> *Originally posted by **[skinnersimpson24](/forums/727066/topics/1589031?page=3#12542520)**:* > The player has to be at lvl 12 before they can access the combo mystery system. If that's the case wouldn't the player get rid of these cards before the time they get to lvl 12? I'm really confused now about what you did and didn't read. My original post, which you replied to, was in reply to somebody who was objecting to combo mastery being unlocked when a player reached level 12, instead of being available from the beginning. My reply was explaining why there was a good reason to have that limit in place. The fact that players are likely to get rid of those cards by the time they reach level 12 is my point.

> *Originally posted by **[Strongcleric](/forums/727066/topics/1589031?page=4#12542582)**:* > I'm really confused now about what you did and didn't read. My original post, which you replied to, was in reply to somebody who was objecting to combo mastery being unlocked when a player reached level 12, instead of being available from the beginning. My reply was explaining why there was a good reason to have that limit in place. The fact that players are likely to get rid of those cards by the time they reach level 12 is my point. Oh, I get your point now sorry for the confusion.

GOOD LORD! THE QUOTE POST IS HUGE!

> *Originally posted by **[SeizureBrand](/forums/727066/topics/1589031?page=4#12542659)**:* > GOOD LORD! THE QUOTE POST IS HUGE! ha

i think there is a problem with this whole idea. I also think it is coming, no matter what anyone writes here or how sound their reasoning might be. but since input is encouraged: smart players will only use their tokens on combos that are already slightly overpowered (it is not news that some combos are almost a bit *too useful*, right?). i have not seen any balancing since i jumped on board a couple of months ago and i fancy there would even be complaints by some players if balancing were to be undertaken. i have no quarrel with that. anyone has a chance to discover these combos or to research them online. but this new feature would aggravate the issue even further (that some combos just feel broken) no matter how slight the opportunity to upgrade combos may turn out to be. every point is a point in the wrong direction, when it comes to encouraging different play styles and experimenting with your deck. because a one-hit-ko is a one-hit-ko, and no amount of strategy can make up for that. speaking of which: the reason why bge is such a good feature is that it periodically "forces" players to mix things up. get rid of some cards you would usually use, and put some new ones in, even though they may not be maxed out yet, or cards you havent used in a while. it's fun. and its rewarding to suddenly being able to beat players that have much stronger decks but have not prepared for the bge (maybe because they have stopped playing the game). in fact, i think bge is one of the main reasons so many people keep playing. you can't just keep on doing what works, you have to adapt. its an intriguing challenge. of course for most people (including myself) it comes down to a mix of some bge-relevant cards, some too-good-to-lay-down cards, and some fillers. this would not change. but still, the new feature is a step in the wrong direction. using the tokens will either basically lock down part of your deck forever (as in "too good to lay down") or even worse, you will realize you have made a mistake and spent a valuable resource on a combo you arent using after all. the latter could be very frustrating depending on how rare tokens will be. you get one or the other. i'm sorry to say, but i feel the new feature could not be adding much to the game, no matter how it will be balanced or implemented. that said, i welcome that the team is looking for ways to further improve the game. i will have to agree, though, to some of the comments here, that bug fixes should be prioritised, to give a more professional feel to the game. support is also a coin toss right now. one person was very nice and helpful. another seemed to struggle with appearing to know anything about the game, and i had to explain everything to them. which ended in a lot of suppressed anger for both of us (and i ended up not getting a reward even though i reportet several bugs).

I'm going to assume the power increase will be similiar to level 10 > 15 heroes. Not much, but this should make PCs a little weaker overal, which is a positive. PCs cannot be upgraded, correct?

> *Originally posted by **[Strongcleric](/forums/727066/topics/1589031?page=3#12541908)**:* > > *Originally posted by **[Jerrybooy](/forums/727066/topics/1589031?page=3#12541012)**:* > > I can see a few disadvantages concerning this idea: > > 1. To only make this available to players of level 12 and above is a real game changer. Until now you could start as a new player, buy out boxes twice and then you would already be able to compete with theoretically anyone (although your hero level would make things hard). Now you know that until level 12 there will be opponents that you can't beat no matter what just because of your level. I see no logical reason to exclude lower level players from this. Had I started this game under these conditions it would have driven me away. (although perhaps it might motivate others?) > > 2. I really think that upgrading the combos as they are is not recommendable. Combos get more powerful with each BGE and mythics are already a luck factor as it is, so making these combos even more powerful will be no good and take away a lot of the strategy > > 3. It widens the gap between new and veteran players even more. I think if newbies realize what it takes to get to that level they might give up on the game immediately. (you realize how this change is very beginner-unfriendly when you compare to 1) ) > > 4. Of course, the most important part is how you can obtain these shards/fragments/whatever. I will not complain in advance until I see how this is implemented, but if it is mainly through gems, then sorry, that will be too much for me, I won't spend even more than I do until now (and that's considerable - believe me). The hint that the material can be obtained through special events might also mean that it is obtained through top ranking in either guild or one of the other events. Once again, if this is true, it will widen the gap between new players/veterans and weaker/stronger guilds. > > > > So looking at all these arguments makes it clear that this can be considered a fan service to the top whalers and will very likely frighten off new players/ make quite a few veterans quit. Is that really a step you want to take? > > > > While I share some of your concerns, I actually think that it not being able to be used until level 12 makes some sense. It was stated that if they were below level 12, they could still get those tokens (similar to how you can get hero tokens for characters you haven't unlocked yet), but not use them. The reason I think this part can be a good thing, is because otherwise you would have a lot of new players that might use these to upgrade combos that don't have stronger versions that they will want later, and cause them to greatly regret having used them on weak cards. By the time you get to level 12, you should have a decent idea of what combos will have sustainable value for your deck. > > My big concern is that they say they will be available with special events and in the shop. Since special events don't happen very often (or cease being "special"), this means that they will be primarily available to those who spend money. While it is stated there will be a "cap" in place at the beginning, we can be assured that if enough people reach that "cap" that it will change. This "cap" might also be "limit 4 token packs" with each offer, and then we see how often the next offer comes out to let people buy 4 more. > > For me, this could have been a good replacement for the Epic shards in SFC. Sure, spenders would have had an advantage, based on how many refills they pay for, but at least the more casual player could have felt they were making consistent progress on this, too. Yes, I can see your point concerning the level limit. That makes sense. Good reasoning! Also I like your idea of these combo mastery items replacing the (useless) SFC epic shards. You should work as dev!

Member when Mythics were end game content!?  I member!

I'm just overall very disapointed, my wife and I have been playing this game since the launch pretty much (not bragging, I know thousands of players are like us) but this is the first time I feel like we should stop playing. Mythic used to be very rare, but now they are sold for a fraction of the price they used to cost. Kong broke the Mythics by giving away too many, so they now have to find something else for people to spend their money on. It won't be adding any value to the game, and for F2P, it will just widen the gap even more. I'm proud of being a valuable player of a top 30 guild (we finished 28 in the rumble), but I can't see how my wife or I will be able to keep helping the guild when someone who is ready to throw money out of the window can outpower us in their first week of playing. All the comments show that everyone see this as a pure money grab, and it's a shame resources are going towards this instead of providing valuable and interesting content for people to enjoy.

Hang on, (This is probably very far fetched) but why would they be giving us a way to increase our combo power, unless there is some sort of boss/event we need this increased strength for? Again, probably looking into this way too much, but why give us this new feature now?

> _Originally posted by **[deltazug2](/forums/726779/topics/1589031?page=4#12543336):**_ > I'm just overall very disapointed, my wife and I have been playing this game since the launch pretty much (not bragging, I know thousands of players are like us) but this is the first time I feel like we should stop playing. Mythic used to be very rare, but now they are sold for a fraction of the price they used to cost. Kong broke the Mythics by giving away too many, so they now have to find something else for people to spend their money on. It won't be adding any value to the game, and for F2P, it will just widen the gap even more. I'm proud of being a valuable player of a top 30 guild (we finished 28 in the rumble), but I can't see how my wife or I will be able to keep helping the guild when someone who is ready to throw money out of the window can outpower us in their first week of playing. All the comments show that everyone see this as a pure money grab, and it's a shame resources are going towards this instead of providing valuable and interesting content for people to enjoy. Started playing fourteen months ago this and the ridiculous gig watt conversion (400 epics for 9 random epics and a leg on average) probably means i am out.. how am i going to counter almost op combos now if they have a boost... I have been waiting for the gig watt solution hoping i could get some legs from my grinding.. the answer is clearly not. another conversion is 391.000 epic stones for one legendary.. I was hopefull they came up with something like 25 epics for one random leg.. or 25.000 epic stones.... for 1.000 leg stones. Still not great but at least you would get something. Combo mastery... well will only benefit if you buy boxes out i guess. I play my vip out and maybe look at the mastery for a month... and than i fear i have to come to the same conclusion, Props for rumble changes though. the formula for scoring and matchups needs some tweaking.. going backwards after a win with 30K difference. but other than that most fights where fun..

> *Originally posted by **[SeizureBrand](/forums/727066/topics/1589031?page=4#12543517)**:* > Hang on, (This is probably very far fetched) but why would they be giving us a way to increase our combo power, unless there is some sort of boss/event we need this increased strength for? Again, probably looking into this way too much, but why give us this new feature now? YES! I agree! The Quest For Cards has no flippin' BOSSES?!?!?!?!?!

> *Originally posted by **[ThinkerApe](/forums/727066/topics/1589031?page=4#12543093)**:* > I'm going to assume the power increase will be similiar to level 10 > 15 heroes. Not much, but this should make PCs a little weaker overal, which is a positive. > > PCs cannot be upgraded, correct? Wrong, the OP says it doesn't matter how you make the combo, and I'm sure that includes PC's. If you're looking to buff the strongest version of that combo though, it isn't the PC version anyway.

Actually, nope on two counts. PCs don't count as 'combos' for various things (the daily quest, the boost+recover skills), but more importantly: > *Originally posted by **[ModchiKopi](/forums/727066/topics/1589031?page=1#12540028)**:* > > *Originally posted by **[DanielZ822](/forums/727066/topics/1589031?page=1#12539988)**:* > > also pre-combos what happen to them? > > > > PCs will still be very powerful because they don't require the extra turn to actually make the combo. Of course, balance will be taken into consideration as the new feature gains traction, so we can always look forward to updates as the game grows.

You know, instead of charging people for this and having us earn things to upgrade, it should've been as simple as researching the cards. Like if I had 4 maxed Hanks and we can research them together to make it stronger. That's what the 4th chamber could've been for

> *Originally posted by **[Personman321](/forums/727066/topics/1589031?page=1#12539987)**:* > Can you define what you mean by "end game content"? Having all mythics and quad legendary cards. Basically, something for whales to do now that they're starting to max the mythic stone set of mythics.

My guess is an update will be required and that will be april 17 ish or before the next rumble and have some added features (right mod? ) just wondering have a peice of shit phone and need to free up mad space for an update.... Memory card time lmao

> *Originally posted by **[SeizureBrand](/forums/727066/topics/1589031?page=4#12543517)**:* > Hang on, (This is probably very far fetched) but why would they be giving us a way to increase our combo power, unless there is some sort of boss/event we need this increased strength for? Again, probably looking into this way too much, but why give us this new feature now? Because they want another way to milk the top players for all the cash they're willing to spend in order to stay on top

looking at my deck, I see that the newer, cooler cards have fewer combos and are more likely to have one-off combos With Mastery, though, I'm rewarded for having duplicates of characters and boring cards that make the same combos over and over again . I should be really excited about being close to getting another Mythic, but with Mastery it might not make my deck. It's fun to have that perfect combo come up to play, those two cards I have one each of... but it sounds like I'll be running with three Bobby, three Fry, and three Peter once I learn my combos takes a lot of the joy out of the game, as I see it ****

What exactly would make it stronger? Atk goes up? Hp? Both? How about skill sets?

> _Originally posted by **[MrCatfood](/forums/726779/topics/1589031?page=1#12540105):**_ > From the most invested player to the most jaded, you have honestly killed the prospect of continuing to play this game competitively for every player. I have stood back and been amazed by what can only be described as an experiment in the financial exploitation of a fan base. As a company you have consistently pushed initiatives that undermine both the time and money that all players have put in this game. Anyone that continues to push for box buyouts and mythics shards after this clear demonstration of contempt for any hard earned money and precious time spent on this game is an idiot. I am not saying players should stop all spending but remember announcements like today's and know that your big purchase only emboldens them to come back for more, not by giving you more compelling content and fulfillment, but by undermining you and playing on that age old notion of being in too deep.

> _Originally posted by **[mattender](/forums/726779/topics/1589031?page=4#12543899):**_ > Actually, nope on two counts. PCs don't count as 'combos' for various things (the daily quest, the boost+recover skills), but more importantly: > > > *Originally posted by **[ModchiKopi](/forums/727066/topics/1589031?page=1#12540028)**:* > > > *Originally posted by **[DanielZ822](/forums/727066/topics/1589031?page=1#12539988)**:* > > > also pre-combos what happen to them? > > > > > > > PCs will still be very powerful because they don't require the extra turn to actually make the combo. Of course, balance will be taken into consideration as the new feature gains traction, so we can always look forward to updates as the game grows. > To argue that a Pre Combo is not a form of that combo just because it is pre-formed is just dumb. Of course they don't count for actions that require actively combining cards, but that doesn't mean they aren't that combo. I guarantee they will include pc's in the mastery effects.

> *Originally posted by **[NathanV417](/forums/727066/topics/1589031?page=4#12547843)**:* > > _Originally posted by **[mattender](/forums/726779/topics/1589031?page=4#12543899):**_ > > Actually, nope on two counts. PCs don't count as 'combos' for various things (the daily quest, the boost+recover skills), but more importantly: > > > > > *Originally posted by **[ModchiKopi](/forums/727066/topics/1589031?page=1#12540028)**:* > > > > *Originally posted by **[DanielZ822](/forums/727066/topics/1589031?page=1#12539988)**:* > > > > also pre-combos what happen to them? > > > > > > > > > > PCs will still be very powerful because they don't require the extra turn to actually make the combo. Of course, balance will be taken into consideration as the new feature gains traction, so we can always look forward to updates as the game grows. > > > > To argue that a Pre Combo is not a form of that combo just because it is pre-formed is just dumb. Of course they don't count for actions that require actively combining cards, but that doesn't mean they aren't that combo. I guarantee they will include pc's in the mastery effects. You can feel what you like about PCs, though if you said they obviously ought to trigger boost/recover, we'd have to have a chat. But read what Modchi said. I trust Modchi's voice on what's going to happen in this game much more than my own or yours.

If this comes out as a buy tokens I'm out that will be.it for.me . I spend way to much on this game as is.