim reskinning attacks the developer, which is just wrong.

If I didn’t play long enough, please, elaborate with screenshots and better proof. I’d rather not waste my time on games I don’t like just to find out you’re lying.

 
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Topic: Kongregate / Kongregate Level Cap

Originally posted by 123aaa789:

Because past 65 the points per level grow too exponentially large for most people to feasibly reach higher levels (raising the cap to even 75 would require about 20,000 or more additional points), and Kongregate feels that it would be in the best interest to have a level cap that is at least somewhat attainable. As well, there are only a little more than 3,000 total users at the level cap, so raising it is not a priority since it doesn’t affect most people, they’d rather focus on areas of the site that would affect more people.

They could get away with another 10,000 points from badges alone. Though granted, that would only be a few levels difference.

However, levels are completely demolished by rating and referral systems, so… it’s not like they matter much any more. You can feasibly reach 65 by rating every game on the site. With a system that broken, why would you waste time to fix it?