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re: ongoing discussion about the timer—
I posted a good comment about why the timer is important in Sirlins forums. Find it here:
http://www.sirlin.net/forums/showthread.php?p=2365#post2365
I also made a thread where I talk about cool things like "Fast-mode Kongai". The post even has an interesting puzzle with an awesome solution if you figure it out! Find it here:
http://www.sirlin.net/forums/showthread.php?p=2368#post2368
— Bruce
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When we get decent lagtimes, 30 seconds should be enough per move. An overall time bank like in chess or scrabble games would also be good. Or something like a Fischer clock.
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Something weird happened, I was fighting someone with the Tiger's Claw equipped, and the bleeding effect hit Higashi, who was not in play...
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@re: timer
I thought the timer was 30 seconds. The time-out for disconnects is a full minute but I thought the between-rounds timer was shorter because, yeah, a full minute for each click is too much. It also can lead to trouble with griefing - it would be very annoying to face a player/bot who waited every single time until the very last moment to move - so, like in a game of chess I wouldn't mind if there wasn't just a timer for making moves but an overall pool that timer burns through which, when used up, causes a forfeit or forced moves or something. Bruce is right, though, that having that time isn't a bad thing. Being able to think about future moves and plan ahead adds to the game's depth.
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Agree with shirt. We should have an option at least to lower the timer. Most games could have 15 second timer and be fine. So many minutes are used up with an opponent who has a single choice. Also, there is a major amount of lag recently - THAT'S WHY NO ONE IS PLAYING IT.
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I guess that if it takes you a minute to think about your next move then Kongai isn't too slow. However it appears that most players, me included, think that a minute is too long. A 30 second timer would increase the action and push players to think quickly.
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I don't get the "game takes too long" comments.
When I play, I either use the minute to think or talk to my opponent, or if I am waiting for my opponent, I sit and try to guess what my opponent is doing so I can learn more about him and test my intuition, or I talk to my opponent. Sometimes I wish I had more time! (But no, 1 min is fine.)
Would a "Kongai-fast mode" be fun? Yes. But is Kongai too slow? I don't think so. Think or talk more.
- Bruce
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this game is good, but i get confused easily(due to the fasct i did not read instructions). The only problem I have with the game is that it is time-consuming, it takes to long for the turn to pass. Giving the game more graphical animations may make up for the slow speed(in my opinion)
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first of all this game is great and very original. the idea of gaining the cards over time and have to work to earn them is good. but have some downsides for new joiners who want to play kongai.
And there is more to do before the realease of this game:
1. add a 1 time reset for selecting the starter cards. new players nomraly would select cards that they won't fit to thier strategy after a while.
2. something must be done to the AI of single player. when there is no players around there is nothing to do with this game because the AI is terrible, the enemy doesn't change ranges and only rests and intercepts and it not really fun to win 5 enemies with the use of only 1 card.
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The most fun part is when the first match is higashi vs higashi and we get to play stun palm roulette to see who wins
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however i must add that compared to some other more competitive games Kongai does lack the right to be competitive due to the game being able to swing too wildy on a consistent basis
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PS. For more on this topic, see here:
http://www.gamasutra.com/features/20060222/sirlin_01.shtml
… and before you get outraged at that article (it's only part of the full perspective), please read:
http://www.sirlin.net/?p=127
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jewstylekungfu,
Don't want to drag the Kongai comments too far off-topic but: Kongai is great fun for me. Playing fellow opponents, the process of self improvement, yomi (reading the mind of the opponent), landing that intercept—all fun! Kongai has great art, but that's just a facade; a surface. The rule set, and what it tests and lessons it teaches, is what's important. Eg. Street Fighter appears to be about cartoon fighting, but it teaches you some excellent life lessons.
- Bruce
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Bruce, some of us just play games for fun. The internet is a great place for self-mastery, but mastering yourself to these scantily-clad card character girls is a little sad.
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zonsolo,
Kongai, and all competitive games, are about self-mastery. The game and your opponent are just constructs used to walk that path.
— Bruce
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reminds me of tag-team wrestling too much with the swap-out stuff. Not too thrilled with trying to play a mind reader.
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green items can only be used with green characters (amazons). balck with black and pink with pink and tan with tan. Grey items are universal.
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well I now have 3 items that have no add icon, I can't use them.... is it a problem with me or the game, I haven't seen others with this proplem in the fourms and such
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When in Deck Builder and a character card has been added and has an item, add a mouseover text description box of the item's ability when cursor is over icon of the item. Beginner players do not remember what item's abilities are based on pictures, and when building a 5 card deck I find myself taking the item out of the character card to be able to read what it did.
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Please make the Deck Builder left-right scroll bar button twice larger. It is now so small that its hard to target it with mouse, and you have the empty space there to make it a lot bigger. The slider is used a lot when making a deck.
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I never remember to push the "save" button in the deck builder. It would be better if the "back to deck gallery" button had some kind of "Do you want to save your changes?" double-check.
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Aside from the constant difficulty connecting to the kongai server, I'm pleased with how this game is progressing.
However, I would like to see the possibility of deselecting the choice of switching out. Being forced to switch by an accidental click is human error, but irritating nonetheless.
I suppose with syncing issues, this won't be a readymade fix, but I hope to see that in the final product!
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i hope the servers help. It's becoming quite a round of similar faces at the moment. Which isn't necessarily bad.
Bruce, you are what I think this beta needs - you're the community right now :)
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Re: "also the lack of players means you have to wait ages to get a game which is i believe what they call a downward spiral…"
Indeed. I’ve been trying to get a game for hours now. No deal; no players. (A few Kongai testers are online right now, just not playing Kongai, probably confirming your downward spiral). Let’s see if (and hope!) the new servers improve the situation.
— Bruce
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Re: single player AI
I wrote a follow up post with more detail about this topic here:
http://www.sirlin.net/forums/showthread.php?p=2306#post2306
It's long, but if you only read the text under the "short version" headings, it's not long at all.
— Bruce
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Re: single player AI
As far as I know, the AI makes random choices. It has no mechanism that causes it to make weighted decisions.
I also agree with NorthernPolarity. AI is good for learning the interface, etc, but you will learn much more playing humans. Also, people playing multiplayer will help keep the game community lively.
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they said that they were gonna work on the ai of the kong-bot its just a matter of time. personally i like how he rests but thats just me
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the single player Bot AI needs a lot of work. I just had a game where Ashi with a full energy bar didn't close with me. She just stood at range and rested while I took her apart.
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I think there is a ton of potential in this game. I do think it needs to speed up a bit but that could be an easy fix. I am rather excited to see some new cards and maybe get some music in the background.
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In the meantime, here's a post I made about card unlocks. It's actually two posts, but you can get the gist of it by reading the first (shorter) post. This is a topic that should interest you all: http://www.sirlin.net/forums/showthread.php?t=289
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In reply to those who commented about the lack of players —
I think you all bring up great points that should be genuinely considered by Kongregate. I'd like to respond to all of them, but I'll save that for a Sirlin.net forum post.
As for what Aristar mentioned about a "community forum"... to let the cat out of the bag, I've wanted to do this for weeks now. Sirlin made a Kongai forum, so I decided to take another approach to what I was planning, but I still see a dire need for a place that has a sense of community. Sirlin's forums have a different feel to them. Community is a powerful thing, and I think I can help in this regard. I'll see if I can accelerate the process. I'll respond to the points you guys covered when I get a chance. Thanks, guys.— Bruce
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Thinktank, sometimes we need specific combos to test. For example, if I want to test Hypnotic Stare against a speed 6 power swing, I need the valk charm and ashi.
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this game is not even as good as pokemon card game.. :(
*would be good to add music effect to background and to attack..*
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additionally, I think you should put in a percent checker, so that if you use a 30% effective effect two times and it fails then the third time it will work and if you do the same and it works two times in a row then it should fail the third time. This should only apply if a player is using the same move repetivly (as in multiple times consecutively). This will (hopefully) eliminate the uproar over Higashi's unbalancedness, as well as prevent future problems.
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some ideas for single player:
have the computer know which cards prefer which range.
Don't have intercepts be completely random, have the computer only intercept when player health and energy is below half or something
Don't have enemy attacks be random; have the enemy at least do the attack that does the most damage over an attack that does almost nothing when it has full energy.
Maybe put in a survival mode of your 5 card deck against a continous stream of charachters.
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This game needs a beter single player. Multiplayer is great but the best way to fix the lack of players problem is to make single player not suck.