Recent posts by vikaTae on Kongregate

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Topic: Serious Discussion / Should good behaviour be taught at school?

Originally posted by karmakoolkid:

Does anyone care to comment on the ways & whys good behavior/self-discipline should be taught at home; but, there seems to be a growing trend that it isn’t happening?

I wouldn’t say a growing trend. More that there are (and always have been) some segments of society that teach the wrong morals to their children either via physical abuse or via neglect. Whilst it would be lovely if every child was taught the basics by the parents before entering school, realistically that isn’t going to happen in every case, and school is the chance to apply standardised learning basics to the children; guaranteeing they all get at least a basic education in the things that matter.

You can see some perhaps unintended results of this in the kids that come to consider school to be a second home, or a better home than their actual one, as well as in those who take one teacher or another to be a surrogate parent in their eyes.

There’s certainly a place for such basic teaching and bonding within the school environment, as whilst there aren’t the resources there to take children out of problem environments, or be a true surrogate for missing, or bad parents, it is certainly the case that what they can do, will help.

 
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Topic: Serious Discussion / Louis Head needs to be arrested for inciting riot.

Originally posted by karmakoolkid:
Originally posted by BillCosbySexyMan:

Replace human police with robots! They wont be racist!

No, they will be “machinists”.
I, Robot….anyone?

The original I, Robot is far better. The film version took only one of the short stories of that book – and one of the worst ones, to boot. The book itself is an intertwining of human and robot morality, showing that interaction between the two is quite possible albeit complex.

 
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Topic: Serious Discussion / Turn your stress into the source of life force

Originally posted by rogerhoyt1:

When we perceive something as threatening we react defensively with fear and tension. Fear creates tension that blocks the flow of internal energy. Intense or prolonged fear leads to rigidity and paralysis and the inability to respond fluidly to life’s challenges. Tension and rigidity also consume massive amounts of energy through constant effort.

Not to ridicule the entire core point of your sales pitch, but this plain does not occur. The fight or flight response is generated essentially, by fear, and marks the time when energy of all sorts is flowing fastest around the body, and every organ is essentially redlining with power.

If you cannot get this fundamental piece of biological science right when it forms the core of your product pitch, what hope is there for your product?

 
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Topic: Serious Discussion / Louis Head needs to be arrested for inciting riot.

Originally posted by herg1:

As the destruction of the national identity of the United Kingdom continues…

What national identity?

Even if you discount the identities of the cultures that have made the UK their home, there are four different nationalities, each with a multitude of sub-cultures that comprise the UK.

You might as well talk about the national identity of North America, and treat the US, Canada and Mexico as all one nationality, for all the sense your statement makes.

 
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Topic: Serious Discussion / Should good behaviour be taught at school?

Originally posted by urine420:

Good behaviour ought be the development of moral axioms and then the logical application of those axioms, regardless of which entrenched power groups those challenge.

That’s probably a major reason why situational analysis and generalised research and investigative skills are not generally taught, yes. Some of the private schools teach such, but not many of the state schools. A mind questioning everything, when it can see the connections and understand some of the complexities, is well, not always in the vested interests of those in power. So training a whole generation in such things, might not go over well.

 
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Topic: Serious Discussion / Louis Head needs to be arrested for inciting riot.

Originally posted by urine420:

Their means of enforcing this will is through the use of violent force.

Depends on the country. Not every police force arms its people. You should see the UK’s for example. Only time guns are involved is when a firearm has been used in the incident, and a special division is brought in. The police try to use minimum force whenever possible, and restrain rather than punch. I believe you’d be quite pleasantly surprised.

Further, as a position of power, where their actions are largely less scrutinised than those of non-police citizens

Here, if anything, they are more scrutinized. Abuses of police power tend to lead to scandals and sackings very quickly.

I must, grudingly, admit that i was being hyperbolic in my comments earlier as there are theoretically innocent police officers in the “forgive them father for they know not what they do” sense.

Most of their job is very difficult, and out of the public eye. Whan you think of police, you think of criminals being arrested. When I think of the police, I think of them having to journey into an elderly person’s flat to see if they are alright, or if they died a week ago and that’s where the smell that was reported, is coming from.

 
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Topic: Serious Discussion / Stupid People

Originally posted by adzewar:

Sorry, you asked for a solution. Simple, stop making laws that protect people from their own stupidity. Let THEM remove themselves from the gene pool voluntarily.

If you do that then you are also removing the laws that protect people from the stupidity of others. Which basically means all of the laws odf civilisation would have to go – and civilisation right along with them.

That’s throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

Originally posted by adzewar:

The have pointed out that initial testing of black subjects in common cultural tests scored lower than average but when the test was changed to black cluture they were the superior performers.

Not going to happen. Ethnicity has very little to do with the capabilities fo the brain. Embodiment affects it, but the peripheral nervous system is affected far more than the central nervous system, which simply adapts. Black, white, yellow, aquamaroon; it doesn’t matter what your ethnic grouping is, your mental capability will still fall within the same range and distribution.

 
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Topic: Serious Discussion / Louis Head needs to be arrested for inciting riot.

Originally posted by urine420:

anyone who would seek to do harm to a member of law enforcement is probably of better character than anyone within law enforcement.

Urine, you should know better than that. People working within law enforcement are just people. No different than anyone else, ultimately. Some are dedicated to their jobs. Some don’t care and let it show. Some use it as an excuse to wield petty power over others, and some are taking kickbacks and bribes to supplement their income, bending the law to their will. Some are just undertrained and overworked.

As that little list should make clear, not all of them are bad, and I somehow doubt the majority are. Else we would see the majority of people as being evil, in other walks of life that take a fair cross-section of the community. We don’t.

 
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Topic: Serious Discussion / Should good behaviour be taught at school?

Originally posted by KingZeldar3:

With a few debateable exceptions, I feel like most people can understand the differences between right and wrong.

Outside of biological commonalities, shared by most brains, what exactly is ‘right’ and ‘wrong’? There’s certainly no absolute right and no absolute wrong, so what you are teaching is stillgoing to be highly subjective. You can teach what is ‘good for society’ and what is ‘bad for society’ along with the why for both, but that’s about as close as you are likely to get to ‘right’ and ‘wrong’.

What’s right for one society is wrong for another.


Originally posted by romperroom2014:

Yes, good behavior and common sense need to be taught in schools.

Good behavior is already taught in schools. What more do you realistically suggest be done?

‘Common sense’ ideally should not be taught in schools. It’s based out of problem solving on a usually unworkably simplified or superficial understanding of a problem. Instead of common sense, teach situational analysis, and show how systems are interlinked. Give the students the building blocks for a real analysis and show them how this analysis can be applied to any problem.

More difficult than letting them just apply problem solving to a hopelessly simplified and skin-deep issue, yes. But a lot more beneficial to them and more likely to provide workable solutions than common sense ever will.

 
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Topic: Serious Discussion / I am damn tired of Obamacare. Now it's time for the correction. :)

Originally posted by adzewar:

instead of trying to fix health care, why not outlaw health care insurance? it is a ‘middleman’ company that doesn’t produce anything (remember the saying in business, “Cut out the middle man.”?) costs of health care have skyrocketed since insurance companies got their dirty little paws into the business.

As it stands the insurance companies have too much political clout. Any change to the system is going to have to be multi-stage, and progress relatively slowly over the years. ACA itself was fought tooth and nail, and is but a husk of its original intention. It tried to take too much power away in one fell swoop basically.

So this has to be a longterm battle, likely lasting decades, in which the US is slowly moved to a better model of healthcare provision. Better in terms of providing the common citizen with higher levels of healthcare provision. It’s not an easy battle, and it’ll likely be one step forward, two steps back, and another step forward, for a lot of the fight.

Ultimately it’s still unclear if the US will go down the route of better healthcare, or the route of tighter control of medicine by the profit-makers. It’s frankly still unclear if the US is going to be around for long enough to enact a real change, or if that’s going to have to wait until the system collapses around our ears and whatever new states arise enact their own policies.

Only time will tell.

 
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Topic: Serious Discussion / Remove all social safety nets!

Originally posted by megapoopy:

You do not know what you are talking about. No program with the Safelink gives you iphone or any other top phone. You get several years old obsolete phones that have terrible sound quality and can hardly text.

You get whatever they can get the best deal on, in that area. Besides, when it’s in a carry case, it’ll look like it’s state of the art.

My friends make fun of us for having this shitty phone when they have iPhone 6 and awesome droid phones.

If it’s any consolation, I own my own home, a detached in a rather large plot of land that is also mine, and my phone is a fifteen year old model that only has enough space on the monochrome display for one line of numbers or letters at a time, and if you wish to text with it (which in theory it is capable of) you have to press the number buttons enough times to get the letter you were looking for.

Not having a pointlessly flashy phone loaded with functions you have no use for is hardly the end of the world.

Besides what the posters was saying is that the woman came in and had this separate phone iPhone 6 that she somehow obtained which she should not have been able to afford, and she should not have at all if you are on the Safelink assistance plan. If you look on the phone bill everyone else pays for these free phones with a fee on their bills so it’s wrong this woman was ripping off the program.

She said no such thing. Rather that the woman was using an iphone to make her calls. In other words, that she was using a touchscreen phone capable of displaying video, likely made by Apple at some point.

What the poster was saying reminded me of this video, the President Obama voter base who elected him into office.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tpAOwJvTOio

Could you provide a textual source please? I loathe youtube links – they’re usually either to vloggers or TV news broadcasts, and both are either seriously low on unbiased content, low on content in general, or both. I’d prefer to read about something if it’s all the same to you.

About the only use for youtube seems to be when using a video to expound upon a point made in a longer article. Even then, it’s a secondary source, rather than a primary.

 
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Topic: Serious Discussion / Remove all social safety nets!

The iphones are from a government-created program to give those on low income access to a phone line to help get them back into work where possible. It has strict usage limitations, and more importantly it is cheaper to give them an iphone than to set them up with a landline.

Oh and by the way, the ‘Obamaphone’ program was created by one Ronald Reagan. Perhaps you’ve heard of him? It’s the same program now, as it was then. They just continually look for the best value options. You know, the whole ‘saving money’ thing.

 
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Topic: Serious Discussion / Stupid People

I’d class intelligence as the ability to problem-solve, Kasic. The ability to look at a problem or any situation and analyse possible ways out of it. Knowledge retention is tied to it, but ultimately it’s linked to a different way of perceiving the world. Finding patterns and making links that would not be so obvious to those with lesser intelligence. Oh, they may get there in the end, and they may not, but it’ll take them longer to reach their conclusion.

It’s the same with knowledge an intelligent person holds; they’re much more intrinsically able to make new connections, and tie disparate data together in new ways if they have a high intellect, than if they have a low one.

It also ties into why common sense is fairly useless after a point. As Karma says: When you have ‘too much’ knowledge, you don’t use common sense.

Or rather: When you have sufficient knowledge and the ability to crunch that knowledge, you become aware of why the common sense approach is nonsensical, along with where and why it won’t solve the problem.

 
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Topic: Serious Discussion / Remove all social safety nets!

Originally posted by CptUnknown:

I think the true problem lies with the parents who send their children into the world ill equipped to stand on their own two feet. The safety nets just enable their inabilities.

That’s not the only problem. Say you are hit by a car one day. The incident amongst other things, wrenches your spine, and rams a couple of disks in at oblique angles, hard enough to sever your spinal cord. You’ll likely never walk again, through absolutely no fault of your own. If you were working in any manual labor job at the time, your job is now just a memory – you’ll never work labor again. So through absolutely no fault of your own, you are now jobless, suddenly and unexpectedly, and yet you still have bills to pay.

If the safety net was not there, what options would you be left with? You were brought up to be responsible by your parents so there is no fault there. You had a job and were self-sufficient until the accident. Now, you might never be able to hold down a job again. This is where the safety nets come into their own. They make life possible, even tolerable again.

 
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Topic: Serious Discussion / Do you guys think the earth has became hell itself?

Exhibit A. Excuse me for being paranoid. Thats how I am, I cant change that. And how the hell am i ignorant?

You’re ignorant because you’re only taking one half of the equation. You’re not even looking for the other side of the coin. You’re taking everything to extremes, and if you’re not careful you’ll wind up in a depressive cycle. Honestly, I’d recommend CBT to you as things stand – help you think in a different way.

Originally posted by Quilladin206:

Oh and btw. Im agnostic. Im not conservative.

Agnostic and conservative are not mutually exclusive, as you seem to be implying. Additionally, if you are an agnostic, why are you worried about hell? It’s a relatively recent invention, even amongst believers.

 
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Topic: Serious Discussion / Stupid People

Common sense is so named because it isn’t very common and it frequently makes no sense.

 
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Topic: Serious Discussion / Stupid People

Have to second this:

Originally posted by Kasic:

I’m really not trying to be arrogant here, but from my perspective, the extreme majority of people are not too bright. The average person is pretty stupid.

100 is the average IQ. If you have an IQ of 100, then half the population is dumber than you. As you climb above 100 of course, it only gets worse and worse. If you are unlucky enough to be in the top 2% that of course means 98% of the species is dumber than you. It is completely unavoidable, and you are going to have to learn to tolerate it.

 
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Topic: Serious Discussion / Do you guys think the earth has became hell itself?

Originally posted by Quilladin206:

Cause now, Im scared to go to hell. Im scared for others to go to hell. Worst part is, what if im worrying about hell for no reason? What if hell is just bullcrap? I dont know.

I would suggest getting out of the cycle where you’re so busy worrying about what might or might not be coming in some distant future, that you’re forgetting to get on with living. You’re making your own hell, and you’re living it right now.

 
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Topic: Serious Discussion / Remove all social safety nets!

Originally posted by Twilight_Ninja:

I think the original intention (of the programs) was to provide a helping hand to people who really needed it, while providing a pathway to work/self-sufficiency for the greatest number of people possible. That’s not a bad model, overall, but the reason it’s running into problems right now is because of abuses—some by those getting the benefits for life while not trying to work (welfare queens).

There are always going to be some who are on such programs for life. Not because they don’t wish to work, but because their physical condition is such that even if they do manage to find work, or even wind up in a position where work is possible, they are always going to need that extra little bit of help to overcome the disability so that they can have that quality of life.

Perhaps a good example is a lady who uses a seeing-eye dog to get around, and overcome her sight disability. The money that pays for the seeing-eye dog comes from the government. Take that money away, and she has to give up work as without the seeing-eye she cannot navigate to and from work, cannot go shopping on her own, etc.

If you are going to modify the welfare state, I would strongly emphasize not doing so in a way that penalises those whose inability to work or limited ability to work is not through any fault of their own. Yes, you are more than welcome to take money from those who truly are slackers, but if your pursuit of slackers takes money needed to live away from someone with for example, advanced parkinsons who is lucid some days and much, much less so on others due to the condition, then you are doing something very, very wrong in how you are approaching the issue.

 
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Topic: Serious Discussion / A Self-Modifiable Neuroprosthetic for Depression

Originally posted by beauval:

Now maybe this has already been done (I know some research has been done), but on the subject of forgetfulness, wouldn’t a device like this be helpful outside the realms of mental illness? Forgetulness tends to go hand in hand with age, and the western world has an ageing population. Old people as a group need more medication than young people. Would an implant of necessity have to be in the brain, and could the delivery system be command rather than demand driven?

It is very easy (relative to much of brain re-engineering) to make a system be command driven. This proposal uses command-driven to an extent, and the same system. It’s all about the status change signals the brain generates. An event driven portential (ERP) signal is basically an identifiable, predictable spike in brainwave activity generated by a particular specific area of the brain in response to a change in status. They are also generated by stimulus, and by the writing to or reading from memory engrams. The memory engrams themselves being a weaker, but still identifiable pattern in the brain.

So a command driven system is easy enough. Identify the ERP you wish the device to trigger upon detection of, or train it to fire when a particular thought is detected (it won’t understand the thought, the specific electrical pattern is what it’s looking for). When the right trigger signal is detected, activate the delivery program. That part is simple.

What isn’t simple, is where it has to be located.

Would an implant of necessity have to be in the brain

Depends what part of the brain you’re trying to interface with. If it’s the hindbrain, then you likely can get away with locating under the brain, in the back of the neck, or even squeezing through the gap above the pons. There’s no need to go into the brain itself if you’re looking to interface with the autonomic systems, or muscle triggers.

If you’re attempting to interface with the data from any of the primary senses other than touch (which goes through the hindbrain) then you’re interfacing with one of ten pairs of cranial nerves, and again, you can interface without entering the brain itself.

If it’s active thought you’re interfacing with (as in, for example, the device triggers when you think of a babnana) then you don’t even have to go invasive. An EEG cap on the outside of the skull will suffice, or an ECoG array placed on the outside surface of the brain, under the skull.

However, if it’s the guts you’re after – memory control, emotions, temperature control, chemical regulation, immune system et al, then you’re going to need to dig into the brain in order to read the specific signals you’re looking for. There’s too much noise cluttering things up if you stay on the outside; you’ll get the gist of what’s going on, but you won’t get specifics from the outside. You’re too far away and there are too many active brain processes between you and the target. An ECoG array surrounding the whole brain conceivably could do it, but the chances of implanting one over the whole brain are effectively nill, as you’d have to either completely dismantle the skull or take the brain out to do so – and neither procedure is exactly survivable as things stand.

So, if your system needs to access the deeper brain processes, then yes, it has to go deep inside the brain to get to them. As little as possible can go into the brain, but if you’re in a situation where the treatment also needs to go into the dep brain for immediate effect, then both parts will have to go inside.

It’s not completely hopeless; there’s a large hole inside the brain where conceivably quite a bit could fit. It’s a reservoir of cerebralspinal fluid just above the hindbrain and extending a ways into the midbrain. Reaching it is a pain as you have to drill through brain tissue whichever way you go, but it does offer the potential for a collapsible implant to be unfolded there, rather than scooping out chunks of your brain to make a cavity to fit it into.

Would an implant of necessity have to be in the brain

Again, it depends whether or not you really need an ERP or engram signal to act as your trigger. For many drugs, the trigger could be an ERP, or equally it could use the biochemical composition of the blood. Automatically detecting when the chemical cocktail in the blood is moving away from optimum levels, diagnosing the fix and injecting it into the bloodstream as and when required. An automatic self-reglating insulin pump would work this way, for example.

You’re always looking for the method that will do the least harm. Sometimes brain damage is unavoidable if you wish to do the most good, but sometimes you can get away without touching the brain, for the same effect. Involve the brain directly as little as possible, ie don’t start mucking about in there unless the device wouldn’t function as desired any other way.

 
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Topic: Serious Discussion / A Self-Modifiable Neuroprosthetic for Depression

Immortal, it’s an advertisement. Its whole purpose is to convince you to buy something. As Stan was saying, more kindly than I will: If you honestly believe an advertisement is the same as serious, personalised professional advice, then you my friend, need some serious psychological help.

I also take it you’re still going to refuse to actually address the questions I specifically asked of you. The ones I asked in my OP, and which others have kindly tried to address, and without them trying to hyjack the thread to try and claim bullshit that chemical changes in an electrochemical system won’t do anything, despite legions of evidence to the contrary.

 
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Topic: Serious Discussion / A Self-Modifiable Neuroprosthetic for Depression

Your whole argument was about people faking that they had a disorder, in order to show that the treatment system is flawed.

We know it’s flawed. Many of these conditions are damn subtle in physical appearance, or completely undetectable to our scanning methods. The only way to diagnose them reliably is through psychology. Study the individual, listen to them, listen to what their life is like, their views, and try to piece together what’s gone wrong inside their heads to lead them to this point.

With depression, anxiety, some forms of schitzophrenia, there’s no easily identifiable cause. We just don’t know enough about the brain yet to explain what’s causing them. What can be done however, is treat the symptoms. This usually takes the form of throwing enough shit at the fan that eventually something will stick.

It’s about as far from perfect as you can get, as what will work for one individual will have no effect whatsoever on someone presenting what appear to be the same symptoms, in fact it may even make them worse. So, everything is tried, and those treatment methods with the highest success rate, are tried first.

 
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Topic: Serious Discussion / A Self-Modifiable Neuroprosthetic for Depression

Immortal777

Originally posted by Immortal7777:

But what evidence is there that chemical imbalances are to blame. I know that many cases turn out to be something else like diet, or exposure to some toxin however when it comes to psychiatry they revolve around the chemical imbalance explanation.</

Both a toxin in the bloodstream, and a diet change are chemical changes in the system, so your argument defeats itself. “It can’t be chemical changes, because some of these conditions can be replicated by introducing new chemicals into the system!”

Really. Try faking MS, or CP. Go on. It’ll be interesting to see how you fake the brain activity changes and the literally missing parts of the brain.

If there was scientific evidence that chemical imbalances were to blame then they should have done so for the Rosenhan.

There is. Every dysfunction of the brain has a biochemical basis. Stanwise even linked you to a set of papers and articles pointing out the connection. Which you summarilly ignored whilst complaining that aparently your sources were being ignored. They weren’t. Stan even pointed out quite rightly that there is evidence on both sides.

The problem is, for a lot of mental health problems, it is very difficult to pin down the specific cause. Take Parkinson’s for instance. No test will specifically and conclusively show a person has Parkinson’s disease, a slow neurodegenerative disorder where the brain basically eats itself over a period of time. By your argument here, Parkinson’s disease doesn’t exist, and these people are faking it when their memory goes, they lose control of their muscles, lose the control to make coordinated movements, lose control of their bowels and bladder, shake continually whenever they try to rest or sleep. It’s all faking, by this argument.

That the physical symptoms follow the same pattern, and that the condition persists for lifetimes progressively getting worse and worse until the patient literally loses control of their ownbody completely, and is trapped inside with their faculties degenerating into mush is irrelevant, they must clearly be faking it, because the only known way to manage the condition is via a chemical change; adding a new substance (levodopa) into the body, corrects the chemical imbalance, and the symptoms swiftly fade. Because there’s no one definitive test to say “look here. This is where the Parkinsons is originating, I can see the tissue pattern!” Then it must all be made up, right?

Right?



By the way, you never bothered to answer the questions I asked of you directly, from my OP. Is there a reason for this?


onlineidiot

Are you saying that it’s better to go through a high-risk surgery than to simply take a pill?

For those who need their depression to be a part of their lives as they use it to fuel their creativity? Yes, absolutely. It gives them the ability to still use that depression as a source of inner strength for their creative gift, without running the risk that the depression will spiral out of their control until the whole world is a yawing maw into oblivion. At that point their creativity’s all dried up; there’s no hope, no light left in life itself. No reason to go on living. That’s when people end it all.

I was proposing a potential third route. A way to keep the depression inside you, but limit it to a managable level; physically prevent it from spiraling out of control, by releasing chemicals to counteract the symptoms of depression when it reaches below a certain threshold, either one specified by the client, or the automatic one when depression-related electrical activity is spiking to life-threatening levels.

This also I hope, covers why there is an advantage to an immediate brain-state related discharge rather than a continual drug-induced emotion-suppressing state. It allows the flexibility to use your depression as a managable asset to your work, if you as an individual desire that.

My point is that there’s no reason that any insurance company would pay many times as much to go to a neurologist to have an experimental procedure done that would only marginally make someone more functional than they would were they to use antidepressants or other mood-altering substances.

Insurance companies don’t pay for high-end iLimb Ultras either. They’ll pay for a LivingSkin prosthetic because its cheaper and restores some functionality, (it’s a rigid prosthetic that doesn’t move). It’s up to the customer to pay out of their own pocket if they wish the high-end models that restore their sense of touch and allow them to use their shoulder, elbow, wrist, thumb and digits via commands from their brain, just like with the old arm. Despite that being purely elective, the benefits of having a functional hand, and retaining the ability to feel, prompts enough people to pay that extra wedge themselves, to keep us in business.

It would be no different with this neuroprosthetic.

 
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Topic: Serious Discussion / The truth on President Obama and the recent elections.

Heh. We’re not going to evolve away from warfare. Have you taken a look at the natural world lately? Evolution is all about competition and survival. Finding a niche and exploiting it; protecting your territory from all comers. If anything it’s the biological imperative to give your kin an advantage over other’s kin that’s driving the engine of war in the first place.

 
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Topic: Serious Discussion / What the hell is wrong with the country?

Actually the lesson to be learned is on the boss’s side. When you issue an application form for employment, you should be listing what skills are desirable and what skills are required. The person being expected to demonstrate how they have competency in these skills.

It’s the same at interview; it is for the employer to check that the person they are looking to hire has the basic skills required for the job, and to be aware if there are any deficiencies, particularly as these can be trained up later if the person is otherwise suitable. It stops situations like this from occuring.