OH MY GOD WHAT DO YOU WANT FROM MY FREEBOOTERS AGAIN

> *Originally posted by **[uwjerks](/forums/955764/topics/1595248?page=1#12556553)**:* > As a Winter player I depend on cycling Frosthexers often, which makes the 1 mana very efficent. If it is in my hand early I usually play it so that hopefully I can get it back and use the Midwinter/ Wisp combo at some point. Winter only has one, I repeat one, unit card below 4 whereas the other factions have multiple unit cards below 4 so the only way to deal with the other factions is to be able to slow them down and the ability to cycle Frosthexers is key to that. Increasing it to 2 will slow cycling considerably and hinder winter players at higher levels. Starting at rank 15 I see swarm and shadow at my base with multiple units by the second or third turn. The only way to slow them is with a low cost Frosthexer unit. > Since this is already happening I would ask you to consider reducing Wisp Cloud to 3 mana. This will mitigate the loss of cylcing of Frosthexers. > Thanks. I agree with this sentiment. Swarm now has the only race specific 1 mana cost unit, and it's an amazing unit with 2 movement. I think there should be a couple balance changes to help with swarm/winter issues: 1) Increase mana cost of restless goats +1 mana 2) Have freeze effect keep attached to units onto enemies turn and prevent movement (i.e. no pushing/pulling/command) on frozen units. This should be doable the way that poison persists, but it improves freeze so it doesn't just nerf movement on start of next turn, it also prevents movement for units until end of opponents turn.

His suggestion would actucally make running a "whole freeze" deck viable. For restless goats I say go the Broken Truce route with it.

The nerf to frosthexers is only a buff to aggro decks. The only thing that keeps any winter deck player in the early game against aggro decks is the ability to freeze them in place. By cutting back on that ability, you're just giving aggro decks the advantage. Especially now with all the extra chip damage they can do, you're in for a lot of quick losses as a winter deck player. I wouldn't be surprised if they were catering to aggro decks by beefing all those swarm cards. We see more swarm decks than anything else so it's safe to assume, those players are spending the most money on the game. So much for this being a game about strategy. :/

> *Originally posted by **[AngryTurtle98](/forums/955764/topics/1595248?page=3#12571398)**:* > The nerf to frosthexers is only a buff to aggro decks. The only thing that keeps any winter deck player in the early game against aggro decks is the ability to freeze them in place. By cutting back on that ability, you're just giving aggro decks the advantage. Especially now with all the extra chip damage they can do, you're in for a lot of quick losses as a winter deck player. > > I wouldn't be surprised if they were catering to aggro decks by beefing all those swarm cards. We see more swarm decks than anything else so it's safe to assume, those players are spending the most money on the game. > > So much for this being a game about strategy. :/ Well the devs forgot to change the game's name Stormbound : World at War Edition  * **Includes:*** *Storming the battlements (Rushing) Sniping Enemies (Chip Damage) Rallying the Troops for Defensive Pushs (Zoo) * Play Now for Free !!!

Yeah, as someoneone with lv5 frosthex, I accept that 2mana is necessary, it just helps to keep a surrounding 7-8 damage combo in check. However I've always found the whole "freeze" ability abit of a joke when push & pull just ignores frozen enemies. But surely if freeze did keep an enemy frozen, we genuinely would loose any sense of strategy with our boards just clogged up via all surrounding freeze cards making Ubass and Needle 10x more useful.

> *Originally posted by **[AzazeL___](/forums/955764/topics/1595248?page=3#12571857)**:* > Yeah, as someoneone with lv5 frosthex, I accept that 2mana is necessary, it just helps to keep a surrounding 7-8 damage combo in check. However I've always found the whole "freeze" ability abit of a joke when push & pull just ignores frozen enemies. But surely if freeze did keep an enemy frozen, we genuinely would loose any sense of strategy with our boards just clogged up via all surrounding freeze cards making Ubass and Needle 10x more useful. Defintely would be annoying of the oppo to play against. I'm just saying that will make playing with all freeze/clear cards more viable than what we currently have.

> _Originally posted by **[Folez22](/forums/941638/topics/1595248?page=3#12572626):**_ > Not sure if all the other players are feeling the same way but that damn frosthexler nerf has hit me hard.. Thinking of scrapping rimelings for another lower mana card (maybe first mutineers?) as rockworkers seem to have a great buff and I also run ubass level 3. Not sure if I'll make it to rank 1 this month though unfortunately. Rimelings is kinda just a 2mana unit though once it reimburses you 3mana. Just that delicate early game balance that troubles winter players. Mutineers is a good choice though it can mess up your combos. & If your name crops up in Rank 3/2 ill concede NP.

The nerf honestly pushed my deck to be later games. Now gotta to wait that extra turn to play the combo (5 mana). If it not worth it, cycle. But, say I go 2nd so I get to that 5 mana faster. A Swarm deck that goes 1st can do these things on there second turn (4 mana) Restless Goats + Green Prototypes + Lawless Herd +Northsea Dog (4 mana) Restless Goats + Green Prototypes + First Mutineers (4 mana) Restless Goats + Lawless Herd + Shady Ghoul (4 mana) Restless Goats + Westwind Sailors (4 mana) Restless Goats + Gifted Recruits + Green Prototypes (4 mana) Restless Goats + First Mutineers + Northsea Dog (4 mana) There more even without Restless Goats but that's way too to state *Sidenote : That New God of War ......... Lit

> *Originally posted by **[Folez22](/forums/955764/topics/1595248?page=3#12572626)**:* > Not sure if all the other players are feeling the same way but that damn frosthexler nerf has hit me hard.. Thinking of scrapping rimelings for another lower mana card (maybe first mutineers?) as rockworkers seem to have a great buff and I also run ubass level 3. Not sure if I'll make it to rank 1 this month though unfortunately. I'm in the exact same boat. I didn't need a 1 mana frost hexers for the freeze, but because it was a 1 mana 3hp unit, the freeze was a bonus. I have lawless herd in my deck, and I'm keeping that because it's 1 mana for a 3 hp unit. I balance my decks by hp/mana spent, and the 1 mana units were overpowered by being 3-4x hp/1 mana. My deck was a winter rush deck, and now with the 2 mana frost hexers, my deck composition has gone from 25% (3x 1-mana cards) to a 16% (2x 1-mana cards) and that drastically hurt my early game, far more than the value of the frost hexers freeze ability. I'm struggling to find a winter rebalance with my cards that can carry me to rank 1. I'm currently rank 4, dipped into rank 3, but got swarm rushed out of that place quick. Here's to hoping I can find 10 bot battles to win in a row.

> _Originally posted by **[Hollow__](/forums/941638/topics/1595248?page=3#12571528):**_ > > *Originally posted by **[AngryTurtle98](/forums/955764/topics/1595248?page=3#12571398)**:* > > The nerf to frosthexers is only a buff to aggro decks. The only thing that keeps any winter deck player in the early game against aggro decks is the ability to freeze them in place. By cutting back on that ability, you're just giving aggro decks the advantage. Especially now with all the extra chip damage they can do, you're in for a lot of quick losses as a winter deck player. > > > > I wouldn't be surprised if they were catering to aggro decks by beefing all those swarm cards. We see more swarm decks than anything else so it's safe to assume, those players are spending the most money on the game. > > > > So much for this being a game about strategy. :/ > > Well the devs forgot to change the game's name > > Stormbound : World at War Edition >  > > * > **Includes:*** > *Storming the battlements (Rushing) > Sniping Enemies (Chip Damage) > Rallying the Troops for Defensive Pushs (Zoo) > * > Play Now for Free !!! Don't forget all the DLC you gotta pay for if you wanna play with everyone else. Haha!

> _Originally posted by **[AzazeL___](/forums/941638/topics/1595248?page=3#12571857):**_ > Yeah, as someoneone with lv5 frosthex, I accept that 2mana is necessary, it just helps to keep a surrounding 7-8 damage combo in check. However I've always found the whole "freeze" ability abit of a joke when push & pull just ignores frozen enemies. But surely if freeze did keep an enemy frozen, we genuinely would loose any sense of strategy with our boards just clogged up via all surrounding freeze cards making Ubass and Needle 10x more useful. If the biggest concern with Winter decks was the 7-8 surrounding damage with the whisp/MWC combo, or even the slightly less FH/Whisp combo, the correct way to balance that would have been to either increase the Mana on the Whisp or reduce the damage it does. Aggro users have a lourder voice than any one else due to their being the majority. Devs catered to them by making it easier for the to rush in the early game. From a monetary stand point, crippling Winter decks would make them a lot of extra cash by forcing Winter players to switch factions and level up new cards. At the very least, if Mana is being increased on any card, players should be compensated for the loss of stones and coins spent on upgrading those cards. I had just finally gotten enough fusion stones to bump up my frosthexers to level 4. I feel a little cheated.

> _Originally posted by **[AngryTurtle98](/forums/941638/topics/1595248?page=3#12573641):**_ > > _Originally posted by **[AzazeL___](/forums/941638/topics/1595248?page=3#12571857):**_ > > Yeah, as someoneone with lv5 frosthex, I accept that 2mana is necessary, it just helps to keep a surrounding 7-8 damage combo in check. However I've always found the whole "freeze" ability abit of a joke when push & pull just ignores frozen enemies. But surely if freeze did keep an enemy frozen, we genuinely would loose any sense of strategy with our boards just clogged up via all surrounding freeze cards making Ubass and Needle 10x more useful. > > If the biggest concern with Winter decks was the 7-8 surrounding damage with the whisp/MWC combo, or even the slightly less FH/Whisp combo, the correct way to balance that would have been to either increase the Mana on the Whisp or reduce the damage it does. Aggro users have a lourder voice than any one else due to their being the majority. Devs catered to them by making it easier for the to rush in the early game. > > From a monetary stand point, crippling Winter decks would make them a lot of extra cash by forcing Winter players to switch factions and level up new cards. At the very least, if Mana is being increased on any card, players should be compensated for the loss of stones and coins spent on upgrading those cards. I had just finally gotten enough fusion stones to bump up my frosthexers to level 4. I feel a little cheated. So you're saying Winterpact is more profitable to the developers? You say the *correct way to manage winter * would be to increase Wisp's mana, but no, FrostHexers needed a look in cause a 1mana surround Freeze is OP. Anyone can hit rank1 with Swarm lv3-4 which is not in the Dev's interests. Compensation to players for exploiting a card's potential is not the way to go either as theyve just been takig advantage of an apparent OP card , 1 mana surrounding freeze is a strong, effect.

> *Originally posted by **[AzazeL___](/forums/955764/topics/1595248?page=3#12573730)**:* > > _Originally posted by **[AngryTurtle98](/forums/941638/topics/1595248?page=3#12573641):**_ > > > _Originally posted by **[AzazeL___](/forums/941638/topics/1595248?page=3#12571857):**_ > > > Yeah, as someoneone with lv5 frosthex, I accept that 2mana is necessary, it just helps to keep a surrounding 7-8 damage combo in check. However I've always found the whole "freeze" ability abit of a joke when push & pull just ignores frozen enemies. But surely if freeze did keep an enemy frozen, we genuinely would loose any sense of strategy with our boards just clogged up via all surrounding freeze cards making Ubass and Needle 10x more useful. > > > > If the biggest concern with Winter decks was the 7-8 surrounding damage with the whisp/MWC combo, or even the slightly less FH/Whisp combo, the correct way to balance that would have been to either increase the Mana on the Whisp or reduce the damage it does. Aggro users have a lourder voice than any one else due to their being the majority. Devs catered to them by making it easier for the to rush in the early game. > > > > From a monetary stand point, crippling Winter decks would make them a lot of extra cash by forcing Winter players to switch factions and level up new cards. At the very least, if Mana is being increased on any card, players should be compensated for the loss of stones and coins spent on upgrading those cards. I had just finally gotten enough fusion stones to bump up my frosthexers to level 4. I feel a little cheated. > > So you're saying Winterpact is more profitable to the developers? You say the *correct way to manage winter * would be to increase Wisp's mana, but no, FrostHexers needed a look in cause a 1mana surround Freeze is OP. > > Anyone can hit rank1 with Swarm lv3-4 which is not in the Dev's interests. Compensation to players for exploiting a card's potential is not the way to go either as theyve just been takig advantage of an apparent OP card , 1 mana surrounding freeze is a strong, effect. One could claim that a 3 mana toxic sacrifice is even more OP since it actually doesn't need anything unique to combo. Frost Hexers + Midwinter Chaos is the competing combo in my mind, and that was a 4 mana combo, now it's a 5 mana combo. I'm not against increasing the cost of the surround freeze from 1 mana to 2 mana, but there needs to be another 1 mana winter unit and possibly a mana cost reduction in midwinter chaos (with damage reduction to keep it neutral balance change).

I agree that something winter can use use as an alternative to F.Hexers for 1mana would be nice just to keep up in early game, maybe next lot of dragons can help or a dwarf unit.

> *Originally posted by **[AzazeL___](/forums/955764/topics/1595248?page=3#12574325)**:* > > I agree that something winter can use use as an alternative to F.Hexers for 1mana would be nice just to keep up in early game, maybe next lot of dragons can help or a dwarf unit. Yes. I'm not hopeful about this, though, especially as an f2p player. I'm not certain that i want to stick with the game anymore. The buffs to Swarm... enough said. It's not a strategy game anymore.

> _Originally posted by **[IronPompey](/forums/941638/topics/1595248?page=3#12574556):**_ > iron clad was meant to be increased strength at higher levels. actually level 4 now spawns 4 bots rather than 5 is this a mistake? Having purchased upgrades to get to level 4 then had it taken away is quite annoying. What if i buy more upgrades? I cant be sure that i get to use what i purchase? It's kind of ruined my deck.... > > im not sure how i feel about purchasing something and then, after real money has been taken, having the deal changed and being given something else instead.... I had to work through this head game too!!! I had saved up fusion stones for a month and a half (needed 33 iirc) to take Crimson Sentry from L3 to L4. Believed the shift from bordering to surrounding would take my deck to the next level... Anyhow, the day after upgrading is when they announced revamping the card and poison as a whole making the card completely useless :( Having dumped a few hundred dollars into the game over the previous 6 months, I sent a letter to support hoping the could set the card back and return the stones - basically reverse the transaction. Got back a “sorrry, not sorry you’re SoL” type response. Very upset at the time... Still pretty salty. But obviously I am still here - lol. I do enjoy the game a lot, just not nearly the pure loyalty advocate I used to be for Stormbound.