Yeah, my NGU levels also exploded like crazy at some point relatively recently (checking things I've said in old posts... looks like it's been almost 2 months since I started challenges (although a big chunk of that has been my casual full day rebirths in runs that start as laser sword challenges even though the actual challenge part was completed in well under a minute every time)), even with leveling in the NGUs being brute forced with tons of energy and magic from equipping a bunch of accessories that boost the caps instead of focusing on NGU speed accessories. Only the two slowest eNGUs and the two slowest mNGUs are still at less than a million levels. (NGU Magic NGU is at about 975k, NGU PP is at about 250k, NGU Energy NGU is at almost 500k, and NGU Adventure Beta is at about 181k.) Fastest eNGUs each have over 14.8M levels and the fastest mNGU has over 10.2M levels. Seems like not that long ago that it would have seemed unimagineable to ever get any of them up over a million levels (although I forget where they were at when I started working on challenges). My challenges done so far, for reference: All basic, troll, and laser sword challenges are fully completed. No rebirth is at 10/50. No aug, 24hr, 100lvl, and no equipment have each only been done once. Blind, no NGU, and no TM have all not been attempted at all yet.

If you've done last troll in 23 minutes, why not more challenges at once? It should be relatively quick with your stats. Or do you hold on until you get more achievements, to get the most from AP rewards?

Ok .. I just threw a little over 1e34 gold into the pit, and got this doozy : "The Pit belches and it smells awful" There is nothing in the whole world and the dog about this message, except one post from 2018 in Bugs forum, where someone complains about getting this message all day. What does it mean - 'epic fail' in the pit RNG ?

Pretty much, it's a rare occurence where you get absolutely nothing. The only "plus" side, if you can even call it that, is that it's very rare.

> *Originally posted by **[armzzz](/forums/984525/topics/1831965?page=6#13225386)**:* > Ok .. I just threw a little over 1e34 gold into the pit, and got this doozy : "The Pit belches and it smells awful" > > There is nothing in the whole world and the dog about this message, except one post from 2018 in Bugs forum, where someone complains about getting this message all day. > What does it mean - 'epic fail' in the pit RNG ? According to comments on the wiki, it means that you would have gotten three Wandoos levels, but you've already gotten all 100 of the Wandoos levels you can get from the Pit. (It can also mean that you threw less than the minimum amount for the category that had been pre-selected for that throw -- but the highest minimum is 1e15, for Wandoos.)

> *Originally posted by **[armzzz](/forums/984525/topics/1831965?page=6#13224979)**:* > If you've done last troll in 23 minutes, why not more challenges at once? It should be relatively quick with your stats. > > Or do you hold on until you get more achievements, to get the most from AP rewards? > More like I've just been lazy / casual / inefficient about this. (Although that does get some productivity in with time spent killing titans, leveling NGUs, etc.) And I find rapid rebirths to be too tedious / annoying for me and it makes me feel burnt out on it. Like I blasted through those first 10 no rebirth challenges pretty quick. Last completion time was 31 seconds. So that's like half and hour or so right there since you have to be 3 minutes in to be allowed to rebirth. But I just needed a break from it by that point because it was too much. I'll be working on blasting through several runs of something else soon. However much I can stand it before I need to take a break from it again. I don't usually think to even look at the achievements or to look at the exp and ap rewards on the challenges. Let's see... 135/153 achievements done, which is 4925/5825 BP, which is worth +49.25% AP gained. Missing achievements are 12 of the EM stats related achievements (it looks like at least one of those might not be too far away, actually) and the "69 lol" achievement (should be easy to get but I just haven't taken the time to do it) and 3 of the rebirth achievements (I'm only at about 1/3 of the way towards what the next one asks for) and the achievement for entering evil mode (I supose in theory if I really cared about scrounging for every last bit of BP here I could just do this and then immediately return to normal mode? but... meh) and one other achievement... Is this other one for instakilling (on manual kill, not autokill) The Beast? (checks wiki) Oh, this one's just Walderp, I think. (Should be easy at this point. Just need to turn off autokill and idle mode for one of the times that he spawns.) > *Originally posted by **[slay0mithos](/forums/984525/topics/1831965?page=6#13225510)**:* > Pretty much, it's a rare occurence where you get absolutely nothing. > The only "plus" side, if you can even call it that, is that it's very rare. I don't know about it being rare. (Or I've just had horrible luck.) I've seen multiple streaks within the last couple months where I'd see that message for 4 or 5 money pits in a row.

For me it started appearing after my pit's wandoos reached 100 and I did get it about as often, but I remember that when I talked about this on this forum back then some people pointed out that they did get it once in a while without having their pit's wandoos to 100, so I'm not sure which it it but getting it more than 2-3 times a week should be bad luck. The whole "in a row" thing on the other hand is potentially an exploit or a bug of some sort, I am also fairly frequently getting chains of 3 to 5 times the same thing in a row (sadly it tends to be the equipment level up, when I no longer have anything to level up, but it is a lot more visible with outcomes you don't want). I have no clue how to consistently get it but it looks like you can break the chain by saving and reloading, so if you save before the use of the pit and it starts doing a chain you could in theory break it like that (I'm saying "looks like", because it's still possible you roll the same thing no matter how low the probabilities are since that's how probabilities work).

Yes, for me it is the maxed Wandooz levels from pit (now L300 total). I wouldn't mind few chained equip-level increase events though. :)

Got my first quirk (baby MP) from major quest. So far 5 quest items maxed, working on Dakota now. After the baby quirks, are there any must-have ones? Also, getting the 54 or so quest item drops seems much longer than 30 minutes to me. I have 110% drop chance. How can I speed it up (maybe sacrifice non-NGU speed acc for +respawn? That would be Greed + Stapler for 28% respawn, swap for BaldEgg + FannyPack.

I'd definitely go for beasted boosts and the seed quirk. Since it's multiplicative even some lvls help to boost these stats a lot. Some points into the gold quirk would also be helpful. And of course E/M stats, if you have a lot of quirkpoints ;)

Yeah, the 30 minutes is just a very, very inacurate time that I use when I need an idea of how long I'll need per quest. If we take 110% drop chance, 2s respawn and 54 items, the formula from the wiki gives us roughly 45 minutes (when getting the drops manually). I am assuming the 110% is the number from the quest screen and not just the equipment, which means you have a few things you can do. Heroic sigil level 100 gives 10%, equipped orange heart and ascended x4 pendant each give up to 10% at level 100, so those have a pretty big impact on your drops (it should give you a total of 132%, which lowers the expected time to around 38 minutes. Respawn items have a more subtle effect since it's multiplicative but with numbers less than 1, meaning that the decrease is usually nowhere as big as what you could expect by seeing a somewhat big number like 28%. It does help, no doubt about that, but you sacrifice a lot of progress in NGU and other features to get that, so it's usually not really worth it. Still, since it lets you clear major quests faster and get back to your normal things faster as well, it's something you will have to experiment with and see which way gets you results you can be happy with (it depends on how many major quests you do in a row, how active you are at using the items and handing the quest on time without wasting too much time getting more drops). For perks you have the 7 "baby's first" to keep you occupied for a few days, after that seeds, boosted boosts, gold, potentially beard (I got access to the quests after my beards had high enough bars to cap for 24h including the bank so it was useless to me but it might give you a fairly nice boost) and the EM stats should keep you busy for quite a while. You could also probably add the wandoos ones when you are in evil mode, the fruit growth speed is nice since it doesn't force you to push your rebirth a few minutes every day (it's not cheap, but the first level alone cuts 24 minutes from a rank 24 fruit so you exchange 3000 QP for more flexibility in your rebirths), but everything starts to be really costly at that point so you'll probably have a good idea of what you want.

Finally got the Ax4, so that's 115.5% quest drop chance. Emperor Looty is nice boost too. Regarding fruits - L24 Pomme, FoK (with both perks), Gold, L23 FoA, rest L10 or lower. But I still get limited amount of poop - and with the questing forcing me away from ITOPOD, it will be even lower. Which fruits do you consume with poop - Pomme, FoK ... what else?

Those two fruits should be enough when you have a limited poop income (the phrase is so weird...), fruit of gold is nice to level up diggers but a few days of difference should not make that big of an impact overall and fruit of adventure requires a fairly high "base toughness" (the one shown in your exp screen) before it gives all that much anyway.

Should it be 'out-come' , when we talk about poop? I actually so far harvested Gold fruit for seeds .. maybe with L24 it might be usefull to get some digger boosts. FoA got me around 5k last time I think. I recall reading somewhere Iron Pill gain is based on FoA gain - what relation is there?

Iron pill is based only on the amount of blood (blood^0.25), the result is directly added to the "base" for the 4 stats. The adventure stats from money pit rewards and fruit of adventure also get added to those "base". So the "base" power, toughness, hp and regen that you see in the exp screen are the result of all of those. And the fruit of adventure uses base toughness (and only that one) in its formula before giving you the stats for all 4 of the stats. The wiki's formula: https://ngu-idle.fandom.com/wiki/Yggdrasil (T^1.5) × Poop × BaseToughness^0.2 × NGUYgg × EquipYggYield × FirstHarvest Base power and base toughness both get that amount, base hp gets 3 times that and base regen gets 0.03 times that (1/100 of what HP gets). The power 0.2 applied on base toughness in the formula does mean that the effect from it is not going up as fast as base toughness. The "easy to understand" way to see that is that the result is multiplied by 10 when the base toughness is multiplied by 100,000. That being said, even with well over 2 billion base toughness I am only earning a few million adventure stats from the rank 24 fruit of adventure (with first harvest, poop and all of the yggdrasil accessories I have access to on top of 700 million and 550 million levels in NGU yggdrasil, normal and evil respectively), increasing base toughness definitely has a noticeable effect in the long term but unless you write down the numbers you usually won't notice it too much each time you eat it.

So e.g. when buying adv. stats for EXP , is it preferable to buy more T over P/other (or even put all EXP into toughness)"? ( too bad adv digger doesn't increase FoA gain, like PP digger does with Rage ) Also - is there any way to find out the cap on drop chance for Ultra-Rares ? I have over 2e6% drop chance total and still cant get regular drop of BEASTs liquid.

It's only better if you want to focus on the fruit of adventure or need to raise the cap for the infinity cube. When you eventually are forced to buy adventure stats in bulk (around godmother and the exile right now, so you still have time left before you don't have much of a choice) you will probably need to buy a bit more power than toughness, and you'll most likely be forced to at least put a portion into regen (since auto kills require a certain amount of regen as well) or you'll end up in a situation where you lack power to reach auto-kill when your toughness already reached the required amount. > too bad adv digger doesn't increase FoA gain, like PP digger does with Rage It both does and doesn't, adventure digger is a multiplier applied to your adventure stats, so it doesn't multiply what is added to the "base" but it does multiply the total so it also multiplies what was added from the fruit. > Also - is there any way to find out the cap on drop chance for Ultra-Rares ? > I have over 2e6% drop chance total and still cant get regular drop of BEASTs liquid. You might want to have a look at this page: https://ngu-idle.fandom.com/wiki/Adventure_Mode Mysterious purple liquid has a base of 0.002%, and because it's still before the formula change you just multiply this with the total drop chance you have from your stats breakdown (and divide by 100 because both are percentages). 0.002 x 2 E+6 / 100 = 40%. In theory each version has the same "cap" on drop chance but I'm not sure about how it specifically works for the beast. But it should still mean that on average you should be getting it around 4 times every 10 kills of that version or higher of the beast.

Farming Beast V3 now regularly, L24 apple L73 painting. FoK FoA FoL L24, with poop FoK gives over 400k exp now. PP - started with Banks 2 (McGuf from ITOPOD seems not usable yet, I rarely get to 5000 kills because of questing / manual beast kills). Quirks - all baby, seed maxed, gold 14/25. Also I'm now on boss 287 , so slowly inching my way towards 301. Any tips for early preparation on evil diff?

You will need a fairly big multiplier for attack and defense to be able to get your time machine and then access to the first adventure zone in evil. For that reason, the stats for rich jerk perk in itopod as well as the attack/defense for rich jerk in the exp screen are your best bet. The good thing is that they will help quite a bit for the remaining challenges, and the 24h challenge is less painful when you divide it in 3-4 separate times (you will probably be able to go back to it after farming the first evil titan's set from its first version for example). Itopod macguffins are different from the other zones, the amount of kills left before a drop is saved, and you even get some from the offline time so it's very much worth it.

I wonder how my own road to evil mode is looking? * Got all Beast v1-4 drops L100 and fully boosted (oh wait, correction: the small gerbil isn't fully boosted yet), and got almost everything from Chocolate Zone up there as well. Energy Bar Bar and Magic Bar Bar are only about halfway done though. (edit / side note: L39 Ax4 pendant and L87 King Looty available to equip, L28 Ax4 pendant and L82 King Looty in daycare) * Got very little left in perks that can still be bought in normal mode. I'm missing the last level in each of the bank V perks. I haven't grabbed the inventory merge slot. I suppose I could look at Fibonacci (to whatever extent that will be worth poking at before evil mode). And I haven't yet touched stat boost for rich perks II or adventure boost for rich perks I. * Got what seems like a lot that could still be done in quirks before evil mode. I'm at level 25/1000 in both stat boost for rich quirks I and adventure boost for rich quirks I. Got the rest of the first row plus Beast's Seed maxed, at least. Haven't touched Beast's Fertilizer (it's expensive and I'm not sure that it's even worth it). There's no way I could save up for the macguffin slot at this time (although I already have enough slots to equip everything I currently have at the same time anyway, so I'm not concerned about that). The bank I quirks are complete but I haven't touched bank II at all yet (and they look so expensive still). All of the generic quirk I for energy/magic power/cap/bars are all only at level 10/50. * First page of fruits are all at tier 24. Second page has tiers 19, 6, 4, 3, and 2. 2520% drop chance bonus, 170.39% power fruit delta bonus, 193.8M% power fruit beta bonus (when active), and 239,770% number bonus (when active). * Beard permanent bonuses look like: 159,254% attack/defense, 370.48% drop chance, 1,200.46% number, 184.78% NGU, 1,997.42% wandoos, 585.38% adventure, and 3,293.29% gold. * Got a 135.856% bonus to all diggers from their total levels. * Got over 25M levels on fastest energy NGUs and over 415k levels on slowest energy NGU. And I've got over 17M levels on fastest magic NGU and over 314k levels on slowest magic NGU. * Base stats: 41k / 2B / 82k energy stats and 20.5k / 1B / 41k magic stats. Also base adventure stats are a bit over 2.3M power / toughness and 6.7M max health and 80k health regen. * The attack and defense "boost for rich jerks" in the exp shop are both at 400k%. * Challenges: basic, troll, and laser sword are all finished. no TM is at 5/10. no equipment is at 5/20. no rebirth is at 30/50. All others are at 1/x. (Such an annoying grind trying to knock these out!) * Macguffins: Levels on the macguffins themselves are mostly around 160 or so on all of them, although the augment one is over 220. The total bonuses built up from them so far are within a range of 125 to 145% for a lot of them, but the gold and attack / defense bonuses are each around 250%.

Outside of the challenges everything seems good enough (quite a few things are even higher than the "norm" at that point). The problem with leaving absolutely all of the challenges to the end like that instead of doing a batch near beardverse, a batch near beast V1 and a batch near beast V4 (for example) is that it leaves a massive pile of them that can be discouraging (especially the 80 clears of the 24h challenge). The ones that remain and that you can't skip are the no rebirth (they shouldn't even be a formality at that point anyway), no NGU (you will need all of the NGU speed you can get for evil NGUs and it will help for the normal ones as well) and 100 levels (the ability to tell all of your boosts to end up as special boosts is massive with the values needed for evil equipments). The rest is nice (having auto-boost to 15 minutes, the daycare work faster, the augmentations be both faster and stronger, more exp from titan and more GPS from the tine machine), but they won't hinder your progression that much. Anyway, it's not like evil mode is a definitive choice with no ability to go back, you could always try it for a few days and see how fas you unlock the time machine and the next adventure zone.

> *Originally posted by **[slay0mithos](/forums/984525/topics/1831965?page=6#13231601)**:* > > Anyway, it's not like evil mode is a definitive choice with no ability to go back, you could always try it for a few days and see how fas you unlock the time machine and the next adventure zone. basic / troll / no rebirth / laser sword challenges all finished, all other challenges each at 5 completions Base stats: 53k / 2.15B / 106k energy stats and 27.6k / 1.13B / 55.2k magic stats. Trying out my first dip into evil mode right now. I'm about an hour into it. I rebirthed at about 20+ minutes and then at about 30+ minutes (probably should have waited for 30+ minutes the first time as well for the power beta and number fruit bonuses... but oh well) and I've just unlocked Evilverse. I'll kind of need to wait on some advanced training levels to be able to start getting any kills, but I unlocked it and it seemed to go relatively fast. Edit (8-9 hours later) : Got started on collecting some of the gear a couple hours ago. (Haven't seen a chest yet though.) Also got started with a bit of leveling on the evil NGUs when I started this several hours ago... Couple hundred levels in each of the faster ones by now, but it tapers off quickly from there. The last two in each seem to be too slow to worry about at all at this time. Edit (sep 17) : Do titans (GRB through Beast of course, I'm nowhere near the nerd yet) drop PP? Have they always done that and I never noticed or is that specifically a bonus for evil mode? Because I haven't been in itopod at all these last couple days while farming evilverse gear and I've noticed that I have gained PP from somewhere that wasn't itopod, and I don't think what I've gotten from fruit of rage accounts for it. (side note: currently got amulet, chest, and weapon at level 100 - rest are between 79 and 97 - been going at this with drop chance accessories equipped the whole time and it gets me something like a 2.5% drop chance from bosses, or about 3% with a "lucky charm" consumable boost running - I think I'll jump back to normal and knock out some more challenges after I get these pieces all to level 100)

Maxed Choco set, both bars, and PowerPill. Gerbil L67. Now working on buffing the items + maxing gerbil. Atm. my NGU setup is: - crowbar, slimy helm, stealthiest armor, choco pants, slimy boots - regular tie, special ring, utility ring, voodoo doll, dorky glasses, magic bar, power pill, gerbil With this I can cap M-Ygg and M-Exp, which having progress in other NGUs. It seems Choco set is more Energy-sided than Slimy set. Do you setup the NGU accessories + items to balance the M/E ? . . Also, I have McGuff spell Alpha and fruit Alpha now. Only 2 slots though (L73 drop-chance, L43 gold). I don't see getting more than +1 slot from PP, because AP need to be spent for red/green heart and +acc slots - 3 slots tops for long time. Which McGuffins would you level in the beginning?

For maximizing gear effect, recently someone posted a link to a site that you would probably want to at least give a look to: https://gmiclotte.github.io/gear-optimizer You can set your highest zone, highest version of titan, highest looty/pendant and amount of accessory slots (to determine the pool of gear you have access to), then your priorities for that loadout, and let it show you what would maximize what you asked it to. You can us it to compare various loadouts as well. The only potential problem is that it also includes the non-accessories, so you will need to be careful that your adventure stats don't fall too much from that. > Also, I have McGuff spell Alpha and fruit Alpha now. Only 2 slots though (L73 drop-chance, L43 gold). > I don't see getting more than +1 slot from PP, because AP need to be spent for red/green heart and +acc slots - 3 > slots tops for long time. > > Which McGuffins would you level in the beginning? The macguffin spells are not going to bring all that much, but the fruit will definitely be giving you quite a few levels. What I did was dedicating the first two slots to energy and magic power, and the next two to the NGU ones. The reasoning being that those were the ones that could have the biggest impact, both for fast returns and for the long run. Either way, macguffins take quite a while to level and even then they only give a fairly marginal bonus until you use them for a few months at least, so keeping one just because it's already levelled is not a bad idea either.

Maxed/buffed all Choco/V4 gear, and 1k bonuses. The gear optimizer is great. It seems the regular tie and utility ring are now past usefullness (at least with 8 slots). Using Slimy helm over Choco, to balance E/M NGU. For the evil conditions, I might go all EXP for rich jerks, as I need PP/QP for banks etc. PP: now 6600 progress per kill - need complete first 3 lines exc. rich, shadow, boss exp (missing double training, quick number fruit, wand-lover, imp cube, 68/100 adv-train = 364PP), also L3 banks (650PP - got 4 levels in gold). - got: harvest, 2 dig, 1 guf, imp guf drops1, itopod guf, imp itopod guf1, blood guf alpha. - anything else? QP: 117% reward mod - first line all exc. stat/adv boosts, plus beasts seed. Now leveling gen EP quirk 1. - do you prefer leveling gen E/M quirks, or rather banks / something else?