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I want to mention to the Kongregate devs/staff and Sirlin if he's reading this that you should pay attention to what Sausaletus says. He knows his stuff, and what he says is worthy of consideration (note: you don't have to listen to him, but at least consider it). He’s at a similar level to Mario when it comes to feedback. How do I know this? I've read more of Saus’ posts and comments then you'd care to know, and he has all the traits of someone you should pay attention to. I’m no Kongai pro (see Mario for that), but I do try my best with what I do, and what I’m saying here is no exception.
- Bruce
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Okay, I've said a lot already so I'll stop straining against the character limit. But, here's what I think about the state of balance at present:
Problematic cards (Cards that need an overhaul):
-Rumicans (focus on field control, fix Eviscerate)
-Anex (focus on field control)
-Helene (needs to be more like Ashi or more unlike)
Cards that need a tweak (Cards that need one or two minor changes):
-Higashi (Tone down Chi Blast)
-Tafari (An innate that punishes actions but doesn't prohibit them)
-Zina (Better innate)
-Phoebe (More damage on Kick so more of a threat up close)
-Solomon (Needs to "get stronger as the battle goes longer" better)
-Ambrosia (Blood Ritual)
-Le Morte (Needs more threat or to be more efficient)
Cards that are just alright by me (Cards that require little to no attention at the moment):
-Amaya
-Onimaru
-Yoshiro
-Juju
-Popo
-Ubuntu (Maybe his buffs proc whether he hits or not. Maybe.)
-Andromeda
-Ashi
-Constantine (Maybe raise the cost of Hypnotic.)
-Vanessa
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Here's a minor issue that bothers me: Won/Loss records treat 3-card and 5-card as the same. There is a difference. In which case it should be reflected in the rankings. And, if not, then why have two separate formats? But, I'd think there's a big difference between entering a match with someone who's won 100 times in that format and one who's won a 100 in the other. And maybe even with someone who's split their time between them. Even something as simple as seeing the percentage of games that a player spends in 3-Card or 5-Card could be useful.
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@Hyung re: single-player
It's Ubuntu, the Elder you're talking about right? You can choose your deck in Single Player but it has to be 5-Card (At least, I can.). There's no 3-Card option. Which, yes, would be nice.
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@the Quaker Oats spokesman re: depth
It is indeed decided on the basis of a few cards. That's good because it narrows the potential decisions faced by newcomers. Instead of presenting them with hundreds and thousands of options, varying by slight degrees, they can select from a few clear ones. Some of which are bound to appeal to them.
This is a problem only if some of those cards are strictly better than others in which case those options resolve down to two - playing what works and playing with handicap. And how many beginners are going to have the understanding of what works to know that? This is why game balance is so important. not every card can be equal in all situations but the ideal is to flatten out the imbalances so that, overall, no one card rises too far above the pack and there's an actual dilemma over which ones are best. If the answer is "Depends on your playstyle" then the designers are doing the right thing. In a tasty way of doing it.
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Of course, the discussion of starter cards is moot if earning and unlocking cards is easier than it is now. If you only get one designated card a week then Starter cards are crucially important. If you can unlock one after every match then who cares?
I suspect the final rate is going to lay somewhere in-between to the point where it's going to be a slight concern to a starting player and rapidly decrease if they keep playing. So the worry is the outright rank beginners who come into the system clueless. As the game goes on longer the average player skill will only rise and that makes poor initial choices that much more of a handicap.
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@Einar re: starter cards
I should have said, but didn't because of the dread max character limit, that match-play wouldn't be available until you'd created a deck. Hence, players with enough cards could set up a deck and jump into Multiplayer. But those who don't would be assured of having some familiarity with the game and its mechanics before making an irreversible choice.
Starter cards are for those people who don't have cards. People who have enough cards to fill out a deck or three can do whatever. What concerns me are people who have no cards, have no what they do, but want to try the game out. Having a bunch of such noobs running around the actual game and clogging up the matching system is frustrating for them and isn't fun for everyone else. Unless you think stomping on noobs to increase your rating is a great time, of course. If you don't, then channeling the uninitiated towards some practice sessions with the AI is for the best.
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With regards to picking solid cards .... we'll simply need to point out which ones to pick and make good suggestions in the comments section for the newbs. We can leave suggestions for cards to pick and why and then let people make choices based on that. Doing that will also provide some insight on what items/chars people deem most valuable and that info can be used towards balancing the game further.
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okay here's something else to take into consideration. When you get poisoned by an attach like Poison dart, it should wait to apply the poison damage until after you make your own attack. Poison = slow acting damage!
-I had 23 hp left and I was attacked by poison dart for 21 damage, than because I was poisoned, I got another 5 damage, killing me before I was able to make an attack that probably would have forced a draw. Instead, I lose. If the character is not killed by the main attack, they should be able to attack before they die.
-After the pioson takes place, it inflicts damage after the player attack, as it should.
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Hmm, it looks like when Utulu (sp?) hits enemy with Staff and gains additional damage, it does not display on his attacks. I've also noticed something funky with resistance not being calculated correctly in reducing damage but I cannot replicate the issue. Also, you cannot choose your deck in single player. Ok that's it for now. Thanks!
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gingerben: They updated all the healing items in the last release but haven't changed the cards yet.
http://www.sirlin.net/kongai-beta
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Yoshiros' Innate does not show up properly. Herbal Remedy card didn't go away. Mouse-over revealed and it stay. So I couldn't see any details of anything else after.
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@Salusetus
That's way too complicated. Just let people choose their starter cards at any time would be fine. If they start off with zarro cards, they can still play Random - All Cards matches until they get a feel for what works and what doesn't.
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After Message saying Deck name has to be unique, the background to the message is pure graphics. If you misclick, you may accidentally remove one of your cards. Not a big deal, but an annoyance. Also, when choosing card, then items. You can not turn the chosen cards over to see their abilities. I had to unchoose them, then flip them.
3 Card Single Player?
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@Zakid
Same here. We'll have a chance to re-pick when the game is released but it's still a pretty lousy mechanism and I'm more worried about the people who'll be picking for the first time at release. A better way of going about it might be to have the Single Player mode open at the start and restrict new players to random play there until they can win a few matches. Say, the first three times they beat the computer they get a starter card to unlock. From there, they can do whatever. But, as it is, players are locked into choices before they get a real chance to play the game. That's only going to lead to a lot of complaining and frustration.
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I realized that it is actually a stupid idea to choose three starter cards at the beginning, when you probably do not have the foggiest idea which one is better and which one is worse. My choice was rather haphazard than considered and now, after couple of games I can say that it was really bad.
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@ galcohen:
the game seems to be designed with multiplayer in mind, and i forgive the game for not having such good AI, because it excels at multiplayer
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Awall1990: That's the point. The core gameplay element in Kongai is predicting your opponent's actions. It's a game of psychology and deceit, and if you don't like that then this probably isn't your game.
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yeah, there's still a few cards that are overpowered, even though most of them are equal. I'm pretty sure everyone knows my opinion on tafari and close range character nerfs.
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There is a fundamental lack of strategic implementation on the part of the player. Who at a certain level must simply guess which move his opponent will not counter. The result is a back and forth game of "If I want to do this, my opponent wants to counter it, so I will counter my opponent's counter, but IF he knows that I know what that he is doing that, I should change my plan."
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At first I had slightly disappointed with the game. It was good, but I was expecting something incredible, since Kongai was advertised so much. However, the more I play, the more I like the game. It really requires great strategy and forces you to try to predict the opponent's next game. Also you made a great job balancing the characters. At first I was thinking that some characters, such as for instance Cornelius are more powerful than the others, but once I got better I realized that all the characters are practically equal and the secret of building a powerful deck is picking characters that work well together. Certainly the best CCG I have ever played and probably the best game on Kongregate:)
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Little thing that should needs putting in: On Deck Builder mode once you place a card in your deck it can't be flipped to look at stats and attacks which should be changed,
and @ dadalone: If it doesn't let you change range your energy is probably too low.
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ive noticed something critical that should be added.... a function for replays to be viewed and also observer functions :)
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Very well done. The graphics and battle system are more than satisfactory. But there's no way to tell what takes presedence when you are attacked and heal yourself in the same turn. I also suggest that there be an optional music selection in battles. Since the battles can be short, I understand why there could be none.
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Good game, it needs time to study all the cards, anyway it's too slow, can't understand why in the maneuver phase I just can pass, sounds useless.
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I found something that is really bugging me, when your enemies card is in battle and your looking at his attacks, you cant tell what kind of attacks they are (ie. physical, light or dark...) unless i just cant see it
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aenh: cornelius is balanced as it is , because juju IS a good character , but speed is surely his weakness... higher cost means taht his weakness will be lesser, making he more overpowered mthan he actually is.
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Two things that kinda bug me are the animations being done for health and such, after it happens, and not while. Another thing that bugs me is when you're editing a deck you can't flip a card if it's in the list of cards on the bottom.
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say Butuka, any idea why I had leaf trap at the beginning of the combat? I think I had left-overs from a previous fight
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awesome, just fix the health and make some animations or something, like when the guys get hit, overall great game, cant wait to see the next card,
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Really small thing that will probably be put in anyway but no cancel button on the 'Host Game' menu which would be nice to have.
Also I've noticed that the health and energy bars seem to take everything into account that will happen that turn and jump to it at the moment, they should move to the number as it happens then have have the number jump before the next action happens or something similar.
Also (I don't know if this is a bug or a feature) but if you use an attack that attacks all enemies and the other person switches cards, the card that is switching out is excluded from the damage, and either way i think that attacks that hit all enemies should hit all enemies even if they have just switched out.
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Great game, only thing I could find is in the lobby for multiplayer, the times go up at the same time, rather than a complete minute for each one.
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Good beta at the moment but some things could do with improvements:
1. HP number could go down when the bar goes down
2. the More Info text could be placed lower so that it does not get in the way of the skill text
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and sry for next post but i remember 1 thing ... cant u realy make some animations on hits , deaths , skills ? it will be perfect , and yeah sound will be good ...
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it will be good to observe other games ... dunno , me - as a newbie player :) i want to watch some games , some decks and etc. and i thing some cards are overpowered but i wont tell them atm :P still i cant see where can i look my status ... wins , loses ... anyway most of battles are mostly based on luck ... about criticals , dodge and so on :P
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I'm not sure if this has been raised, but certain sound effects play at inappropriate times. Example: the sound made when a character dies, plays right after both players made their choice. It should only play after the death blow has been dealt.
Great game though! All hail Dave Sirlin!