Recent posts by Precarious on Kongregate

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Topic: Kongregate / Upcoming Badges!

Originally posted by LouWeed:

You know, Death Run 3D has a 3.77 rating and it’s pretty awesome.

Death Run 3D is honestly a great game, so I’m going to echo this. Also has sufficient rating, working API, and was published in the last half year.

 
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Topic: Kongregate / Upcoming Badges!

While there are a couple of interesting miscellaneous achievements, none of them are especially difficult (I feel having more level specific challenges would have made the game more interesting, actually). Since there’s not really a difference in difficulty between 144 stars and all achievements, I don’t really see any reason to have an all achievements badge and force people to replay 3-starred levels.

I’m kind of split between Thok’s perspective and mike’s; while 144 stars isn’t especially difficult, it feels like more than an E-M game. E-M-M (with 36 levels for the first medium, and 144 stars for the second) might be a good way to bridge the two approaches. (Plus I’m all in favor of being generous with badge distribution generally, since fewer badge-worthy games means fewer badges generally.)

That said, the rating seems to have stabilized around 3.70, so might it not reach the threshold anyway.

 
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Topic: Forum Games / [Execution Quiz 3] -- The Moles -- [DL: 24 April 2300 UTC+8]

I submitted a couple days ago.

 
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Topic: Forum Games / [Execution Quiz 3] -- The Moles -- [DL: 24 April 2300 UTC+8]

I’ll request an extension as well.

 
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Topic: Forum Games / [Execution Quiz 3] -- The Moles -- [DL: 24 April 2300 UTC+8]

I also received mangosteen.

 
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Topic: Kongregate / Upcoming Badges!

Originally posted by Thok:

Hexad seems to have everything one would want in a badgeable game: a rating of 4.1 and working API to for most relevant stats (levels, colors, stars). Is there a reason it isn’t on the current list of games to be badged?

Edit: Oh. It doesn’t seem to remember previous progress. Still that’s something worth bugging the dev about.

Just following up on this—the game does remember previous progress now. The API works and covers all possible statistics, and the rating is still around 4.1. We also haven’t had a pure puzzle game badged recently. This is definitely a good badges candidate.

 
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Topic: Forum Games / The [redacted]ing Llama Mafia - Night 3 (DL: 4/28, 4 PM, UTC+3)

Ah, thanks.

 
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Topic: Forum Games / The [redacted]ing Llama Mafia - Night 3 (DL: 4/28, 4 PM, UTC+3)

Things later take an interesting turn when:

Originally posted by Gonkeymonkey:

I have not read much on this page, but I also think that CM guessing my role right on the first try is scummy. I thank nikeas for defending me, and as a thank you (and because CM seems very evil) I shall Vote: 10crystalmask01.
I roleblocked Jouteur for lulz, but somehow I targeted uzzbuzz instead. This does give me an idea about a possible bus driver (transporter). I ask an investigative role to target me and see that I’m town. If I somehow turn out to be scum, there is a framer, but you can always lynch me to be sure that there really is a framer then.

First off, this indicates either that there are in fact multiple roleblockers, or that Crystal lied about being roleblocked.

Second, of course, is the apparent transferring of the targeting. Now, without further context, there are several possibilities. Gonkey could have lied about the redirect and targeted uzzbuzz directly. That seems needlessly risky, however. Assuming the truth of his assertions, there are several other possible outlets besides a bus driver, although most of these of sufficiently similar that it wouldn’t normally matter a whole lot mechanically this early on.

However, it does matter given what Gonkey points out about the principals. Neither the presumed bus driver nor the switched player died. Of course, it’s very, very strange that a bus driver-esque role would ever target a player claiming to be a paranoid townie. Alternate explanations include reflecting (i.e. forcing an ability to a predetermined or random target), nexus, and lightning rod type characteristics, but the fact the other powers don’t seem to have been affected suggests that nexus/lightning rod aspects, if existing, were not global in nature. Moreover, Joteur has not claimed to be able to deflect actions, nor has uzz claimed to attract them.

Meanwhile, Joteur doesn’t help his cause with:

Originally posted by Jouteur:

I know I’m a bottomless pit, and this means that anyone who visits me at night dies. But for some reason I am still a member of the city.

Originally posted by Jouteur:

I don’t have time to read through it all, but I see that gonkey voted me for lying. Well, I was trying to hide the truth: If a town member targets me, they die, but the mafia gets away just fine.

Vote: RaceBandit for bandwagoning

Obviously, he admits to lying. Now, his approach is reasonable—if mafia can still target him, but he endangers town players, his claim makes sense, as it both scares off townies that could die, while keeping mafia at bay when they could safely target him.

The problem (beyond admitting to a lie) is that the role is unrealistic. A paranoid townie that only kills town players? That’s such a negative, mafia-weighted role that I can hardly believe it exists. And even if he is telling the truth now, the role provides no real value to the town, which has no way of confirming its truth anyway.

So, I don’t have a problem with Joteur being lynched. What I do have a problem with is the uncritical approach to the situation. Because, once again, it still doesn’t make sense that a bus driver would have picked up Joteur in the first place. To me, that sounds patently suicidal, particularly since Joteur had not yet claimed to only affect town players. So even in the event of a mafia bus driver, said player would not have known that he could safely switch Joteur and uzzbuzz.

There is a way this works; if Joteur is a mafioso, who kills anyone who is town and targets him at night. But this scenario is almost impossible, because 1. that’s an incredibly powerful role, 2. (and most problematically) Joteur should have never claimed (since any town players targeting him would have died, without it being traceable back to him), and 3. it still requires the presumed bus driver to also be mafia, which is itself an extremely unlikely role.

Thus, the situation remains thorny. Right now, Joteur and Gonkey are on the block to be lynched, and given the circumstances, they are probably the best two candidates. I’ll cast a

Vote: Joteur

for the moment, but I may change it depending on what else develops.


Originally posted by BCLEGENDS:

So Gonkey’s got a lot of issues going with him; having already been discussed, I need not expand upon these at this precise moment. Vote: Gonkeymonkey.

The above should suggest that I’m not completely swayed by everything Gonkey has said, but what you just did is a vote without explaining it.

So explain it.

 
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Topic: Forum Games / The [redacted]ing Llama Mafia - Night 3 (DL: 4/28, 4 PM, UTC+3)

Okay, I’m going to finally try to go through everything. I’ll break it into two posts, because it’s pretty long.


Originally posted by coolo2011:

The thing with the roleblock being mafia, though, is that we’ve had Jouteur claim that obstacles are town. If obstacles are town, then surely things that block llamas might also be town as well. However, this relies on taking Jouteur entirely at face value and I’m not 100% sure I want to do that. If Gonkey and crystal do turn out to be scumbuddies, the guy who claimed that obstacles are town might also be next, depending on Gonkey’s actual role.

The problem is that both of these perspectives assume that game elements are aligned universally. There’s no way to be sure that all “obstacles” share alignment; while the flavor of the game makes it somewhat more likely, it doesn’t guarantee it.


Originally posted by 10crystalmask01:

No. Revealing someone’s role as town does not hurt the town, but rather brings forth a more strategic approach to the situation. Now that we all know who is the town, it will be less likely that the mafia may target Gonkeymonkey now, because doctors will hopefully have him backed up in case he does become a target. This will also save time for our investigatives to find out what roles other players will have, in case they had plans to check Gonkeymonkey to begin with.

You seem to be serious about this perspective, since it keeps cropping up in your posts. However, it is fatally flawed. You yourself in the above quoted post end up FoSing Gonkey. Clearly, you were not completely convinced of his townhood. Yet in the same post you advocate that no one investigate him, and encourage doctors to protect him. CLAIMING TOWN DOES NOT MAKE YOU TOWN. Nor does it make you mafia. Except in cases of players essentially trolling the game, everyone is going to claim town. It is a total null tell, with no probative value in either direction whatsoever.

You later suggest that you value the act of claiming itself. There are several problems here. First, Gonkey made a very incomplete claim at the time, one which could easily be manipulated around. More to the point is that a nonspecific role claim may well be sufficient for your analysis, but requesting other players protect and/or not investigate Gonkey is unjustified. Those players should operate as they see fit, and following another player’s course for a completely invalid reason feels overcontrolling at best.

It’s also worth noting that his claim is still not complete. I’m going to take a segue here and ask Gonkey directly:

Gonkeymonkey, what is the NAME of your role? We obviously know it has a roleblocking function, but what is it called? Is it specifically Obstacle, or is there more to it?


Originally posted by 10crystalmask01:

If we we’re scum buddies, why was I RB’d on N1? Gee, I wonder who could have done that…

Uzzbuzz has confirmed that he was roleblocked. If Crystal is telling the truth here, then we know there are multiple roleblocking functions in this game.

 
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Topic: Forum Games / The [redacted]ing Llama Mafia - Night 3 (DL: 4/28, 4 PM, UTC+3)

In reviewing Day 1, I noticed that the questionnaire included nothing about player distribution, and I don’t think the topic came up elsewhere. With a 21 player starting pool, and host-confirmed no third parties, the likely town:mafia ratios are 17:4, 16:5, 15:6, and 14:7. (While I consider the middle two values more likely, the latter extreme is still possible. 17:4 is very borderline.) While not super relevant this early on, it still warrants consideration because of the two lynch condition today. It should definitely remain on everyone’s mind as we progress, since the different ratios may influence how the game plays out.

That said, a two lynch day does offer us some opportunities. Even if we are unsuccessful with both lynches, the results (and who voted for who) may contextualize (and be contextualized by) later votes and information. Too often, an “unsuccessful” lynch campaign fades into collective oblivion and alignment hints are lost. With two players being lynched, it may be easier to trace voting patterns. Combined with the fact that a secondary wagon does have killing power in this instance, I _strongly recommend_ that every remaining player vote today. Kong has in general adopted a poor overmeta tending toward rampant inactivity, and vote analysis can sometimes be a critical piece of the puzzle. Moreover, every non-voter (town, anyway) that doesn’t vote lends the mafia that much more power in today’s situation.

A lot of people have been requesting extensions. Given that participation is kind of inconsistent anyway, and especially in light of the above, I’ll also throw up a Vote: Extension.

 
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Topic: Kongregate / Retired Badges Compendium

Nice topic. It might also be useful if people posted in this thread whenever a game is due to be retired (assuming there’s advance warning), so there’s a centralized place to check for that information as well.

Also RIP RoS, still not over it. :(

 
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Topic: Kongregate / Upcoming Badges!

Originally posted by SamsterSamster:

Sounds great! Now with pool being badged, think you can try out Texas HoldEm Poker Deluxe too?

Unfortunately, Texas HoldEm Poker Deluxe has been removed from Kong. That was a lot of fun to play with people you know. :(


I played until I reached six wins in Pool Live Pro last night, and it didn’t take all that long, largely because the people I played against weren’t very experienced. I imagine it matches you up based on your level to some degree, but any situation where you’re playing against real people and not a computer means that the difficulty is variable. For that reason, I’d recommend against having too high a win count, since if the game dies down, there may be fewer options available for a new player. So I’d agree with six wins, even though my own experience made six easier than a typical medium.

 
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Topic: Forum Games / The [redacted]ing Llama Mafia - Night 3 (DL: 4/28, 4 PM, UTC+3)

So, are we not getting that explanation from Helltank, or do I just have the time zone conversions confused?

 
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Topic: Forum Games / The [redacted]ing Llama Mafia - Night 3 (DL: 4/28, 4 PM, UTC+3)

Your vote switching would make me think some sort of supersaint/bomb/whatever effect is in play, except if that was the case, you should have voted Bookworm instead of BC with your previous vote.

If you have an actual reason for whatever you’re doing, you should reveal it now unless you have a mechanical restriction. Most people probably won’t be around with 30 minutes left, given that Bluji’s time zone is awkwardly positioned for those of us in the US/Canada.

 
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Topic: Forum Games / [Execution Quiz 3] -- The Moles -- [DL: 24 April 2300 UTC+8]

I made a globe inspired Easter egg in Paint because, hey, why not.

 
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Topic: Forum Games / The [redacted]ing Llama Mafia - Night 3 (DL: 4/28, 4 PM, UTC+3)

There has been an awful lot of soft-roleclaiming, and that is anti-town behavior. I realize that many of the players here are new to mafia (and forums-based mafia specifically), but there’s not enough contextual information on day 1 to overcome the effect of providing targeting information to the mafia. Claims (excluding claims made when under threat of lynch) tend to work best to help put the entire game together, and that works best when more actions have been taken and the player pool has been somewhat pared down. I should note that uncorroborated day 1 claims are not especially useful indicators of alignment, particularly when uniquely flavored.

TLDR: For future reference, don’t claim on Day 1.



Regarding Helltank’s mafia-claiming, I’d suggest that it’s possible he’s under a post restriction (I actually thought the same of hamuka for a little while, particularly since Bluji often includes post restriction in some form), except that he included posts that, while adhering to his schtick, didn’t actively mafia-claim (merely contextualized it with further accusations/votes of his claimed fellow mafia). Therefore, we can assume he’s doing this of his own will.

Bluji explicitly stated that this is a two party (town and mafia) game. There is therefore no risk of a game-ending jester lynch; in fact, there’s no risk of a non-game ending jester lynch, since there cannot be a third party jester-type role (while Bluji might sometimes include bastard-ish mechanics, explicitly lying to the playerbase goes against his own hosting meta as well as etiquette and convention in a non-ridiculous game). The idea of an “aligned” jester is possible, and it would make sense for a town-jester to seek to off himself early on (a mafia-jester would be severely disadvantaging his team and therefore himself by eliminating himself from the game early on). That said, it’s such an unusual role idea that it’s extremely unlikely to be included in the game in any capacity.

Helltank has made no effort to divert from his joke play thus far, and there’s little reason to believe he’ll do so before the end of the day (if at all). While Helltank has tried ill-advised gambits in the past, I have to believe he realizes that the approach he’s taking here is almost certain to lead to a lynch. That suggests that he really does want to be lynched, that there’s some mechanical advantage or reason for his doing so. Yet absent a jester role, I can’t think of any possibility in a large game (we have 21 players) where this would absolutely invite catastrophe. He seems intent on being a distraction, regardless of alignment, which makes him a decent lynch candidate even setting aside the game of chicken he’s playing. It’s not a bad option for Day 1.

Vote: Helltank



Originally posted by RaceBandit:

The collectibles I can think of are coins, powerups, the eggs in world 10, and some hidden trophies – coins might act as horcruxes for a Goal Star, which might be a Roleblocker until all horcruxes are dead.

Yeah, something tells me the Goal Star will be confusing as all hell to figure out.

Originally posted by RaceBandit:

I’m also starting to get the feeling that Gonkeymonkey is starting to get too defensive. He also mentioned having one secret left. If he basically claimed Roleblocker, I bet he’s a scum-aligned Goal Star, since those things are [redacted]ing everywhere and evil placement can force you to deal with run killers such as (in my case) 4-10.

Actually…

Based on the whole “You can be forced to navigate hell just to get to a Goal Star” thing, I bet the Goal Star is instead a sort of Target Painter, something that can cause doctors to fail on the target so scum can just come in and [redacted] us over.
If this is the case, then Gonkeymonkey probably isn’t a Goal Star. …he’s probably a trophy requirement! Recall how you need to get [I think] six trophies to access World 10, and 9 to get the Lunatic badge. The World 10 requirement could be a “block” of sorts, and since it’s blocking Bluji in the process, it’s probably scum-aligned.

Or maybe we’re just thinking too hard about the random game elements and they really are vanillas. A [redacted]load of vanillas in a game like this would be ridiculous, but … (shrugs)

You’re really pushing this idea of a “Goal Star,” and it bothers me. From your initial post, it seems that your role is not Goal Star, since it’s something that “will be confusing as all hell to figure out.” Yet you seem adamant that this role is in the game, and that it will be difficult to figure out in some capacity—going so far as to suggest exotic elements like horcrux coins. It’s weird to fixate on an element that, even if included, did not make Bluji’s intial specific list of more abstract concepts (Bluji’s Sanity, Impossible Badge, etc.), since these speculations are so apparently firmly rooted, yet have nothing to really recommend them if that isn’t your role. To me, this suggests you have information that other players don’t have.

It’s possible this is just theorycraft on your end, but without further information, this extrapolation seems too detailed, since there are so many possible ways different aspects of Vertigo could be converted into mafia game form.

 
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Topic: Forum Games / [Execution Quiz 3] -- The Moles -- [DL: 24 April 2300 UTC+8]

I will be very active.

Assuming google+editing (or just drawing a picture with paint or something) is allowed, I’ll do that when I get home.

 
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Topic: Forum Games / The [redacted]ing Llama Mafia - Night 3 (DL: 4/28, 4 PM, UTC+3)

I’m home, and reading the thread now. Since the questionnaire appears right away, I’ll do a separate post for that before parsing everything.

Originally posted by BCLEGENDS:

Role confirmed, and I’ll do the RQS.

1. Based on your knowledge of the game that inspired this mafia, what undisclosed roles (based on V:GL’s game mechanics) do you believe are likely to be present?

2. Any particular strategies for this mafia? General mafia strategy aside, there’s closed-setup specific and game-specific strategies to discuss.

3. Do you have the impossible badge for Vertigo: Gravity Llama yet?

4. Who should have an eye kept on them throughout the mafia, and why?

1. Vertigo’s main gameplay element was a gravity-shifting mechanic that supplemented normal precision platforming. That being the case, some sort of “flips” in game—the conditions we’re playing under, possibly how certain role abilities work—might reverse in day and night cycles, or on odd or even days, or something like that. I suspect this is a main reason why the set-up itself is closed. As per roles, the hardest world (10/10A) was populated by floating dragon heads that spit fireballs at the titular llama. I wouldn’t be surprised if they figured in as the mafia. The “main” plot of the game involved most llamas being encased in gold by a meteorite, so a flavored roleblock/vote-silencing/other restriction type role might be included—this role would be virtually certain to be mafia-aligned.

2. Closed set-ups tend to promote secrecy early on. This isn’t unreasonable, but an important element of closed mafias is determining exactly what rules and roles are involved. Generally speaking, I favor mid- to late-game massclaims, particularly in flavored mafias. It’s generally best to avoid saying too much on the first day, though, since the mafia is (presumably) as much in the dark as we are.

There is one absolute rule to mafia—with the exception of AitP, if you’re playing purely for a win and not for fun—and that is the value of discussion. Inactivity strongly favors mafia, as equally quiet players are equally suspicious, and provide no platform for differentiation or for pressure. I encourage everyone to be active, both for the health of the game and the good of the town. Even if someone’s contributions don’t help “solve” mafia identities or the overstructure of the game, they encourage other players to also speak, which lends itself toward solving the game.

3. Yes.

4. This turns out to be a surprisingly useful question, not because the question is good—it’s painfully generic—but browsing through reveals a number of players who more or less copy-pasted the original answer, which indicates (in those cases) a lack of familiarity with the game and/or a lack of confidence in themselves.

As to the actual question, I normally suggest watching for players diverging from their usual meta, but there are enough people here that I’m not really familiar with that that tactic tends to lead toward tunneling. No one in this game, with the possible exception of Kadleon, has demonstrated a level of play in the past to warrant special scrutiny ahead of time. It’s best to treat everyone as a possible mafioso, and let the game evolve on its own.
 
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Topic: Forum Games / The [redacted]ing Llama Mafia - Night 3 (DL: 4/28, 4 PM, UTC+3)

Confirm.

I’ve been busy with Easter/family stuff today, and will be busy again for part of tomorrow, but when I get home I’ll review everything so far and share my thoughts.

 
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Topic: Kongregate / Upcoming Badges!

I see stashes and survivors have been added as stats, so I’ll assume that those will be used for the E/M badges. So,

Make New Friends, But Keep the Old
Escort Mission Blues

Cache Money Millionaire

Mutation Cessation

 
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Topic: Kongregate / The Four Kings Tournament [Finals!]

Originally posted by BadgeHuntersAnon:

So I guess people wanted to know who I was in the tourney this time…The master of disguise strikes again!

A film by M. Night Shyamalan.

 
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Topic: Kongregate / Upcoming Badges!

The only problem with the inspectors is that they’re either awkwardly distributed, or they’re randomized. I didn’t get the last inspector until the final region, when my city percentage was around 90 or so (and as my discussion of the game has probably hinted at, I was very thorough). That said, I remember getting the first three (?) fairly quickly. Figuring out where the inspectors are located would require another playthrough from at least one person. The advantage of stashes is that there are more of them, which lends itself to more even distribution/consistency regardless of how the inspectors are actually incorporated. (Of course, the main reason I suggested stashes originally is that it lends itself to more thorough exploration of the maps, which is an underutilized aspect of the game, I think.)

Neither of those options are currently planned for badges though, so it may not matter either way.

 
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Topic: Kongregate / The Four Kings Tournament [Finals!]

Congratulations to the winners!

 
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Topic: Kongregate / Upcoming Badges!

For what it’s worth, you don’t actually have to find all the stashes. I reached 50 a little more than halfway through the game (this was completing all regions fully though, not just the minimum to get through them), then found “stash 50” another several dozen times.

 
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Topic: Kongregate / #VoteStabby 2015 Edition

In the spirit of compromise, I recommend a weapon with fewer modern connotations. How about an anthropomorphized medieval chain mace? You could call it Morning Star and make its caption “Epic Flail!”